Kevinicus

Well, I still haven't had a chance to hear my Klipsch (or JTR) speakers in my home theater. The main construction is nearing completion, but there is still a ways to go yet. Carpet is quite a ways off (at least a month as the place is being difficult with measurements). Most of the electrical is done, stage is done, Riser is mostly done (nosing around the edge is what is holding up carpet measurements), drywall is mostly done. It's coming along, but still a ways to go.

I have Audyssey, but I am not sure which one. My receiver is a 2010 Onkyo. The optimization I was talking about was for the actual acoustic treatments in the room, not the equalization, etc. I went ahead and did it for both rows, so I hope the money is well spent. The design is being worked on now.

That makes me want to optimize the 2nd row even more! If I get stuck in the back row, I want it to be great.

Big decision to make...optimize the sound design for one row or both rows. It's $500 cheaper for one row, and less treatments would be needed to implement which would reduce the theater costs further. I am probably the only one in the house that would notice the difference, and most of the time the back row won't be used... Thoughts?

I think I also found my carpet yesterday. A little more than I wanted to spend, but I think it looks and feels great. The color didn't come out right in my camera, but it doesn't have a red tint to it. It's gray.

Ha. I think I'm set with the JTR's. No more money being spent on audio until I upgrade for Atmos (not counting cables).

Definitely ready. They were about $913 shipped, so just over $228 a piece.

I got a few presents today:

Got my KPT-8000's ordered and should be receiving them tomorrow. Got them for a pretty good price. I think overall I've spent about $1100 more on audio than I had budgeted, but am getting a lot more value. No in-walls, and much better subs than what I was going with. The basic layout of the room is pretty much locked in, just have to figure out some exact dimensions for first row seating, riser height, and screen size (determined by seating). I have decided that I will not be using a local installer, and the construction will be done by my gf's cousin. I am going to hire Nyal to do my acoustical design and treatment plan as well. I've started looking at different carpets to make sure I am prepared when the time comes. Hoping construction starts in November. In the meantime, I have some more demo to do.

Well, things certainly haven't progressed as much as I would have liked, but they are about to. I had decided I was going to go ahead and use the installer I had talked to, with the understanding that I would make the choices on equipment, not him, and was about to pay his depost/design/spec fee but he went out of town to a convention and his communication got spotty after that and we never got the payment arranged. In the meantime I was talking to other contractors and determining what my options were for managing things myself and hiring people for different parts of the project. Not many of them impressed me, and I was about to go back and hire that installer (whose communication has improved a little) until the last 2 contractors came out. The first seemed fairly experienced, at least in basic theater construction, and gave me a lot of confidence in my ideas for the room. He seemed like a real straight shooter who wouldn't BS or try to screw me over. The 2nd is my gf's cousin. He does a lot of this work and also seemed capable. He had some ideas I shot down, but they weren't necessarily bad ideas, I had just already considered them. I am still waiting on an estimate from the first, but the cousin gave me an estimate (for labor of the construction only) which was way less than I expected and really made me re-evaluate my thoughts of going with the installer. Now I am trying to get HVAC guys out to figure that aspect out, and I really think I'm going to use the cousin. If I go that route, I'll probably be hiring Nyal of Acoustic Frontiers to do my layout and acoustic design for me, and then I'll get things rolling with the cousin. I think it's very likely I'll also do most of the AV wiring myself since it is pretty straight forward. I'll still have to hire an AV guy to setup a control system for my equipment and lighting, but I think I've got that narrowed down to a couple guys as well. I've got two HVAC guys coming out tonight, and I need to get talk to Nyal, but I hope to make a firm decision this weekend about if I will go with my gf's cousin and Nyal (leaning this way) or with the installer. I also ended up purchasing some of my audio equipment already. Due to a major change in my design of the space, in-wall speakers are out, and I'll be building a false wall to allow speaker placement behind the screen. A local guy ended up selling me his used JTR setup (3 Noesis 228s, and 2 Captivator Pro subs, as well as a pre-amp and amp for the subs). I am also on the verge of purchasing 4 Klipsch KPT-8000M speakers to pair with them as my surrounds. I already tore out the ceiling in my basement and got all that put in bags, just to see what was up there. I'm going to end up moving a wall back to allow me to have a wider space. That will really help with walking aisles when I have columns built (that will hide the KPT-8000s).

Some codes require 2 ways to escape a room, in two different directions -- a good idea. Find out if the local code will allow a many layered 3/4 plywood/insulation wool opaque "window" that seals with a good gasket and swings open to reveal a regular double glazed openable window behind it. Normally stocked double glazed windows aren't very good at preventing midrange from going through, and near total failures at preventing bass transmission. If you can't get an adequate window, consider a second door, if it will fit (i.e., some daylight basements don't have enough height above gound). Acoustically sealed solid core doors with dense air tight dampers are available, but they cost an arm and a leg, and sometimes two, with an air lock, are needed. Tell your installer you will be creating 115 dB peaks (normal full scale for bass), and ask him to provide TL data sheets for "windows" in the bass frequencies, say 20 -- 250 Hz. There was a good book on DIY building a home recording studio by Jeff somebody (Cooper?). He did home studios for several film directors and groups, and you can bet they didn't have much leakage. Much of this stuff should be available online, but your installer has probably done that legwork (fingerwork?) for you already. The window wouldn't have had to be in the HT room, just the basement. But I have checked the code and am fairly certain our house would be exempt from the requirement.

My brother lives outside of Denver, so it's possible I'll make the trip out there at some point (Thanksgiving?) but I don't really have any plans at the moment.

Has anyone ran into an issue with having to install an egress window to meet code when doing a HT in the basement?

