jlantz
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Posts posted by jlantz
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I usually run movies in PIIx2 movie (believe thats the name). I definitely don't get the punch i was during 2 ch straight.
I feel like when i watch my movies I have 5-7 tweeters and a sub. I want that 2ch punch when i watch my movies.
Do you mean PLII movie or PLIIx movie? IMO, they are pretty terrible. I don't use them unless absolutely necessary (e.g., on Downton Abbey Blu-rays, because the're only recorded in 2 channel, and without PLII movie, the dialog comes from both sides, which is annoying). I've tried all possible settings on my Marantz preamp-processor, and they all sound constricted and lack punch, except "Stereo" for 2 ch music (or "multi channel stereo" if I want it coming out of the back, as well, which I don't), or "multi channel in" for SACD mulit channel music. For movies, whatever the Blu-ray was recorded in is the correct choice, almost always "DTS Master Audio" (fabulous!) or "Dolby Tru Hi Fi," excellent, most of the time. It will say on the Blu-ray box which they used to transfer the movie to disc. Your AVR should default to one of these, if you get out of PLIIx movie. I believe PLIIx movie was intended for discs that were not already in multi channel, and virtually all newer movie discs are in 7.1 or 5.1 to begin with. Any additional processing makes the sound worse. Blu-ray sound is usually great and very punchy, if the filmmakers wanted it to be.
EDIT: When reproducing MUSIC, what is commonly called "punch" often is thought to be between about 60 Hz and 200 Hz (http://www.independentrecording.net/irn/images/store/irn/freq_chart_poster_samp_732.jpg). A common subwoofer crossover is about 80 Hz, so turning up the subwoofer will only help a little with "punch" (but may help a lot if your frequency balance is bass-shy). Below 80 Hz it is more like "rumble," i.e., the low bass without the "punch." The exception would be the special effects (LFE) in movies, which often put in some artificial "punch" in the subwoofer range.
O man, so i thought PLIIx was the best. I found out my blu-ray player had a setting (default) that put out PCM audio. I changed it to bitstream and my receiver displayed DTS-MA in Straight. Way better then PLIIx. I feel like I've spent the last 4 months tinkering here and there with my receiver and i feel like i just now mastered it.
I'll have to listen to a full 7.1 blu-ray and get back to you guys. I still want another sub but i think this alone was what i needed.
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I have another question. So i mentioned earlier I was missing the punch out of my speakers. Recently i put on some music and switched the yamaha to straight (so 2 channel and sub). I felt like my front speakers came to life. I really got the punch (bass) from them i was looking for. I even had to turn my sub down to make sure they were really putting out like they were.
I usually run movies in PIIx2 movie (believe thats the name). I definitely don't get the punch i was during 2 ch straight.
In your guys opinion, is this a fact of the sound processing of PII2x movie? I have extra bass on which puts the bass to LFE+Mains. I'm pretty sure it should be applying it to PII2x movie as well? With that said I don't get the same response in PII2x as straight 2 ch.
I feel like when i watch my movies I have 5-7 tweeters and a sub. I want that 2ch punch when i watch my movies.
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Here is a picture of my living room for reference. Well half of it.
Very nice room. I see the compromise you have to make with the mantel and all.
Just for kicks and giggles, try flipping the RB-81II's over with the horns lined up with the horn on the RC-62II and see(hear) how it sounds.
I am not sure by adding an amp you will hear more noticeable bass to the RB-81II's with them being at a much higher plane than your ears. Those woofers must sit a good 10 to 12 inches above your ears. If you were able to tilt them forward a few degrees you might notice something.
Bill
Ya, I didn't even think about flipping the 81's. My concern then is it might be 'cut' by the mantel. It's probably hard to see but there is a good 1.5-2 ft of mantel from the 81's to the edge.
I just got my system really dialed in recently. I think I may listen to it before making any decisions but I'm kind of leaning towards just getting another SVS PB-1000 and maybe get a slightly better yamaha like the A840. Give that a shot and see what I think. I gave my wife a heads up I may spend another couple thousand.
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Here is a picture of my living room for reference. Well half of it.
