DizRotus
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Posts posted by DizRotus
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I haven't taken the time to compare the parts lists in the mauals, but it's my perception that the 430 and 730 are the most commonly owned among forum members (it's a mere concidence that you and I have those two units) so a refurb klit for those two would be just what the doctor--and I don't mean Who--ordered.
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I had bid the first bidder up during the evening which was probably to no one's advantage but the seller.<?xml:namespace prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" />
Michael Colter speaks the truth. Any bidding prior to the very close (can you say snipe) of an eBay auction benefits only the seller.
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930 Technical Manual
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730 Technical Manual
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630 Technical Manual
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Has anyone re-capped one of the HK x30's yet? My 430 is really noisy. I know Doc had a thread about it at one time. What say we gather the Schematics and figure out what stock of parts it would take to do them.
I have a 430 and 730.
Michael, I too would be interested in the ins and outs of re-capping the H/K x30 series. If all goes well, the Technical Manual to the 430, including schematics, will be attached to this post. I'll then attach the manuals for the 630, 730 and 930 to subsequent posts.
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"I got sniped on the throats last night . . . .<?xml:namespace prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" />
Michael, its always better to be the sniper than the snipee. Its not really a live auction. If you snipe what its worth to you, you cant be sniped. You can be outbid, but not sniped.
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Bump with a subject change to possibly get more attention and response(s).
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George, did you ever build the tractrix horns?
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How do the various vented enclosures, e.g. Tekton, etc., for the Fostex 103 drivers compare in dimensions, volume and port configuration to the one included in the attached pdf?
I have an extra pair of drivers and I want to make a ported enclosure to compare to the rear-horn-loaded Fostex enclosure and the Fostex recommended vented enclosure.
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It would be silly to disagree with Dr. Who.[
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Michael,
You have a PM.
EDIT @ 1513 EDT
Congratulations on winning the H/K 930. let us know how it sounds.
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Please try to post some pics. <?xml:namespace prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" />
If the bass bins are solid, they alone are worth the purchase price. If they have EV tweeters (whether or not functional) they alone are also worth the purchase price; same if they have Atlas mid drivers and aluminum squawker horns. I would be most inclined to replace the woofers with BEC sourced woofers and to replace the x-overs. That said, functioning Speakerlab woofers have some value to many who dabble with the Klipsch-style corner horn.
One difficulty in assessing Speakerlab corner horns is the many changes they went through during their relatively short (compared to Klipschorns) production history. What you find in terms of MDF or plywood, drivers and squawker horn (aluminum or fiberglass), etc. can be a surprise. It's my understanding that the "standard" SKhorn was 4 ohm, but that 8 ohm versions were an option (I had four 8 ohm SKs that I used in parallel to produce a 4 ohm load on a Dynaco ST-400). If you replace the woofers and x-overs, you needn't concern yourself with whether the SKs were nominally 4 or 8 ohm.
"Cheesy" is too flattering a description of the Speakerlab crossover networks. If you're seriously thinking about "restoring" these speakers, I would suggest obtaining a used pair of Klipsch networks (mostly for the autoformers) and then refreshing them to A, AA, ALK or another desired configuration. IMHO, restoring the Speakerlab x-overs would be a waste of time and money.
Regarding a trip to the <?xml:namespace prefix = st1 ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:smarttags" />Emerald City, I would be surprised if anyone at the current incarnation of Speakerlab would be able to provide any useful input. It would be interesting to see and hear what they're up to, but since they abandoned their interest in horn-loaded designs decades ago, it probably won't help with this project.
Enjoy the process and please keep the forum posted with photos and results.
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Has anyone tried this and gone back to stock? I'm not aware of anyone doing that, but, if so, it would be interesting to know why.
Some time ago I discussed with Michael Colter building a test box and then sending it to him in Indy (I believe it's in one of the threads linked in one of my posts above). For many reasons I ultimately decided to close the tops and port out the back, with good results.
It would not be difficult, expensive or time consuming to build a test box to sit under a La Scala. You wouldn't even need to attach it; the weight of the cabinet with some foam insulation between would suffice. Then you could test and measure without the mod (A) and with the mod (
, with varying port tube sizes and configurations, network changes, etc.While it would have been great to have had the opportunity to measure and quantify the before and after performance of the speakers I modified, the bottom line is that my ears (reasonably sensitive measuring devices) preferred the modified versions. Irrespective of what the measurements might have indicated, I would have relied on my ears. It would have been silly to say, "I like the sound of B, but A measures better so I'll go with A."
On the other hand, if A and B sound the same and A measures better, then certainly I would go with A. That is especially true with respect to this mod as it would be pointless go to the effort and expense if there is not a perceived improvement. Because these were beater speakers (looks and potential re-sale were not important) that were being used by a high school band, it was not intimidating to cut into the dog house to port through the top. Nevertheless, had they not sounded better ported, they would have been quickly and easily returned to stock (with the exception of new BEC sourced GE caps in the networks and the bass bin braces).
