Gene2

Please forgive the double post, but I posted this on the Technical Questions forum and didn't get much responce. Hi, I’ve been an owner of a pair of RF-3s for almost ten years, matched with the warm sound of my B&K Ref 7250 amp, they normally give a very articulate but still reasonably warm sound. The majority of my listening is music, so despite having a processer preamp (B&K Ref 20), I always optimize the system for 2 channel direct stereo. I use the direct mode because I think the DACs in my player (Rotel RCD 991) seem to sound better than those in the preamp. But a few months I changed flats, so I had the opportunity to play a little with speaker placement to optimize the sound for the new room. Back in my old place I had the RF-3s much closer to the back wall then the majority of the advice I’ve read for placement of these speakers. Almost everything I’ve read advises RF-3s should be at least around 12” from the away from the back and side walls and toed in to point almost directly at the listener. So I used this advice as a starting point when I got the system running again. But in this position the sound was at best thin with little bottom end and the horns just screeched. After spending about a month in “speaker placement wilderness” I eventually moved them back to much closer to the back wall. Well the speakers came back to life!! Now they have the full sound again I’ve become too accustomed to. Currently the inner corners of the speakers are 7.25” (185mm) and outer corner 9” (230mm) from the back wall (that makes a toe in angle of 11 deg). The speakers are 85.5” (2170mm) apart and my optimum listening position is 110” (2795mm) from the speakers. I was wondering if anybody here might be able to fill me in on why my placement is so different than the conventional advice. I know about rooms and ears all being different, so speaker placement will be different and how moving speakers closer to the back wall will increase the level of bass, but mine is way beyond what I’ve read. Thanks Gene

Hi, I’ve been an owner of a pair of RF-3s for almost ten years, matched with the warm sound of my B&K Ref 7250 amp, they normally give a very articulate but still reasonably warm sound. The majority of my listening is music, so despite having a processer preamp (B&K Ref 20), I always optimize the system for 2 channel direct stereo. I use the direct mode because I think the DACs in my player (Rotel RCD 991) seem to sound better than those in the preamp. But a few months I changed flats, so I had the opportunity to play a little with speaker placement to optimize the sound for the new room. Back in my old place I had the RF-3s much closer to the back wall then the majority of the advice I’ve read for placement of these speakers. Almost everything I’ve read advises RF-3s should be at least around 12” from the away from the back and side walls and toed in to point almost directly at the listener. So I used this advice as a starting point when I got the system running again. But in this position the sound was at best thin with little bottom end and the horns just screeched. After spending about a month in “speaker placement wilderness” I eventually moved them back to much closer to the back wall. Well the speakers came back to life!! Now they have the full sound again I’ve become too accustomed to. Currently the inner corners of the speakers are 7.25” (185mm) and outer corner 9” (230mm) from the back wall (that makes a toe in angle of 11 deg). The speakers are 85.5” (2170mm) apart and my optimum listening position is 110” (2795mm) from the speakers. I was wondering if anybody here might be able to fill me in on why my placement is so different than the conventional advice. I know about rooms and ears all being different, so speaker placement will be different and how moving speakers closer to the back wall will increase the level of bass, but mine is way beyond what I’ve read. Thanks Gene