Well, I've pretty much exhausted all of the installer options in the area. I've had a few more e-mails with the one installer and he now seems resigned to the fact that I'm going to use the equipment I want and may or may not get it from him. He really seems like the only one that has much of a clue. From everything I can gather, he seems like the only one that is taking the right approach to doing a theater. At least outside of pushing certain brands, but it's possible he really does like them. I did find posts by him on AVS from 2006 or so where he mentioned he liked TruAudio. I have been contacting local contractors to try and guage their prices for construction, and have only heard from one so far. His rates ($55 to $85 per sqft) would be a lot more than what i'm looking at. I have a feeling that may be high though considering where the room is starting and the area.

Sorry if you've mentioned it and I've missed it but is an acoustically transparent screen an option with stand alone speakers behind it? If we build a baffle wall (and depending on how far it can be brought out.).

I'm not 100% going in-walls. Baffle wall is still in consideration. Depends on design issues.

Thanks for the input Gary, I am pretty sensitive with the unmasked areas. I've been in a couple of theaters now one with masking, and one without (and this one had 2:35 playing at the smaller size some of the time), and it was very noticeable to me every time. The girlfriend not so much. But at $250 or $350, depending on which screen I go with, I think it's definitely worth it for me. I'm only worried about the two "main" aspect ratios. I know I'm lumping in everything from 2.35 to 2.40 into one group there, but the size difference between them is small enough that I'm okay with it. I'll have a Lumagen for the shifting aspect ratio movies, and I don't care about 4:3 at all. I finally heard back from the installer yesterday. My e-mail is acting funny and his reply didn't come through. He had to send it to my other e-mail, and even then it went to my spam folder. He basically said "okay" to everything I said. I guess he's willing to accept what I want after he realized I wasn't going to cave in and just accept what he wants. He is still trying to push the TruAudio (Bad Boy series - These) or the 900 series from Episode, but said he would do Klipsch if that's what I wanted. He said the TruAudio were slightly cheaper than the Klipsch THX line and would "blow them out of the water - check out the specs!" Now the place I went that had TruAudio in their showroom said they were $1400 per speaker. I know the KL7800 MSRP is 1500, so I assume that's what he's going by when saying the TAs are slightly less. However, I have been quoted $588 per for the KL7800s, so that's just a tiny bit less. I asked him if he had installed the TAs or Episodes somewhere that would be willing to let me come listen. We'll see what he says. In the meantime, I have 3 guys coming out this week, starting tonight. I want to hear what they say before making any decisions. I did go ahead and buy the projector last night (and yes, it's still on sale) just to get that out of the way. So, the first part of my home theater is now taken care of.

For the Panasonic AE8000. A couple weeks ago most had it for $2250 and then there's a $350 rebate. Now, most places have gone back up to around $2,500. One that still has it at $2250 says their sale ends today. Another place still has it at that price, but they don't mention how long it'll be that low.

Yeah, I've always been a DIY for home theater in the past, but I want to make sure this is done right and making sure the acoustics of the room are the best they can be is beyond my skills. That extends to other area of the construction as well. So, if I did do it myself, not only would I have to spend so much time that I don't have working on it, I'd spend just as much, if not more doing extra research so I would know how to do it. I really want to get it done fairly soon as well, so DIY is really not an option. The plan is for it to definitely kick some serious butt. Probably going to buy the projector tonight since there is a sale that ends today. There won't be any alternatives for installers after that either.

The 40k number is the entire budget. The 25k figure is assuming I buy the projector, screen, speakers, subs, Lumagen, and seating for about 15k leaving 25k for design, construction, installation, automation, and calibration. Unfortunately, I don't really have the time to do it myself, and would rather get it done sooner rather than later. If it was just running wires to speakers and mounting stuff, I'd be okay. It's what I did for my last home. This is much bigger though, and there's so much more to do that I have no desire to work on. I'm ready to enjoy my theater. But I want it done right too. Regardless of who does it, I will know where every wire is and where they go.

Well as long as you agree on everything but the audio and video Haha, when you put it like that it does seem pretty significant, but the issue isn't over what will work.. With the projector, I simply want the one that has the feature I want, and with the audio, it's just brand preference...which I think the customer breaks the tie.

Unfortunately, I wasn't impressed with any of the other installers really, and most of them don't really handle all the construction/design aspects either. This guy is CEDIA, and at least sounds like he knows what he's talking about. I kind of wish I had already bought the equipment before talking to any of them so they would just have to work with what I've got. Really the only 2 things we have differences on are the projector and speakers (and he's a Klipsch dealer - for all I know he can get me the same prices I could get elsewhere, and I'd be happy to buy from him in that case). Even if I got most of the equipment I was talking about, it'd still be a $25k+ project for him.

That's my impression as well. I'm sure they sound great to people who haven't a clue about AV at all and just hire these installers to do basic stuff like wire a 2.0 system. I bet installers are used to customers who don't have a clue and are impressed by all the vast knowledge they have. I'm not one to spend $40k on a project without doing my due diligence to make sure I'm getting something that's what I want. Even if I am not going to be doing everything, I at least like to have a good idea about all that's going on.

Yeah, I've thought about going out and finding separate contractors for the construction and electrical, etc., but really wanted the convenience of only having to deal with one person to handle it all. I'm ready to get things moving on it so it gets done sooner rather than later, and with work and school, I don't have the free time to keep devoting to finding people to work with...or doing it myself. I sent the guy an e-mail, explaining my specific reasons for what I want, and told him I was more than willing to go through him for things he is a dealer for. He's actually a dealer for Klipsch too, but he keeps pushing the TruAudio. I guess he gets a bigger margin with those, or maybe they're easier to work with. Who knows. We'll see what he says.