Accuphase or McIntosh ss power amp for Khorns?

[PrestonTom]

RE: The above comments about Accuphase against an Adcom.

The comparison is a funny one since a used Adcom 545 sells for about $200-250, while an Accuphase would be astronomical in price.

As a side note, For the price, the Adcom 5x5 series is a good one and I have used them with Cornwalls and K-Horns (the bass on the later Adcom 555ii can be quite good with a K-Horn). But they are not quiet amps, and this can be a problem for high efficiency speakers.

Anyhow, I am glad the Accuphase is working for you

Good Luck,

-Tom

[GWSmith]

Thanks Tom and NewMount for your input on the Adcom... I believe I will give it a try using my old Marantz 4140 preamp to drive it (Adcom 545).. The 545 is 100 watts per and I believe it will take a 2 ohm load.. Apogee Scintillas anyone?-- Oops, thats a 1 ohm load, yikes!! []

.Gary

[maxg]

Thanks Tom and NewMount for your input on the Adcom... I believe I will give it a try using my old Marantz 4140 preamp to drive it (Adcom 545).. The 545 is 100 watts per and I believe it will take a 2 ohm load.. Apogee Scintillas anyone?-- Oops, thats a 1 ohm load, yikes!! []

.Gary

That is Electrocompaniet territory - I recall some of their amps will happily drive a 0.5 ohm load. Not that it is relevent but if you want to see the limits of Accuphase try them with Final 0.3 hybrids. They, too, go down to 1 ohm and an accuphase will shut down driving these at any kind of volume (I know - we did it).

Actually we shut down an E211 with a pair of Quad 988 speakers and they "only" go down to about 2 ohms....

[GWSmith]

Yes MaxG...

To digress still further from the topic (sorry), I found some very interesting reading last night concerning Klipsch however, some nice photos of Paul including his detailed obit.. I did find a great site on Apogee speakers and some older reviews from the magazines still available for reading. They had a smaller model Krell amp shut down with the Scintella ! A larger model however, WAS up to the task.

ON TOPIC.... Isn't the Mac MC-250 a great sounding SS amp which was designed to `model' a tube amp? I was watching those on eBay for a while, and they were bringing in around $500.

All from here...

..Gary

[NewMount]

Can you also let us know how your new Accuphase compares with your old Luxman, overall, as well as in the treble, midrange, and bass? I've heard great things about Accuphase, but I'll never lose affection for the Luxmans and Macs that are past.

I've had McIntosh tube amps, Dyna tube amps, Marantz SS, Luxman SS, Yamaha SS and NAD SS ..... In the midrange and treble, the best sounding were the McIntosh and Dyna tubes... Overall, taking the bass into account, the best sounding was the Luxman. The only one that sounded bad with Khorns was the Marantz SS, 80 wpc, c 1973 ... It was a bit hard and harsh, compared to all the others. I don't know why. If I wanted to baby tubes along, and if I wasn't a bit OCD, I'd go for the warmth of tubes in a minute ... but the reliability of SS helps me relax (pitiful, I know). The NAD 272 is fine, and almost as warm as the Luxman L 580, which self-destructed a few years ago and is beyond repair, according to someone who took $40 to tell me that.

I have now had the Accuphase A-45 for a couple of months. A comparison between my old Luxman M-03 from 1992 and my new Accuphase A-45 Class A power amplifier would not be fair, since the M-03 probably retailed for around $2000 and the A-45 costs $7000, but here you go: The A-45 is much more transparent and detailed, but never sounds harsh. The A-45 has a warm, sweet sounding treble, whereas the M-03 was a bit grainy in comparison (although the overall sound of the M-03 is warm as well). The class A operation of the A-45 should mean low distortion. As for the midrange, they both sound good, but voices are incredible with the A-45. You can hear every breath, every layer of vocals. The bass of the M-03 was powerful but lacked the control of the A-45. Some say the Accuphase is bass shy, it is not, it is bass correct. When there is slam and punch on the recording, the Accuphase delivers just that. I listen mostly to rock music and I have high demands on dynamics and punch. With the A-45, I can play really loud with crystal clear sound. Obviously, this is mainly thanks to the efficient Khorns, but the low distortion of the A-45 should have something to do with it. Unless I play really loud, the A-45 just delivers milliwatts to the speakers (but great sounding milliwatts). Not every SS amp sounds good before the first watt. A truly great feature of the A-45 is the gain control. You can set it at -3, -6 and -12 dB. I have set it at -12 dB. It is not a potentiometer, instead it switches between different gain stages (three variants of the first amp stage with different gain). This reduces residual noise of the power amp (very quiet at -12 dB), as well as residual noise of the preamp. It also allows you to use more of the range of the volume control of the preamp (and thereby more of the dynamic range of the preamp). Perfect for the 104 dB Khorns. The M-03 has input potentiometers, with which you can reduce gain and residual noise of the preamp. However, they cannot reduce residual noise of the power amp. The noise of the M-03 was clearly audible, although it was not higher than for any normal amp. At the moment, I'm very happy with the A-45. It's hard to imagine how it could sound any better. Perhaps an Accuphase preamp (C-2810?) would improve the sound further, but my current system sounds great so why upgrade...

Overall verdict of the A-45: crystal clear, sweet and punchy.

Overall verdict of the M-03: warm and powerful.

Generic statement #1: efficient speaker + inefficient amp = audio nirvana. It takes about 200 watts to produce a few milliwatts of incredible sound.

Generic statement #2: Klipschorn + Accuphase = Happiness.

A few years I ago sold my old homebuilt horns, thinking that I would get a "real" HiFi sysem (as you know, horns are not considered HiFi), and got a pair of Infinity bass reflex boxes and a Rotel monster amp. Sure, it was a good system and may have sounded more HiFi than my old horn system, but it lacked life, it had no soul, it didn't fill my body with music. Those were gloomy years, but now I'm happy again.

[IB Slammin]

Accuphase.

Yep.

[Duke Spinner]

Crown Studio Reference ...

for half-the-price []

[maxg]

Excellent report - nice to see someone interested in how a system plays at low volume for once.

Funny thing - I remember going to listen to a system at a high end store a couple of years back with Tony. We listened at pounding volume till my head hurt and he was ecstatic with how it played. I then rested control of the remote from him and lowered the volume about 20 dB. Suddenly it was less than impressive. He was simply amazed I did a test at low volume - it had genuinely never occured to him to try it.

I really think you have nailed the benefits of the Accuphase higher end models here - when in a properly matched system they play superbly across the volume range from pp to FF. To be fair Macs are not bad at this either - but I think this is where Accuphase really scores.