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First of all thank you all for the replies. I've been watching this like every hour on my phone but wanted my laptop to reply.
Nice system! How do you like it? No i think your system is adequite without a amplifier. If if all channels were being driven it may not be ideal but i think what you have should work fine. Also if you bought a different receiver with preouts the amp section would likely be beefier as the mid and higher grade models offer pre-outs. A different receiver itself might be a nice upgrade for you down the road. You have caught a case of upgradeitis my friend.
I'm loving my system. I came to this forum originaly for some advice on upgrading my speakers. The main problem i had is I started a system at an apartment. Then I moved to a house and had to get rear speakers. Then the front speakers were to small. Then i got new rear speaker stands and the RB-51s looked too small on them. So i bought RB-81s and put the RB-61s in the back... It was a vicious circle. I wish i could just do it over
In that room, I would add another PB-1000 long before I added an amp..
Good call. A second sub, or trade up to a single more powerful sub would improve your experience. The sub takes the load off your speakers...and amps and will bring you noticeable improvement.
I'm perfectly happy with the sub output. Definitely way more power there then i need. I like loud bass but I've had to run over to turn it down during a couple movies because its so loud i'm worried about my neighbor getting pissed.
Your receiver is not under powered for your current speakers... However, it sounds like your whole system is too small for your room. (based on the questions you're asking).
RB-81's are very nice BOOKSHELF speakers... And will sound great anywhere. BUT, they will not (even in a 5.1 setup) fill up a 25' x 25' room with big sound/volume. And sitting 12-15 feet back doesn't help.
You would have been much better off buying a pair of RP-280F's and a better spec'd AVR to start with... and then building on that 2 channel setup as you could afford to add pieces to it.
From where you're at now, making sure all your current speakers are set to small in your AVR (and crossed at 80Hz give or take), will let your sub do the heavy lifting and make the best use of the power your receiver currently has.
If you want to upgrade what you have... you could start with an amp, but you'll need a new receiver or pre/pro to use it. But I'd add another subwoofer first and then look at upgrading your front 2 speakers with a larger pair of floorstanders and move the RB-81's to surround duty.
Then you could look at a different AVR with better "all channels driven" power. Or look into a separate 5-7 channel amp and preprocessor.
Lots of ways to go... How much do you want to spend?To your point GP, when i originally started buying components I really wanted towers. I just can't have them without it looking good in the room. My room has other compromises to the sound system as well. My couch faces a fire place with a TV over it. I have bookshelf on either sides and a mantel that runs the length of the room. So the RB-81s and RC-62 sit on a fireplace mantel about 4 ft high. I tried putting my bookshelves on stands in various areas in the front and it all looked bad. That was my attempt to visualize what towers would look like. The wife won that battle.
I originally had the speakers all set to small. I've been playing with my receiver a lot. I have the RB-81s and RC-62 set large now and sub crossed over at 80 hz. Currently i use DPIIx Movie or Music with extra bass on which I believe cuts the low freq sounds to LFE+Mains.
Like I said I don't know if it would help or not but what I'm wanting is more punchy bass from the speakers themselves. I may be wanting something thats not possible? I've also been reading about clipping and didn't know if that was a potential problem.
The more I've read about receivers it looks like finding anything that outputs anywhere near the claimed outputs is possible. So I don't think I would notice anything just going to the RX-A840 like mentioned above?
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I notice a huge improvement going to Emotiva amps from the Yamaha receiver. I sold my Yamaha RX-V2700 which was 130 x 7 for reference, the addition of an outboard amp was hugely noticeable. Headroom and reserve power for the big bang sequences in HT are powered by the amps ability to provide that extra oomph. Not a chance that the Yammy keeps up with the Emotiva amps. For regular listening of music and low volume HT you won't notice but for the "experience" it will show, no doubt about it.
Here's an idea. Emotiva offers 30 day in home, so you can decide whether you want it or not. Take advantage and demo it A/B with and without the amp. If you are unhappy send it back. No questions asked.
Tim
Tim, I like your style! Plus I think I can sell it to the wife in this form
I'm thinking you might have done something similar!