I guess it really is a small world. I now have the time to play because I just left a project management position for a tier one supplier to Ford Power Train Engineering. I hope your experience is better than mine. From what I saw with the bad attitude of the Ford engineers (you can always replace competence with attitude) and the way they treat suppliers, Ford is getting the results they (the personal) and the company deserves. (I will now get off my soap box and get on to more interesting subjects!!) "The Last of the Mohicans" (The first version with Daniel Day-Lewis running out of the front cover) is also one of my favourites. Usually its the first CD I play when I am testing a tweak or a new piece of equipment, it really lights up a system. Then I follow it with a little Diana Krall and Mary Black. I must drive my neighbours crazy. $200 does buy me the whole amp module. The newer module is a little more powerful and has a few more features like a filter by pass. Since I have a little more time between interviews, the DIY solution sounds very interesting. Belden 89207 is 2 wires with a braided shield, all with Teflon insulation. Making interconnects from 89207 is a snap and IMHO it still has a great sound. For more information check out this site: http://echoloft.com/articles/belden/belden%20interconnects.htm Cat5 speaker cable is really cheap for materials but very labour intensive. It took all day to make the first 22 pair set and an afternoon to construct the second 18 pair cable. My fingers hurt for the next three days and they did take about 150 hours to burn in but these cables sounded much better compared to any cables I listened to costing a lot more. My kit has mostly been sourced from Audiogon and AudioReview classifieds. The Klipschs do come from a local dealer in Rochester, Michigan. Originally I was set to buy a Rotel RSX-965 but I had a listen to the B&K at The Gramophone in Birmingham and thought it was a step above the Rotel. Then I got lucky and found an ad on AudioReview for a shop in California looking to sell their demo AVR202 for $1400.00, so I jumped. Along with The Gramophone in Birmingham, Today's Audio in Flint (nice people, ask for Red) sells B&K in the Detroit area. There may be more but I haven't dealt with them. If you are feeling as better as I am today then we both are well on the way. Gene

Hope you are on the mend; I've also been fighting the same cold everyone else seems to have. Thanks for the complement on my system. I did a lot of listening and homework (driving my then girl friend crazy) finding what components sounded best to me. 1) All my wiring is DIY. Interconnects are Belden 89207 with Conair F10 connectors. I tried several sets of Jon Risch's composite 82248, 89259 recipes but I thought it sounded too smooth almost dull. I noticed the horns stopped singing on the Last Of The Mohicans sound track. The main speakers are biwired with Chris VenHaus Cat5 recipe, 27 pairs for the low and 18 pairs for the high and the power cables are also Chris Venhaus with flavour 2 for the power amp and flavour 3 for the prepro and CDP. 2) I had a chat with Dr. Hsu and Klipsch tech support about integrating the subwoofer into my system. Both claim the RF-3s are good down to 35Hz to 40Hz so I should run the sub in extended mode. My VTF-2 is the first version so the cross only adjusts from 125Hz down to 60Hz (the newer model's range is from 30Hz to 90Hz) so Klipsch suggested I turn the cross down to 60Hz and adjust the volume to my ear. Dr. Hsu said that Klipsch's advice sounded about right but because the RF-3s will go so low, the VTF-2 might not be the best match. He also suggested I might consider up dating my sub with the latest amp, cost $200.00. I am thinking rather than updating the sub maybe a sub control unit like the Outlaw might be a better long-term solution. I would appreciate any input or advice you or anyone else could give. Thanks again, hope you are feeling better Gene

Thanks for the reply. I am using a B&K, AVR202 as a preamp and a Ref 7250 as a power amp. While it's set up for HT, my primary interest is music (90% music vs. 10% HT). The sub is connected with a "Y" connector to the sub out on the prepro. For music I run the preamp in stereo direct mode and the subwoofer is configured to ultra mode in the prepro set-up. Ultra mode will send full range to the mains plus the subwoofer even in stereo direct mode. For music my system: B&K AVR202 as a prepro B&K Ref 7250 power amp Klipsch RF-3 mains HSU VTF-2 subwoofer Rotel RCD-991 CDP Thanks Gene

Does anybody here have any experience setting up an HSU, VTF-2 subwoofer with Klipsch, RF-3s? Specifically what cross over setting seem to sound best. Thanks Gene

Hi, I have the same problem with my center channel. I found the hum was comming from the stray RF from the TV. To check move the speaker away from the top of the TV and listen if the hum stops. When I moved mine the hum stopped, so I wonder just how good the shielding inside the speaker really is and does Klipsch (I hope the people at Klipsch are reading this post) have a recomended fix? Thanks Gene

Help !!! I need some quick help on a Rotel RDV-995 DVD player. Does anyone in the group have any experience or with this player? I am looking at using this player for music CDs so the quality of the music reproduction is important. It is not listed on Audioreview and my web searches on this player turn up nothing. Thanks Gene