ummagumma-89

Yes I'm still here asking crazy questions about topics that have been discussed. Problem is, your posts from 20 years ago don't have pictures. Braced one Tangent 500 to compare with stock and I am not happy at all. Less dynamics, and worst of all, less bass. Passive radiator isn't even close to as loud as stock, nor the woofer. So either bracing is all wrong or this technique does not hold water in this situation. I guarantee I did it wrong, so am willing to give it one more try. Pictures will be at the bottom, notice how I have braced them first of all. 1x2 oak, 2 runs front to back and 2 runs for sidewalls and "tied" all 4 pieces together with a bit of glue. Went just under the active woofer and above the passive rad. First picture I think clearly shows that maybe the brace is preventing the woofer from fully performing. I did the same on the bottom of the cab underneath the radiator. Same on top of cab but had to remove one brace from the side to side due to the squawker touching it. The foam you see is the stock foam that the t-500 comes with. From factory it is loose one on the left one on the right. A rectangle that extends from bottom of cab up to active sub. With the bracing, I cut a few slits in the foam so it could pass through the bracing. Not loose anymore, tight against the sides. A member from another forum wanted some pictures of what I did and for the heck of it removed the foam just to see. Certainly isn't any better. I planned to experiment with damping but refuse to go any further untill I can prove bracing is effective with these speakers. The stock speaker sounds beautiful compared to the braced cab, Bass is louder and sounds good (rock, hard rock, classic rock). Braced cab may have a tighter mid end, that's about it. Non braced mid is harsher up close but sounds fantastic from my couch. The cab vibrating with the music, to my ears, is coloring the sound well. So what did I do wrong? Or is bracing snake oil in this situation? Hope the people who have done this with a T-500 come forward with some information and preferably a picture so I can understand what to do. This is why I only did one so I have reference to the original and don't "convince" myself later that braced is better. Pics https://ibb.co/PDb0mPd https://ibb.co/GH5qJ9C https://ibb.co/YhFR3c2 https://ibb.co/xLKvCMm https://ibb.co/Mkp3GG1 https://ibb.co/zbTvgF1

Thanks a bunch wuzzer

Upon cracking open the Tangent-500's, there is NO foam speaker surrounds. Should I consider purchasing some? I work with automotive glass and have access to Butyl. If anyone is familiar with it, it comes on a role and used to be used to hold windsheilds in place. Was wondering if anyone has tried that Or where and what type material should I be looking at for foam surrounds for the woofer and tweets? Want to get new ones for my H2's too as they are deteriorating. THANKS!

i Purchased the B&C DE-120's in my Heresy II's. Fantastic sounding, Now I'm considering upgrading the diaphrams in the stock squawkers to compliment the new tweets. To my ears, the stock squawks sound paired with brand new tweeters. I assume they are original diaphrams from 1986. Going to try that out eventually!

Sorry I have 2 projects at once on this thread, but i braced one tangent 500 cab and am disapointed with the sound. The hi's and mid are totally different to my ears compared to the non braced. In other words, the crisp hi's are gone. I did move that foam that came in there slightly higher up though. So it may be that. I admit the bass is slightly better, but not worth losing the crispy treble. Will continue to experiment with the foam positioning on the braced cab

K very good. I like it. I will be considering it for sure if I can find them. Gentech hasnt answered me. Online says they are out of stock for all the original woofers I considered. Went back to that post and seen bob crites had mentioned that the crossover should be modified though. Thanks Randy, i'll be exploring this option too

I've heard it could sound boomy too. Problem 1 is it is easier to buy new than to find k-28's. My woofer is 8 0hms and bring me back to last night trying to figure out if my setup will allow the 4 ohm woofer or not. The last thing I want to do is strain my amplifier. I like to go A+B sometimes too. This is where I get lost

I have tried to contact klipsch and some company who supplies parts for them in canada...(can't remember the name, someone recommended me to try them the other week). Called them and they told me to email my question about woofers. Still haven't receive a response. I can imagine why. Also tried emailing klipsch to no response for almost a month. I can imagine why. Anyways, So I would in fact have to modify the crossover for the k-28 correct? Doubt I will find a matching pair. I've looked into Delta pro12a, proa lfa, Crites H2's and Dayton Audio 310-8 (Interesting because of the price) Should I be looking at resonent frequencies? Sensitivity? f11 ratings? From what I understand, the more sensitivity, the louder they will be correct?

excellent information. something to look into now. I just found out earlier today that the 5000 had different components. More interesting reads, thank-you!

