jdm56 Posted March 22, 2006 Share Posted March 22, 2006 ...should be here by the end of the week! Please, no scolding, but it ain't Klipsch. It's an ADS HT12ps with a twelve-inch driver and a 300W RMS (500W Peak) class AB amp, in a single-reflex bandpass cabinet. The beast weighs in at 81 pounds. It's rated 116dB output, in-room (unspecified frequency). The frequecy response is rated 20-200Hz +/- 1dB (anechoic), 15-180Hz in-room. Let there be thumpage! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jdm56 Posted March 22, 2006 Author Share Posted March 22, 2006 oops...nevermind. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul Posted March 22, 2006 Share Posted March 22, 2006 ADS have been around for quite some time and make a fairly good product,Let us know how you make out with the sub. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jdm56 Posted March 23, 2006 Author Share Posted March 23, 2006 ADS have been around for quite some time and make a fairly good product,Let us know how you make out with the sub. Fairly good? ...gee thanks![] Klipsch makes some OK speakers too.[] I had the lusties for a pair of ADS L-810's way back in the late 70's but couldn't afford them ,so I ended up with Advents. (still a good choice, if I do say so myself) Anyway, the point is I have always liked the sound of ADS products, and have always admired their no-BS approach to loudspeaker design. I think all of their current line, except the subs, is made in Taiwan, which is kind of a bummer, but that's the way of the world I suppose. I will update after I receive the sub and get it set up. It's replacing a pair of Infinity Alpha 1200 subs. Hopefully, I can add another HT12 down the line. Not that I need the output, but in my room, I can get considerably smoother bass with two subs than I've ver been able to get with just one. We'll see! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul Posted March 27, 2006 Share Posted March 27, 2006 Ok maybe i should have left out the Fairly,[]Yes ADS make great products,I had pair of speakers years ago that gave me no problems and gave excellent sound ouput. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom Adams Posted March 27, 2006 Share Posted March 27, 2006 Wow jdm.....that sure is an attractive looking sub. Be sure to post your feelings about it once you get time to play with it. Tom Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jdm56 Posted March 30, 2006 Author Share Posted March 30, 2006 I'm still playin' with placement, phase, x/o, etc, but I can say this is a gorgeous beast; curved sides and front (teardrop shaped), piano black base, black ash wood veneer, and HEAVY! ...Two big honkin' ports on the back --you could stick your arm in the these suckers! Build quality seems to be very, very good. Performance is still up in the air. It definitely goes loud, at least from 40Hz up to 90Hz or so, although so far it does seem to be a bit of a thumper, with peaked output in that 40-90Hz region, but falling rapidly above and below. I still have a lot of locations to try out, though. I guess bandpass subs are a bit notorious for being peaky, but once dialed in they can produce one heck of a lot of clean bass from a relatively small enclosure. So far, my best measurements have come from setting my receivers x/o at 50Hz (mains set to large), boosting the sub's 35Hz EQ by 6dB and running the phase at 180 degrees. These settings measure VERY smooth down to below 40Hz, but the 31.5 Hz band is down 8-10 dB --not good! ...more tweaking to do! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrWho Posted March 30, 2006 Share Posted March 30, 2006 So did you have the same frequency response issues with your older subs with similar placement? If not then it's probably not a room issue... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jdm56 Posted March 31, 2006 Author Share Posted March 31, 2006 No, this ADS sub measures and sounds a lot differently than the Infinity did in the same location. I have to say that so far, the Infinity was one heck of a lot easier to dial in; it was smoother. But, it didn't have the gut-wrenching output of the ADS...so I guess you pick your poison at the price levels I operate at.[6] I've still got to try some different locations. I had just hoped this sub would work where the Infinity did, just to avoid major furniture moving and wire re-routing. Oh well, no one ever said being an audiophool was easy![] I do HAVE to make this sub work. My wife will have the proverbial cow if I start talking selling it already. Besides, I'd lose my shorts on this thing, since I bought it new. