squawker

Thanks Roger. These don't turn up very often and another pair turned up locally for $200, but they need a lot of cleaning and paint and have a different (later) set of parts. Either would have worked for me but I like the ones I got. I only counted 4 listings unless, somehow, I missed the first. Looking at ebay prices for years and the fact that these sealed cabs are super clean inside, I would say there is at least $500 of parts inside. Mark

I finally found a pair of Split La Scala tops, Industrial type for my industrial lowers. I was surprised to find K77s inside. I never really stopped to think when they started making these uppers- does any one know? The fuse labeling is also misleading. The way they are wired is: LF is the fuse to the whole upper unit and lower cab, or input to the xover, and the HF fuse is on the output of the xover to the midrange horn. The asking price was 1500, I offered 700 (too much), and ended up paying 400 on the fourth listing. Go figure!

I finally got around to testing the burned speaker crossover. The meter says everything is OK. It looks OK. I modded the crossover on the unburned speaker to type A and left the burned one in type AA config and they now both sound the same (like type A). Its is hard to believe that it would be the tweeter itself.

I certainly like your line of thought but I'm not very fast. I just started reading about veneering to see if it is beyond me or not. First I have to get them functional and make corners to try them out. I may try the Crites cast frame woofers. They have K33B woofers now. I wonder how they both blew. I wonder what the market is for blown woofers because I can't just toss 'em. From your description, it sounds like khorns don't have the punch that cornwalls have. I like the punch but getting older, my ears get tired very quickly. I'm mostly concerned that I may not get them to sound good in my basement but I have no other place. The only 2 times I heard khorns was last year when I almost bought a pair setup in a garage. The sound was not inspiring and I passed. The other time was many years ago (around 1980) at my friend's house in central NY. His Father had a new one and serial #15 with a modern tweeter added. I certainly agree with your 'collect them all' statement. I now have the khorns, 6 cornwalls, and a wall of 14 LaScalas. However, really 13, I need one more black LaScala to even it up. The reason for the number of LaScalas is because they were cheap! Mostly all were pulled from old Rogers organ installations and have the screw on tops. I had to pass on the MCM bass bins on ebay in 2004 that went for $30 to $60 each. It was hard to pass up because I was close enought to pick them up but they are just too big. I've heard a setup with 4 double MCM bass bins and six LaScalas and it was killer. They turned the bins on and off for comparison.

They turned out to be unfinished birch in fairly decent shape with two blown woofers, Everything else is functional. The labels are missing. The serial number has a u in it for 1980. One mid driver was replaced (one driver has spring loaded terminals with a replacement wire and one driver is soldered). Two out of six molding pieces on the edges of the shelf (bottom side of top section) remain. Now I need 2 woofers and a refin or veneer job. The top came easily. There are round felt pads underneath, similar to under an xover. Not a screamin deal but probably reasonable. I like the gold back square tweeters. The birch has no grain at all. Now is the time to test them for sound since all of my experience has been with cornwalls and LaScalas. Up to this point, I have been a believer that the cornwall is the best all around speaker Klipsch ever made (for the heritage type sound). It can do it all.

Thanks all for the suggestions. These are good things to know. A pry knife and possibly a mallet. I’ve debated whether or not to test. If they work fine who knows what the seller might do to the deal. If everything looks present and good I think I’ll run with it. I think I can move them in 1 trip with 2 wagons by removing the front passenger seat and hinged rear seat in each wagon for the tops. Definitely a hand truck and blankies.

Because of the lack of good corners in my house, I decided to give up on joining the Klipschorn club. However, I found a nice pair with an unknown problem in nice shape for $1000. I can't pass it up so now for the delivery phase. If I remove the top sections, I can fit a bass section in each of 2 station wagons and bring one wagon back for the 2 top sections. Question: when I attempt to remove the top sections, what possible problems may I encounter? I'm guessing all wing nuts, and the xover and horns (and mid horn support) stay with the upper? Might the two sections stick together? Anything other potential problems? The year may be 1980 but I didn't get the serial number. Pickup will be on Tuesday 06/23/09.

>>Are there output differences between the round magnet K-77s and the square magnet ones? When I replaced round with square there was significantly >>more output (type AA xover). Or is this the output variation described previously between T-35s? >>Don The original question was the variation in output between different vintage ceramic square magnets but your point is true about the difference in output between round and square magnet K77s. There's quite a bit on this topic if you search for it here. My 74 cornwalls had a silver back square and a round magnet and the difference was huge in favour of the square magnet - about 180 degrees on the treble knob. The next step is to compare every loose K77 I have - 4 square bronze, 2 square silver and 2 round - if I ever get time. A small sample size to be sure but fun.

It's nice to know someone else has noticed the same thing - your theory sounds like a good one to me. My first guess is variation in magnetic force. My second guess is other multiple variables based on Bob's experience.