I assumed he was talking about the actual crossover itself. My memory is shot. I was researching info on the tangents and came across his comment. Might have been on another forum. Something I realized immediately is the importance of forums like this for knowledge. I have been digging deep into the possibilities with these speakers on posts that are up to 20 years old. Problem is, none of the pictures everyone shared exist anymore for my generation. This is why I am trying to learn/give any information at all for the next guy who is trying to figure something out. I appreciate all of you

Being extremely new to the scene and attempting to understand how a crossover works, this is throwing a monkey wrench into everything. I was under the impression the k-28 could not be a replacement for me unless I changed the crossover. Forgive me, I am trying to figure this out The weird thing is my brand new amplifier would not feed the tweeters the H2's came with. no sound. Thats when upon further inspection I noticed the tweeters were not original. they were 4 ohm. For the record, I acquired the H2's a month or so ago and amp about a week and a half ago. The tweeters worked on all 3 amplifiers I had laying around here untill the axr-100 came in. This amp prefers A and B together to be ALL 8 ohm speakers. So why would the other amplifiers work and this one wouldnt? Would that not mean the amp goes down to 4 ohms? Any knowledge appreciated as I WANT replacement woofers for the H2's and if I can consider other impedances to "step up" the bass a bit, i'm all for it. Am aware of the cab size, but no harm in trying and not shy to consider a port like the Iv's and claudes super heresy

Are you sure the k-24-k is 4 ohm? Everywhere I look it says it is 8 ohms. Will confirm on the original one tommorow, but certain it is 8 8 ohm hi's - 16 ohm mids - 8ohm woofer is what I understood

Dug this up on the H2 "They were exclusively used in Klipsch’s legendary sy II speakers, although due to their stellar reputation, many choose to incorporate these into many various speaker systems. This woofer has the reputation of lasting forever; the cone and surrounds are made of a thick and durable fiber-composite material that has no chance of deterioration. ___________________ Specifications Dimensions Effective diameter: 12”Outer Diameter: 12 ¼�Depth: 4 ¾� Weight 7 lbs each unpacked Impedance 8 Ohms" There it is. It's not the same material. If I keep these tangents I will be considering an upgrade in the future.

Blacked out. No kevlar or whatever material the H2 had. Stamped k-24k on rear FYI that is a picture of it installed in my H2. Swapped woofer for the experiment. Besides Crites, What other woofers should I be looking at? Im at a crossroad of what to do. I am intrigued by the Super Heresy. I found 1 or 2 posts claiming the specs of crites woofer. from memory the sensitivity was 97db. Anyone know the specs? https://ibb.co/0yG45fb

I think the guy was full of you know what

Hope these picture links work All heresy drivers except the passive of coarse. 2 Loose foam things thrown in there. k-24-k's are black. no kevlar ish type material. In the process of adding extra glue and bracing to see if it is possible to get more out of them. Hunting down some interesting techniques that Moray James has tried and going to decide for myself. Anyway as you can see the crossover is a Heresy 2. Seen a post last night where a guy claimed he had crossovers stamped T-400/500. I would like to see a picture of that because from what I have gathered, they were all H2 networks. (for the 500's anyway) No evidence the previous owner had ever opened them up as far as I could guess Also signed "J S" on the top of cab. anyone know anything about that? https://ibb.co/MVtbBPQ https://ibb.co/StZGbmg https://ibb.co/FDm4VWr https://ibb.co/kS0fGQH https://ibb.co/GWGv3fR https://ibb.co/s5vdPbR https://ibb.co/2nKtRFW

Yes thats what one of my woofers look like. Mine is a 1986. The other one is black and has a tear in it. I am going to attempt to upload some pictures of the Tangent-500 interior. They have the k-24-k's too but they are black. Swapped one in my H2's last night and the original was much better for some reason. It must have something to do with that material

Also worth mentioning one of the H2's I had placed a bit of dampening in the "upper chamber". (From what I have read and seen, they came factory with foam wrapped U shape separating the woofer from the tweeters) I did the same with egg foam and placed thin egg crate foam material on roof, sides untill squawker met the U shape. bottom "chamber" has fiberglass insulation tucked loosely to walls with no thin egg foam on walls. Just for the heck of it. Placed a small amount of fiber glass in upper chamber corners just to see what it would do. Tweeters were boring compared to the other without any fiberglass in the chamber. I think its interesting to try this chamber thing out. Will continue to tinker with it. Tried to use just the egg foam above the woofer and between the mid with zero fiberglass and did not personally think it sounded any better. My conclusion is the right amount is going to be key for this chamber method