If it sounds better, then, "[Measurements]? We don't need no stinking [measurements]." And, yes, I know that the original line from The Teasure of the Sierra Madre regarding badges was different, but Mel Brooks, in Blazing Saddles, and Click and Clack, on Car Talk, have made the "Badges? We don't need no sinking badges" version the parody standard.
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Erik,
That does look like a bargain, especially with your endorsement of the rebuilder. If I had $400 that I didn't know what to do with (which I don't) I'd jump on that amp. Some tube newb on this forum should get it and report back.
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The fact that Klipsch doesn't do it doesn't mean that it isn't a viable improvement; it could just mean that a business decision was made to not do it.<?xml:namespace prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" />
Look at some other decisions Klipsch made regarding La Scala:
four screws to attach woofer; horns mounted to back of baffle board; and 18 gauge zip cord.Would anyone seriously argue that:
using eight screws to mount the woofer; flush mounting horns to the front of the baffle board; and using heavier gauge wire are not relatively inexpensive "improvements?"I don't fault PWK's "not a dime's worth of difference" reasoning when making commercial decisions, but I wouldn't draw the conclusion that Klipsch would have done it if it were an improvement. Thirty years ago I put backs on Speakerlab SKs, like Klipsch did on the Anniversary Khorns.
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Go for it! You can't go wrong for $100. I used four of them in the 70s in a mobile DJ business. They had lots of bass. The following link might be useful.
Who made the Drivers for the Speakerlab K's
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The thread linked below contains links to most of the threads relating to the djk ported La Scala mod. It also details the process and results as applied to a pair of survivors of long-term duty in an <?xml:namespace prefix = st1 ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:smarttags" />Ohio bar. Their current location is far from ideal, but after listening to them in their current environment and under more favorable conditions, I would not own La Scalas without the mod. Even when done though the top of the dog house with the top enclosed, the mod is completely reversible, but I am not aware of anyone who has gone back to stock. <?xml:namespace prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" />
Ported La Scalas
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I still recommend getting them working with possibly refreshed capaitors and then listening to them before going off the deep end hot rodding them. Nevertheless, djk's (Dennis) ported La Scala modification is referenced at the following link and the threads linked therein. You might find it interesting. As Dennis said, if you want to do the port mod, then K-43s are the way to go. If you aren't interested in the port mod, then K-33s are the way to go.
FWIW, I did the port mod with K-33s and it was an improvement, but I defer to Dennis when he says its even better with K-43s. In either case, Bob Crites can fix you up with a new counterpart to either at a reasonable price.
Ported La Scalas
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I believe that Speakerfritz is correct. K-33s have a nominal impedance of 4 ohms. Nevertheless, the speakers in which they are used (La Scala, <?xml:namespace prefix = st1 ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:smarttags" />Cornwall & Klipschorn) have a nominal overall impedance of 8 ohms.<?xml:namespace prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" />
I would not describe woofers from Bob Crites as 3rd party. He gets his woofers from Eminence, as does Klipsch. Contact Bob about woofers, caps, etc.; hes a valuable source of info and stuff.
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RandG
The following is a lengthy thread, but at pages 4-6 you will see how La Scala woofers are accessed and you will also see new Crites woofers, albeit not the cast frame version. Whether or not you need to replace one or both woofers, I suggest inspecting each to make certain that all four of the machine screws into T-nuts that attach the woofers are present and tight. As it turned out, I replaced both woofers in the speakers that are shown in the thread.
Four abused Lascalas need a good home - sold
http://forums.klipsch.com/forums/616881/ShowPost.aspx
Good luck and many years of enjoyment.
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New (joined <?xml:namespace prefix = st1 ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:smarttags" />8/6/2007) member O.Castaneda resurrected this six-year-old relic. It's apparent that English is not O.Castaneda's first language. That is an observation, not a criticism. O.Castaneda's written English is much better than I could do in any language other than English.<?xml:namespace prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" />
O.Castaneda is selling Khorns that are described in this thread as 2003. In another thread (http://forums.klipsch.com/forums/thread/949404.aspx) they are described as 2004.
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If you've seen a Cornwall woofer, you've seen a La Scala woofer; same thing.
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I repeat. Don't feel obligated to do anything other than listen to music and enjoy them.
I feel like a pusher trying to get a new customer hooked on the illicit product. But if you are so inclined, this forum has a wealth of information regarding "improvements" for La Scalas. The link below includes links to many of the threads that I used to refurbish and then HOT ROD some La Scalas for the local high school band room.
Ported La Scalas
http://forums.klipsch.com/forums/thread/761099.aspx
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, with varying port tube sizes and configurations, network changes, etc.
Who did it, are you happy with it, would you do it again, etc. ... the Lascala Bass bin addition
in Technical/Restorations
Posted
I would not mess with the folded horn and potentially lose the speed of attack and detail.<?xml:namespace prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" />
In my experience this did not happen. To the best of my knowledge, no one who has tried the mod has rejected it to return to stock. Those are opinions based on experience; all other opinions are based on speculation.
It would be interesting to hear from someone who actually tried it but didnt like it, and to learn why they didnt like it, If such a person exists.