Bob, Thanks for the insight based on your experience. I don't have the means to conduct extensive experiments such as yours. I didn't think about acquiring them in pairs. It sounds like there may be multiple variables involved.

I know there has been a million posts comparing parts but I have another curious one. I have 1979 La Scalas with bronze coloured square back K77-Ms that work great. I replaced one with a later (1985?) silver coloured K77-M back for an AB comparison. I noticed a drop in level on the silver back K77-M (maybe 3 dB). I replaced it with another silver back and got the same results. Is there a consistent differece between the the two vintages (bronze or silver back) or have my 1985 silver backs (which look new) lost some magnetism - they sound fine otherwise. Mark

It does look like Dr. Seuss. It also looks like a photo of a band sitting in front multiple phonograph recorders about 100 years ago (without the band)

The white horn on the right looks like a cross between a bathroom sink and a toilet

What on earth is this? If the middle section is the bass, it's probably not too smart putting the CD player in front of it.

Here's a 21T166 La Scala. They couldn't have jumped from 166 to 600s from week 21 to week 22 so that kills the first numbers as being the week of production theory.

I'm glad you mentioned that - it gives me a chance to explain my plans. The La Scala that goes on top has a type AL crossover. I modified the low pass filter to match a type A configuration (one inductor in series) which means I have one inductor leftover to use with the industrial woofer. I've installed an extra barrier strip for an additional amplifier input connection. I have extra crown and ramsa amps I can use for the pair. The inductor for use with the industrials are standard and don't have the same power rating as the industrials but it should be fine in my basement. The cabs do need a good paint job.

Thanks for the offer! It is probably not important enough to go to any trouble. They sure are heavy duty. I'm going to put regular La Scalas on top to make a pair of super scalas.

Here's an industrial La Scala bass bucket with a ser # that seems to be one digit short of any ser # on the date codes web page. I would guess it is a 1984 model - any ideas? http://www.progressive-engineering.com/klipsch/klipsch_date_codes.htm

What is a two-port phase plug?

Yes, you are correct. It sounds more different than better with the parts removed but may sound better to me depending on the recording. These type AL sound good either way (to me) - better than AA and not as good as A. From what I've read, the extra parts appear to be notch filters to compensate for the drivers as you mentioned. I'm satisfied with them enough to keep and use them.

I removed the excess parts on these type AL crossovers and they do sound better. It's hard to tell a difference from the woofer. Many posts on the forum state most people prefer type AA and dislike type AL the most. I would have to say the opposite. Type AA kills me. The high end sounds like two mid range horns. The AL I have without the zeners modified or unmodified sound much better than AA. I converted the type AA to A and they sound the best. I would like to hear the ALK though.

Also, I've noticed that some of these organ speakers have a slightly different angle on the front edge of the bass horn so the base of the triangle partially or fully overlaps or covers the edges of the straight pieces that they attach to. One of them had a tweeter with a round magnet and no screws with a Klipsch sticker on it - not an emblem or stamp.

The auction is over now without a winner but the same guy will be selling more of these in the future. I met this guy to look at the last pair he sold. He's a Rogers organ tech for Heritage organ in Orem. He pulls maybe 6-8 of these type of La Scalas per year and sells them on ebay. From what I understand, Klipsch produced many La Scalas for organ installations with the Rogers booster amp installed. The only other difference is the top of the cabinet has screws so it can be removed to work on the amp. I easily removed the amp on mine without taking the top off, tested it and sold it on ebay for $88. The amps are 100 watt and are good amps. For music use you would need a preamp and you can turn the amp on by bypassing the power relay or give it 12VDC (polarity on the coil doesn't matter). This is the first pair I've seen with the amps on the left side. I bought one of these on ebay from a guy in SLC for $260 (less the amp -$180! and it was much nicer than these). I would see them in person before you buy. Also, remove the volume pots. There is currently a beautiful pair of Khorns for sale in Sandy just waiting to be grabbed! I've seen them and they look much better than the photo, and the price is right! http://www.ksl.com/index.php?nid=218&ad=1162929&cat=25&lpid=4

The answer to the first question is no - the caps and resistors are unnecessary. The answer to the second question is maybe and the reverse polarity setup is factory. The answer to the third question is yes - there are several versions of just plain AL and this one was never equipped with diodes. Times are desperate when one talks to one's own self on a forum! The answer to the question I really wanted to know is - how does one make this beast sound better, preferrably for free? Here's an AL_K diagram to answer that question. In this case, all I need to do is disconnect the caps and resisitors from the ground wire where they all meet. Adding the 13uF cap as a replacement with the midrange autoformer would be nice if it were inexpensive enough. This crossover is worth the most as a token crossover in a pair of La Scalas that are to be sold if I should decide to do so. Mark

Bob, I tried the conversion from AA to A and I thought it sounded much better. I would like to replace the caps for a type A configuration so I guess I need 2 caps per crossover, a 13uF and a 2 uF. What type of cap should I get? Are they available from you? Mark