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrWho Posted March 31, 2006 Share Posted March 31, 2006 Hmmm...are they a down-firing design, or is it just the ports in the back? Just ports would be 4th-order bandpass....rear ports and downfiring ports would be 6th order. (4th order) (6th order) The reason I ask is that it's insane to build a 20-200Hz +-1dB subwoofer. (that's over 4 octaves). Click the pictures to learn more about the different designs. Anyways, with only 300W of amplifier input, the system would need a sensitivity of 90dB in order to achieve 116dB...and about 3" P-P excursion (depending on frequency and tuning point - could be more or less). These numbers aren't out of the ordinary until you consider that it's only a 4 cubic foot enclosure. How much did you end up spending? (just wondering how beefy the motor on the inside might be). One quick comment...the cone excursion will be reaching a peak about an octave above the tuning point...which would be right around the 40-50Hz region. It's quite possible that you are experiencing some driver non-linearities and I have no doubt that they have some limiting circuitry at those frequencies - all of which would be reducing the output in the 40-50Hz range. To verify, simply walk around the room and see if the particular problem comes and goes at those frequencies...bandpass designs do have a different phase response which may be accounting for the cancellation at those frequencies too. Btw, how did you go about calibrating your subs? And do you have two of them arranged like your old subs? Or just one? Lots of questions...just trying to help [] No need to go out and purchase a new sub yet either. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jdm56 Posted April 1, 2006 Author Share Posted April 1, 2006 I was a bit leary of the "20-200Hz" spec. They're not real specific about how they arrived at those numbers.[^o)] They do imply it's under anechoic conditions. According to your diagrams, my sub would be a 4th-order bandpass design; in fact, that pic could pass for a rough side-view drawing of it. The ports (2) open to the back, with the 12" driver mounted on a horizontal motorboard that roughly disects the sub in half. The driver's rear wave is contained in a sealed enclosure, while the front radiates into the dual-vent chamber. I think ADS's own literature refers to it as a single reflex, sealed bandpass design. The sub does seem very efficient, or perhaps it's input impedence is just really low. At any rate, I have the level control on the sub turned all the way down, while the auto set-up function of my receiver also has turned it's sub line-level output down the max (-10dB). These settings combined with a 50Hz low-pass to the sub, mains set to "large" (I forget the phase setting) produce good results: I'm down 6dB at 25Hz from the reference level at 1kHz, with the other largest deviation from flat thru the bass being a 5dB peak in the 63Hz range, which I'm sure is at least mostly a room thing. Needless to say, the bass sounds quite solid and clean. These results are with the sub moved to a front corner, close to the right main. Integration is much better there. And btw, I am just using one sub for now. It basically took the proceeds from both Infinity subs to get this one (app $600 / delivered). And with my latest set-up results, I'm not considering selling this one! I can only imagine what two of these would do! I know the second Infinity smoothed things out amazingly compared to just one in a rear corner. ps -- the 300W power rating is an RMS rating. The peak number according to ADS is 525W (into 2ohms). The rated acoustic output from ADS varies depending on where you look! One place on the website says116dB, while the manual says 112. Probably one figure is anechoic and one is in-room. And fwiw, they say it uses double 50oz. magnets. So what's that, about 6 1/4 pounds? I would suppose acoustic suspension designs would not require as much magnet as vented ones. Is that right? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jdm56 Posted April 2, 2006 Author Share Posted April 2, 2006 2nd attempt to post pic of new sub (ADS HT12ps)... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darylomer12 Posted April 7, 2006 Share Posted April 7, 2006 Can you repeat that in English, Dr.Who? It amazes me how much you know about sound and HT. I would love to have a neighbor like you living next to me. I would know for sure i was getting the most out of my setup. I have been researching cone excursions, bandpass designs,driver non-linearities and etc... and still don't know what you just said. Anyway, I definately know who to ask if i ever encounter any problems with my HT! Not sure if you would help or not, but i would know who to ask. WOW.............. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrWho Posted April 7, 2006 Share Posted April 7, 2006 Well if you hang around these forums enough and pay attention you will be surprised how much you might learn...there is a great knowledge base here. And if I can contribute to it, all the better! We're all in the same boat. To try and sum up what I was talking about...there are two main things to consider: First, the frequency response changes depending on how loud the driver is playing. <insert the hundreds of reasons here> Secondly, don't just think of things in terms of the frequency response. Things are behaving differently as time goes on too... <insert another hundred things to talk about here> I wish I could point you to a single location to do some reading, but alas this is the best I can do: http://www.snippets.org/ http://www.diysubwoofers.org/ http://www.prosoundweb.com/studyhall/ It took me about 2 years to get through all of those sites (and fully comprehend everything)....happy reading [] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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