I looked online and I could get a RX-A840 for 500 bucks and sell my current. Now i'm freaked out though... Does the RX-840 out 100 w into 7 ch or 2 ch. Yamaha seems to have slightly deceptive advertising and I can't tell.
Under overview: Which i think is really saying 100 w output 2 ch with 7 total channel output. In the specs sections it has it listed as 100 w x 2 ch
- 100 W x 7-channel powerful surround sound
- This is the specs section:
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Hey Guys,
I recently built my first real home theater setup. I'll list the components below. My overbearing question is do I need a powered amp. Well its a little too late for me to question this as the receiver I bought does not have pre-outs. I also didn't know when I bought my Yamaha that they rate in 2 ch. I know super noob of me.
This is what I understand so far. I know Klipsch speakers have an extremely high sensitivity requiring little amounts of power to drive. I also know that it usually take little wattage to actually drive speakers at what could be considered normal listening levels for movies and music. I read on the emotiva forums that some people with Klipsch setup noticed a slight difference but not a huge difference. There setups were not really the same but close to mine. I'm worried that my receiver is under powered for my system. On the other hand I would be looking at roughly 600-800 to sell my current receiver and also get a 3-5 ch emotiva powered amp.
What are your guys thoughts and experience?
Here is my system...
Yamaha RX-V677 if i recall it outputs 105 w in 2 ch
Belkin PureAV conditioner
RB-81 ii fronts
RC-62 ii center
RS-42 ii sides
RB-61 ii backs
SVS PB-1000 sub
My room is aprox 25 ft by 25 ft and i sit about 12-15 feet from the tv and front speakers.
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Thank you all for the help!
I ended up going with the RB-81s and the RC-62. I also picked up a Belkin PureAV used with the RC-62. It was in good shape for $100, thought it was a good deal.
I also cut the shelf to the left and right of the RB-81s in the picture so they fit flush. I'll try to post some pictures soon, I got a new TV as well
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Kind of high priced since they could be found for 400$ new before discontinued but still not retail. So not that bad.
Yup thats the guy I was eyeing on eBay as well. I have a center right now as well so I'm in no huge rush. However, I've been known to get a buying itch every once in a while. 2 day shipping doesn't help...
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Owned the 440 and the 62ii. 62ii is better in every way. Except size I guess in this case.
Valuable feedback none the less though. I would not have expected to hear that. Well, that means I'm playing the waiting game for one to come up used. The one on this forum for sale is already spoken for. The guy that has the set near me doesn't want to piece out at this time. O well, i may get itchy and buy one new for too much money at some point.
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Beautiful front wall.
Very nice. Will an RC-62ii be too tall?Well, this next week I'll be getting a new 65" TV. The TV on the wall right now is a 58". The new 65 will actually only be a inch or so taller (thinner borders) but it gives me more wiggle room to mount the TV lower on the wall. The RC-62 ii would fit, its just even taller then my RC-52. The RP-440C on the other hand is about an inch or more smaller then the RC-52.
I also just pulled the trigger on Amazon for the RB-81 ii's. They have them for 250 each, I've been watching them for some time and never seen them cheaper (new).
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I actually tried to buy the RC-62 ii but couldn't find it anywhere online. When i did find them for sale, they were being priced outrageously because no one had them in stock. So that basically crosses them off the list unless someone knows where to buy them?
Right here.
Klipsch RC-62 II Reference Series Center Channel---Mint with original box $350.00
Bill
So, i also found a local guy that is selling a whole set. He may be willing to part it out but I'm not sure yet. I think I'm going to pull the trigger on the RB-81 ii. I'll see if there are any dealer this black friday.
I'm still unsure on the center. I could get a used RC-62 ii but then its bigger which defeats my original intention. Maybe if the used price is good I'll jump on it.
The picture of my room should now be attached. Now you can see my center channel size problem
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Welcome to the forum. My suggestion too after reading through your list is that the RC-62 or RC-62ii would be a better match. It's a much better speaker than the RC-52ii.
