Chorus II vs Cornwall I (another perspective)

[stormin]

Just to give folks another opinion if they are on the fence as to which my be better suited for their listening habits.

I recently had a family tragedy(fire) which put me in persuit for another pair of my beloved Klipsch speakers. I've lived with Chorus II's for nearly 18 years in a few different rooms. My listening habits are basically classic rock to modern rock with a little metal thrown in for good behavior. I usually listen at low to medium volumes just due to family respect and my ears. But on occasion I do throttle it up. Yes, I was one of those guys when I was younger had one of the car systems that would take you breath on each hit. So this comparison may be more for the headbangers out there than the normal folks[]

Here are my findings after about 2 weeks with living with the 1978 Cornwall I's (thanks Bill H). Now granted I do have a set of new BEC B type crossovers that I haven't installed yet. Also my room is 18 x 22 with vaulted ceilings and the Corns are on the short wall near the corners. About the same as the Chorus II's were positioned.

The Cornwalls at low to medium volume have a fullness to them. And actually I find the mids subdued at these volumes compared to the Chorus. Not in a bad way just seems to be more natural. The cymbals are very realistic. The bass is a nice solid tuneful bass. These aren't one thump and done type speakers. The soundstage is huge on the Corns. Descent depth but I think equipment plays a huge part in that as well. I get a great image from such a wide baffle. These things definetly fill a room with music. Now where the Cornwall starts to slip is at higher volumes. The mids become grainy the bass becomes a little sloppy. The term Duke uses is a rumble to them. It appears that different recordings do make for different results though. The snare has a great impact(SLAM) with the Corns.

The Chorus at low to medium volumes has such a flat bass response that its hard to tell if its in there. These are lean mean machines. The mids are absolutely much more forward on the Chorus. My opinion is the Chorus wins in pitch definition. But again this is with agressive music and high volumes. The Chorus is a smooth speaker just titled in the frequency response more towards the mids. One thing the Chorus doesn't do is get sloppy. I've had 425 wpc into them and they wanted more and just kept pounding. So for heavy rock n roll my opinion is the Chorus doesn't have anything to worry about in the competition. But then again I haven't put 425 wpc behind the Corns. They just sound too good they don't appear to need it.

Bottom line is headbangers might want to pick up a pair of Chorus II's and folks who just love music Cornies all the way!

[oldbuckster]

Your writing will mean NOTHING once you install those Crossovers ............. I'll tell you the same thing I told Bill, put those crossovers in, and prepare for your jaw to drop .................. Yeah, BEC knows crossovers, and tweeters, ... BEC makes good sound Better !!!!!!! .... Write again after a couple of days with the Crossovers installed ................ You'll see, I mean hear !!!!!

[colterphoto1]

The passive radiator will give a more 'tuned' bass response and the Tractrix horn should be more open and detailed. Chorus II is a further generation evolved from the CW. The wider motorboard on the CW has a bit to do with it's soundstage as it tends to project the music forward a bit imho.

Spot on comments.

So are you unhappy with the change to Cornwalls?

[Daddy Dee]

stormin,

sorry to hear about the fire.

thanks for the review.

I'm looking forward to hearing what you think after getting in the new crossovers.

[billybob]

Still looking forward to hearing CW's, and my Chorus still likes the watts. Thanks for your take, and ongoing review(?)!

[BS Button]

The passive radiator will give a more 'tuned' bass response and the Tractrix horn should be more open and detailed. Chorus II is a further generation evolved from the CW. The wider motorboard on the CW has a bit to do with it's soundstage as it tends to project the music forward a bit imho.

Spot on comments.

So are you unhappy with the change to Cornwalls?

Makes you wonder why they didn't put a tractrix in the "new" Cornwall III?

BS

[stormin]

So are you unhappy with the change to Cornwalls?

At this moment it would be pretty hard to let them go. I am enjoying them immensely. They are what I would call a very "seductive" speaker.(Or is that how Stevie Nicks makes all speakers sound?)

[stormin]

stormin,

sorry to hear about the fire.

thanks for the review.

I'm looking forward to hearing what you think after getting in the new crossovers.

Thank you.

I will be sure to give an update.

[colterphoto1]

The passive radiator will give a more 'tuned' bass response and the Tractrix horn should be more open and detailed. Chorus II is a further generation evolved from the CW. The wider motorboard on the CW has a bit to do with it's soundstage as it tends to project the music forward a bit imho.

Spot on comments.

So are you unhappy with the change to Cornwalls?

Makes you wonder why they didn't put a tractrix in the "new" Cornwall III?

BS

I can say it now- yup, I always thought it shoulda been a Tractrix in there. Staying with exponential (not even the 601 but the Heresy's 701) was not keeping up with the times. The tweeter and mid driver were new, what's the harm in updating the horn?

