cc1091

Nope Bluesteel, I'm not purchasing Heresy's, I already have used them for nearly twenty years. Abused they are. They at least need new enclosures. I have long ago give-up on the so called bass woofer in the Heresy's as being useful for much of anything (except creating bass in the neighbor's apartment, or down the hall). I listened to Forte's long ago, perhaps I have them confused with the Chorus, but I didn't think they were overall a better speaker than the Heresy. Yes, more bass. Yes, their mid and HF drivers are located in a better place with respect to the average listener. The enclosures seemed cheaper though. The more I think about it, the more I have come to the conclusion that there are only a few combinations of bass driver designs that will work well with a horn unit. Many of these configurations, Klipsch has already tried. They have marketed the more successful ones. Listening to my KSW-10 last night, its hard to imagine that I spent money on this unit. It certainly does nothing well, but does have some depth relative to the Heresys. I still have weeks before I will implement or abandon this idea, so keep the ideas rollin'

Hehe.. fortunately (and also unfortunately) the ceiling in my living room is vaulted so what starts at 70hz on one end may not end up at 70 hz on the other.. I have often wondered if a bass driver in a properly engineered volume like this would do to the rest of the building. Certainly could give those noisey neighbors a reson to be a little quieter. djk - Nope, the mid and HF parts (and perhaps the crossover..modified) are the only pieces I would reuse from these speakers (alhough I would probably keep the signed and dated backs too in case for some reason in the future the world ever actually ran short of old Klipsch Heresys and they became collectors items). Still haven't forgotten your offer of a suggested design though. Your proximity to my nearest workshop makes it certain that the finished product will be in CR whenever (and if ever) it gets built.

PS. I don't think my neighbors would be very happy if I played my B&W's loud enough to produce any noticable sonic coupling between the two speakers. Perhaps I'll get the stands after I move into a house.

fidshimmer - another post like yours and they definitely WILL be cut up and not necessarily rebuilt into anything! And for the last time..they definitely are not for sale. Go find one of the other ten gazillion used Heresys. Hell two of the major bars in my hometown used them as their house speaker system purchasing them by the tens, surely they would be willing to sell you some of their smokey old Heresys. Hmmm..I wonder how many decibels I could improve the midrange unit by if I took off the driver unit from the midrange horn and attached a pipe sealed at one end, filled with black powder and stuffed wadding into the other end of the pipe..lit the fuse...and ran. I guess that would be a little more than 106 db.

OK..everyone looking to purchase Heresy's either jump over to e-bay or order some from the factory. I've been able to get almost twenty years of good music out of them, and I'm looking to get a few more years of use out of them no matter if they stay in a similar refurbished form, or if they are hacked up for firewood. They're not for sale. (however the KSW-10 I would consider selling - but you can contact me privately about that matter...let's stick to the subject here and leave the sales stuff for cheesier web sites). Yes, Heresy model 1 = thin bass. Heresy Model II = better bass. I do agree about the classic ported subs though (such as the KSW-10, etc). They don't often match well with horn loaded designs (and the KSW-10 didn't match well with my B&W 602s either). djk from my hometown. I think I know who you are (at least the D&K initials are familiar). I believe I have seen (and heard) a pair of hybrid subs of your..suggestion, that a friend built. Dimensions are about 2 feet, by 1 1/2 feet by 3 feet. Three ports. Two 12" drivers (that my friend changed to 15" drivers..and also did some +/- stuff with the drivers, all of which I feel was a mistake) mounted facing each other. Oops too many details already. He is driving the subs with one Adcom (535??) 200wpc AMP and has four B&W 602s (two per channel) handling the upper end driven by another ADcom 200 wpc amp. These subs worked very well with the B&Ws and also worked well when they were used with my Heresy's (although there was only one Adcom at that time and the Heresy's were being driven by my now semi-retired NAD 35wpc amp). Anyhoo..Impressive work. Not sure how I would combine heresy horns with these though.