I've owned both the RB-61 as well as RB-81. To my ears, I was VERY impressed with the quality of the RB-61. It just sounds so full and clear, especially for a relatively small bookshelf speaker. For some reason, I wasn't as impressed with the sound of the RB-81. I also helped a friend purchase a pair of RB-75....now that was an amazing bookshelf speaker. It's like a mini-RF-7.
If it were me, I'm not sure I would upgrade from the RB-61 to RB-81. Do you have any room for a floorstanding speaker? If so, lots of great deals can be found on Craigslist.
FYI....Klipsch didn't make an RB-52ii.
Assuming you meant RB-51ii. Can you post some photos of your room?
I tried to upload a picture but couldn't figure it out. I basically have a 25x25 foot room with 9 ft ceilings. The front has a build in and mental that stretches the width of the room. I'm planing on cutting the shelf so the rb-61 ii or rb-81 ii fit flush in.
Anymore opinions on the RB-61 ii vs RB-81 ii.
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Welcome to the forum. I know this won't help as size is a consideration, but you'd be better off with an RC 62ii as your center than the RP 440. The 62 was built for the speaker line you have, while the 440 is built for the current RP line. Not to say it can't work, but you may notice the difference. In my opinion the 62 is also a better center then the 440, but maybe someone else feels differently.
Just a thought...
I actually tried to buy the RC-62 ii but couldn't find it anywhere online. When i did find them for sale, they were being priced outrageously because no one had them in stock. So that basically crosses them off the list unless someone knows where to buy them?
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So I just built my first home theater setup which consists of the follow components. All are bookshelf speakers. (just in case someone thinks I maybe missed an RF designation).
RX-V677 Yamaha
RB-61 ii (fronts)
RC-52 ii (center)
RS-41 ii (side surrounds)
RB-52 ii (rears)
SVS PB-1000 sub
The system is a mixture because i was buying the speakers on sale when the newer models came out.
I'm thinking of buying another pair of RB-61ii or a pair of RB-81 ii and a RP-440C center. My new system would be...
RX-V677 Yamaha
RB-81 ii or RB-61 ii (fronts)
RP-440c (center)
RS-41 ii (side surrounds)
RB-61 ii (rears)
SVS PB-1000 sub
I would retire the RC-52 ii and RB-52ii upstairs to another tv.There are two driving reasons for wanting an upgrade none of which have to do with poor performance. I have my rear speakers on 36" high stands. I bought new ones recently that have a bigger speaker plate. My RB-51s look a little goofy so i thought it would be good to get bigger rear speakers. The RP-440c has less height then the RC-52 ii center, meaning i can get a slightly bigger TV and the center has less height to get in the way.I'm wondering if the RB-81ii are overkill. I believe i read somewhere that the sub should take care of all low frequency so having a 8" driver is pointless. They are also bigger (more obtrusive) and obviously more expensive.I also am in no ways an audiophile, just your average joe with expensive speakers. So i listen to a mixture of music usually in 7.1 instead of straight 2.1 and movies in 7.1.I would love some input on my current setup and what you guys think of my upgrade plans. Cheers!
Assuming you meant RB-51ii. 
Wall speaker placement help
in Home Theater
Posted
I'm currently renovating my downstairs that is already wired for 7.1. The problem is the wires they ran are near the top of the wall next to the ceiling. I was planning to buy Klipsch cdt-2650 speakers since the tweeter and driver can be angled down. I just measured depth though and the rears only have 4" and the sides only around 2.5". That would leave me with the slim line that doesn't have angled tweeters or woofers.
My ideas are as follows.
Remove the sides or use the slim-line. The current placement and wiring or the sides cannot be changed without lots of rework which I'm not willing to do.
For the rears I could make a 1/2" to 3/4" spacer out of wood to use the cdt-2650s or I could move the wiring lower to do in-wall Klipsch speakers which are 3.75" deep. Last option would be just using the slim line again but they would be near the top of the wall. I need to paint and I'm good at wood working so the spacer is not a concern to make.
What do you guys think?
My fronts are RB-81s and a Klipsch in wall center. Yamaha receiver and emotive amp for the RB-81s.