I should have, i had a feeling someone would ask. I will be opening them up again. Need to get my phone pictures to less than 2mb too. I will get those photos tommorow after work for you

heresys on floor in corner with dvds propping them up. All I have at the moment. Man opening up those tangents was hard to see. Crappy looking glue in the seams and big strings of glue hanging in the corners. Very poor quality of wood. 2 loose pieces of foam that I assume should be wrapped into a U shape and meet in the bottom of the cab. Heresy 2 crossover and components. Still confused why the H2 woofer with that weird colour sounds better.....going to swap both tangents woofers into the H2s so they match and see eventually. Going to attempt to brace the tangents and decide if I am going to keep them or not. Any Idea on the thickness of brace I should buy? Glue the braces only? Im convinced it will benefit the tangents. Possibly material too. Not much information or mods to look into regarding the tangents. Cabs are in good shape

I just opened up the tangents and put one of the k-24-k's in the H2 that had a torn woof. The non torn H2 woofer has some sort of kevlar on it. It is night and day better sounding then the black tangent 500 woofer. Can't believe it. Keep in mind I have experimented with stuffing a bit of the woofer chamber only and wrapped eggshell foam around top of woofer area on both of them. Original foam disintegrated when we took them out to change crossovers. Next step take insulation out of both, put both tangent woofers in the H2's and see. Thanks for the placement info on the T-500's. I bought them for 140 Canadian. Im considering to attempt to get the cab braced and possibly insulated. They have very little bass no matter where i put them. The H2's are beating them angled in the corner. If I can't get more from the Tangents, im considering selling them and focusing on the H2's. Thanks for the replies guys, this has been a fun little project. Will report any findings. Totally understand most of you have been on this forum for years. I am 32 in 2 days, my dad raised me with cornwall II's and have been a klipsch fan as long as I can remember. Decided to work on this setup recently and am gaining knoledge everyday. *I have been using this technics EQ and cranking the 60 db fader just to compare them FYI. EQ only goes down to 60....not sure if the H2 really could do 50 without a port. Eitherway, this is cool

Thanks sancho, currently using 3 dvd cases per speaker lol. Eitherway I only have good bass coming out of one of them because of the torn woofer. Trying to educate myself how to match up a woofer for what I want

no. very new to the the scene as you can tell

The more i think about it the more it makes sense to take a woofer from the tangents, sell them and use the money for hopefully 2 subs and place the h2s on top of them or next to them. Amp does hve a subout option but i believe it has a rediculous rolloff of 200hz. Very upset as i just bought the damn thing. Thoughts?

Extremely impressed with the bass now that they are innnnnn the corners. Wow what a difference. Tilted them, even more. Problem is I am using plastic DVD cases to tilt them. Not sure if that makes a difference. So for anyone who doesnt know, I bought them at a decent price, 160 Canadian. Found out they had the wrong tweeters in them (4 ohm Pyle junk) and a torn woofer which is black for some reason. Not the purplish greyish kevlar like the good woofer is. Still both are stamped k-24-k. Replaced with B&C De-120's for tweets ANYWAY, I have a couple questions: I am going to replace the woofers, people have suggested heresy 3 upgrades or looking for another k-24. I want to stay 8-ohms as my amp want them there and I do turn on the Tangent-500 with the H2's. Amp specifically wants 2 pairs of 8-ohm speakers together in the case of A+B (Cambridge AXR-100) I've heard about the Delta Pro 12ALFA or ProA (Not sure which would be better. Have also heard about this Dayton 310-8, which is half the price. Very interesting to me because I have a massive project list of music related things and don't have a woman to control my spending lol. I am interested in keeping the price low, and the sensitivity rather high in the speaker to get even more out of it. The DE-120 tweets and the squawker are still slightly hotter. Anyone have any suggestions to get as much bass out of them as I can (have thought about the port idea but am currently happy but maybe could be a future idea) Want to match the stock crossover the way it is i guess to save money. Almost bought L-pads to tune the tweeter and squawker down or change cap values. Not educated enough on that yet. Have crites H2 caps. Any suggestion appreciated from speaker choice with stock network to speaker choice with network modification because I feel the tuning is slightly hot in tweet and mid. Also the H2's came with a piece of foam wrapped around the top of the woofer to seperate the mid tweet chamber I assume. I had to use 2 egg shaped foam pads to reproduce that as the factory foam has disintegrated. Stuffed a bit of fiberglass in the bottom chamber only to experiment with the bass. Might take it out now that I have them properly placed to see if that is better too. What speakers have you heard of that improved the bass? I would like a bit more slam, I feel the k-24 is a bit too "middy" for my liking and maybe having a sub that only extends to a certain freq. would help? (Could be the fiberglass too) I have old bowling alley style wood floors in my listening room, wondering if a piece of carpet underneath the H2's would benefit in anyway. P.S. Anyone know of how the Tangent 500's should be placed? I kind of still like them and confused of what to do with them. (Build better boxes one day maybe) and no not interested in taking the woofs out of the tangents and putting them in the H2's. (Unless I sell the t-500's i guess haha) THANKS!