I too have had the perception that most of the newer models suck compared to the heritage series. In my post thirties, I finially decided that the Heresys I own were no longer serving my ears well. Too raspy, very little bass, is that some distortion that I hear on those CD's? I purchased some B&W 602s as replacements. Their drivers are incredibly detailed and the price was close to what I paid for the Heresy's nearly twenty years earlier. Great speaker for its size, but the soundstage and volume of sound is no where near the Heresy. I looked high and low for a better speaker, finally giving in to listening to the Reference RP-3 series. WOW. If the B&W's could only push its sound out, away from the speaker toward my ears and add nearly overwhelming bass, they would sound like these new Klipsch. If I were to design these speakers, I would cut down on the "overwhelming-ness" of the bass, replace that cheesy looking copper color aluminum midrange speaker with something that looks more sophisticated, but has about the same tonal and range characteristics (yup, I tried the B&W Kevlar driver in place of the aluminum unit on my RP-3s, but it had the wrong tonal qualities to work well <not to mention impedance, etc> ). Turning the bass waaay down though, and sitting back, with my eyes closed, they (the RP-3s) are an impressive speaker. Cleaner than my heresy's in the upper end. Smooth throughout the whole range (except in the deeper bass), than any of the heritage speakers that I remember (Heresy, Klipschorn, Cornwall) I would like to compare them with the Chorus. I think the Chorus may be better. (Why did Klipsch stop building that incredible speaker?). I think in volume of sound, these older speakers could beat the RP-3 and RP-5, but at least for these two, I think they are overall superior to all the older speakers (possibly excepting the Chorus). Just my opinion... Although..Nothing beats the sound of a tree being felled playing back through the Klipschorn (memory from circa 1983 with a Perreaux Amp and Preamp, Nakamichi Dragon). Something about that punch that you can feel in your chest and gut and vibrates up through your esophagus. Stunning.

Yeah, I know those subs are pretty skimpy..that's why I dumped the whole B&W with sub idea and bought back into Klipsch with the RP-3's. The RP-3's are the other extreme when it comes to bass...nearly overpowering. If you listen with my ears and look at my price range, there are no really good speakers out there right now. As good as the RP-3 and Rp-5 are, they don't match the Heresy for sound volume or sound field (although they do a pretty good job). No, until a better speaker comes along, I'll stick with my RP-3s for my mains. The B&W is still an incredible little speaker too. They're both cleaner sounding than the Heresy (even the newer ones I've heard on similar systems), and the B&W at least does a good job of pretending to have a deep bass. Th crux of the matter is that my Heresy's need a new skin no matter what. I also suspect they could use some updating with the internal components (although everything works, I just wonder if some of the distortion I hear when comparing them to my newer speakers can be cleaned up). Finally, improving the bass without completely oversizing the box would be ideal. Of course I was thinking about the speakers from AvantGarde (www.avantgarde-usa.com) when I originally allowed this crazy idea into my head. Not that I want to build one of those monstrosities. Some brave departure from the classic Heresy would be interesting though. A powered sub would be an easy way out of a lot of math and guesswork. I have also thought about using the horn units with a transmission line design similar to the old IMF speakers of the seventies (http://www.t-linespeakers.org/classics/TLS80/index.html). Obviously though, this would require some critical calculations and a redo of the crossover network. And I must also add that I have never knowingly listened to a transmission line speaker, so I don't know if the characteristics would work well with a horn loaded upper end. Anyhoo..just Brainstorming..no need for negativism. Afterall, the Heresy was a PWK throwoff design to capture the maket of those who wanted the K-horn but couldn't even afford the lesser models. It was never a great speaker like the K-horn, LaScala, Belle or even the Cornwall (in fact that is about the best solution..resize the box to Cornwall dimensions and add a Cornwall bass driver <and network too??> ).

So call me crazy, but I have a pair of Heresy's (c1981) that I am using as speaker stands for my rear channel speakers (B&W 602s1 - front channels are Klipsch Rp-3s). I grew tired of the brash in your face sound that the Heresy's provided in abundance. Since their purchase in 1981, I had also been disappointed by the lack of bass that these speakers have (even the Heresy IIs are lacking in bass by my ear). I did enjoy the crisp sound and wide, dynamic soundfield that these speakers provide (a point which drew me back from B&W to the Reference RP-3s I have today). I have read with interest the modifications to Heresy's that have been posted here, but have not read about anyone who has completely removed the drivers and reassembled them into a new cabinet with a competent woofer (perhaps a powered sub?). It happens that I also have a Klipsch KSW-10 sitting unused in my living room (since the purchase of the RP-3s made it redundant). My initial though would be to get the parts of another KSW-10 and combine it with the parts from my Heresys and my KSW-10 to form a new speaker (or perhaps this is a reintrpretation of the RP-3s that Klipsch presently mfgs). Son of Heresy??? Please brainstorm with me..