[stormin]

I can say it now- yup, I always thought it shoulda been a Tractrix in there. Staying with exponential (not even the 601 but the Heresy's 701) was not keeping up with the times. The tweeter and mid driver were new, what's the harm in updating the horn?

But then it wouldn't sound like a Cornwall. I find that is part of what draws me to them.

[DrWho]

I can say it now- yup, I always thought it shoulda been a Tractrix in there. Staying with exponential (not even the 601 but the Heresy's 701) was not keeping up with the times. The tweeter and mid driver were new, what's the harm in updating the horn?

Well if you think about it, PWK was an avid supported of the tractrix in his later days. I wonder if it wouldn't have been more in his legacy to update the lineup to the latest state of his research? I could see it going either way really, but I'm sure the people making the decisions knew him better and went the route they felt was more appropriate.

I also wonder if the expense of bringing back the line wasn't at the forefront of the decision too. New drivers that already existed were used because the old ones weren't being used anymore and it'd be too expensive to tool up for the outdated drivers. Also, I'm sure going with a single squawker mold was a lot cheaper than going with two. Even with all the cost savings, I wonder how long it'll be until the initial investment is paid off?

Anyways, I've always been a bigger fan of the Chorus II...though I don't think I'd say the headbanging is my own biggest reason, lol.

[oldbuckster]

Install those crossovers ................. your view will change !! Simple job, even I did mine ...... your missing some great sounds !!!!

[Jeff Matthews]

Yep! Back in the day, I had Corns, and my best friend bought Chorus. Corns outdo the Chorus. Chorus are very good, so this is not a slight on them - after all, they are a notch down the line on the money scale, too. I'd never rate Klipsch for their ability to make headbanger metal sound good. They just don't compete well in that market. Honestly, metal sounds horrific on them.

I was showing-off my KHorns to my younger nephew and his buddy, both of whom like that cra... er, metal..., and I have to admit when we put the metal in, I was almost embarrassed. It sounded so harsh, I could not open the throttle. I promptly handed back his CD and said I don't know what a person can get out of that kind of music. I turned the flaw against his music. Klipsch and metal.... no se puede.

Stormin', if you want to try a track on those Corns that will knock your socks off, listen to "Carnaval/Let the Children Play" on Santana's Moonflower album. You never heard your Chorus do what the Corns can do, and those 2 back-to-back tracks will show the tell-tale difference. Your heart will skip a few beats out of fear and excitement where Carlos sustains that guitar note for about 10 seconds. Fear? OMG, will flames start coming out of my equipment? Excitement? OMG, I can't believe it sounds so good!

P.S. These tracks are a good latin jam with lots of excitement and percussion. You can watch poor quality videos of them on youtube. But wait 'til you hear the real McCoy on Corns. Get the real McCoy! (The rest of the Moonflower is just as great, BTW, so the purchase would be well worth it. It could likely be one of your next favorites that you play over and over. It rocks!).

[stormin]

Yep! Back in the day, I had Corns, and my best friend bought Chorus. Corns outdo the Chorus. Chorus are very good, so this is not a slight on them - after all, they are a notch down the line on the money scale, too. I'd never rate Klipsch for their ability to make headbanger metal sound good. They just don't compete well in that market. Honestly, metal sounds horrific on them.

I was showing-off my KHorns to my younger nephew and his buddy, both of whom like that cra... er, metal..., and I have to admit when we put the metal in, I was almost embarrassed. It sounded so harsh, I could not open the throttle. I promptly handed back his CD and said I don't know what a person can get out of that kind of music. I turned the flaw against his music. Klipsch and metal.... no se puede.

Stormin', if you want to try a track on those Corns that will knock your socks off, listen to "Carnaval/Let the Children Play" on Santana's Moonflower album. You never heard your Chorus do what the Corns can do, and those 2 back-to-back tracks will show the tell-tale difference. Your heart will skip a few beats out of fear and excitement where Carlos sustains that guitar note for about 10 seconds. Fear? OMG, will flames start coming out of my equipment? Excitement? OMG, I can't believe it sounds so good!

P.S. These tracks are a good latin jam with lots of excitement and percussion. You can watch poor quality videos of them on youtube. But wait 'til you hear the real McCoy on Corns. Get the real McCoy!

Hi Jeff,

I wondered when you would chime in with all this Cornwall talk. I will have to give that a listen.Thanks for the tip. Installing some new crossovers at this very moment.

But you have it wrong about Chorus II and metal. With my Marantz 2325 that went up in flames as a pre and my QSC 2422(425 wpc rms @8 ohm) I got a very warm yet detailed sound and the bass was a sledge hammer. Haven't heard heavy metal sound so good. But as for these Corns they are making me enjoy the older classic rock music that I have loved for many years. The seperation is unbelieveable. They say the tractrix is more detailed but I'm really not buying it and I only have about 18 years with the tractrix. This exponential horn has some kind of uncanny way of drawing you deep into the music. I am actually listening to the music and not the equipment. So heck yeah the Cornies get a big thumbs up!

[Jeff Matthews]

Hi Jeff,

I wondered when you would chime in with all this Cornwall talk. I will have to give that a listen.Thanks for the tip. Installing some new crossovers at this very moment.

But you have it wrong about Chorus II and metal. With my Marantz 2325 that went up in flames as a pre and my QSC 2422(425 wpc rms @8 ohm) I got a very warm yet detailed sound and the bass was a sledge hammer. Haven't heard heavy metal sound so good. But as for these Corns they are making me enjoy the older classic rock music that I have loved for many years. The seperation is unbelieveable. They say the tractrix is more detailed but I'm really not buying it and I only have about 18 years with the tractrix. This exponential horn has some kind of uncanny way of drawing you deep into the music. I am actually listening to the music and not the equipment. So heck yeah the Cornies get a big thumbs up!

I was posting about metal and Corns and KHorns. From my experience there, I might attribute the same flaw to Chorus, but I could be corrected. On the flip side, maybe my PMS just gets worse with metal. I like Black Sabbath and that sort; I'm cool with that. But Motorhead and whatever else.... Can't take it.

I really do hope you try those tracks. You'd be the first here, beside me, to review them. The Moonflower album, BTW, is a double album. Just totally great, through and through. Excellent, excellent, excellent production quality. A mix of live tracks (among a mix of studio tracks) that, surprisingly, are equally excellent. The two I recommended to you are live. And they sound sooooo... good! I have a hard time understanding why this album remains so obscure. Michael Colter has it and has spoken highly of it. I think he said it is one of his faves.

But the two tunes I recommended.... Just get your hands on those for a taste, and let me know what you think. I'll buy you a double cheeseburger if I lose the bet. I bet you get hooked on that sustained note and go back over the song a few more times, tweaking the volume knob a little more, and more.... Trust me, it is so loud and clean - I mean CLEAN - that you'll scare yourself while acting on the urge to just see how loud you can go with it. It never cracks up. The production is top notch all the way.

[oldbuckster]

Jeff, his whole outlook will change with those new crossovers ........... besides, we must stop this Cornwall praising, they are not for everybody, and only old burnouts, only speaking about myself, with bad ears like them ....... snicker,snicker ....... I think anything recorded Live will show them off ..... Cornwalls can move some air ................... EH !!!!!!!!!!

[Jeff Matthews]

Here ya go! You too, OB.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RQDRhNUcbXE

Very poor quality, but seeing the composition, you can extrapolite to what this sounds like in hi-fi. The separation is spectacular. Bongos on the right. Tympanis on the left, etc. Note, the jam begins at 2:15. The guitar has great fuzz and is loud and clear. And if you think the jam began at 2:15, wait 'til you reach the 5:35-6:00 range. Note from 5:35-6:00 all of the percussion fills during the transition. Your Corns will just be pounding your chest with that. At 6:00, it's lights out killer!

[oldbuckster]

My SANTANA choice to show them off would be : CARAVANSERAI .................. great stuff, all Santana is good !!!!

[Jeff Matthews]

[:$] I have a confession to make. The sustained note I was mentioning is actually on "Dance Sister, Dance." This is also on the same album.

Here is a poor quality youtube link. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nm0tcsjKMmU&NR=1

Keep in mind, these youtube versions were of the same band, but not the ones that actually made the cut and went to album. They are slightly different (but slightly). The album is of such superior quality to these youtube clips, I am almost afraid of discouraging you from trying the album tracks.

Anyway, the sustain note that I mentioned is at 5:19. By all means, do not forget to listen to all the percussion that is just pounding away in hi-fi at you while all this is going on. It is so GREAT!

[Jeff Matthews]

This song's on there, too. "Noone told me about her."

This one's on there. "fl'or de Luna (Moonflower)" an easy-listening brek from the jam - beautiful and sweet - and yes, it has it's own jam, too.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pgpcpXCq3mw

This is there "Soul Sacrifice" http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oO-FeiW60eM Everyone remembers Woodstock.

This one is there "Transcendance" an absolutely beautiful song with a spiritual, tear-jerking jam. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K6nPYc5PQyY

This one is on there "El Morocco" Absolutely jazzy/latin cool. Listen to the guitar wail! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_59AYBcqxzM

"Europa" is there, live. The live version of this is better than the studio version. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TJ23aQ635WQ

"Black Magic Woman" is on there live with the add-on jam at the end. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xkiq9KgA914

I wish I could have found "Savor Toussaint," "Zulu" and "Bahia." All as spectactular as the rest. Moonflower is really one heck of a compilation.