Marathon Man Posted April 20, 2002 Author Share Posted April 20, 2002 Thanks Manuel. I agree. ------------------ MM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boa12 Posted April 22, 2002 Share Posted April 22, 2002 mm, sorry i've never had anything w/ a pr, just ports & sealed here. i've wondered about that myself on the rsw. why not have the woof front firing & the pr toward the wall (for some reinforcement?)? ------------------ My Home Systems Page Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marathon Man Posted April 22, 2002 Author Share Posted April 22, 2002 Boa12, Yep. I tried it and wow what a difference. By turning te sub around and pointing the PR into the corner made a huge difference. The sub is very localized with the PR aimed out into the room. Once I turned it around I put my spl meter on it before making any volume adjustments and it droped about 10 db simply because now the sound is going away from the sitting position. This allowed me to add more volume to the sub, and push it further into the corner, to get the spl back up to around 80 db. Im getting much better bass response, and the localization is gone. Much much better. Another mod that I made this weekend was taking my center channel off the top of my RPJ TV, and putting it on a stand in front of the TV right below he screen. Now the imaging is so much better. It sounds as if the dialog on movies is comming from dead center of the TV screen, and is much more seamless with my mains. Not sure why, maybe it has something to do with the releation of the tweeters in the center with the mains. Oh well Im sure someone can add some clarity to that. Playing dts music titles like Steely Dan Gaucho is un-believable, its like listening to it for the first time. I have always heard that the center sitting on top of the TV aiming down in the listening position was a no no, but I did not think it would make that huge of a difference putting it below the screen in front. Just thought I would share that, but Im sure that most people have found that out already. Im a little slow to implement change . ------------------ MM This message has been edited by Marathon Man on 04-22-2002 at 03:13 PM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HornEd Posted April 22, 2002 Share Posted April 22, 2002 MarathonMan, putting your center nearer the floor gives a boost to the bass which is needed when the center has less cubic inches and woofer size in relation to the mains. Usually, tipping the lowered Center upward to aim the tweeters at your ears will also improve the center quality. The position above the TV is less desirable for one row of seating but advantageous for multiple HT rows. Enjoy! HornED Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marathon Man Posted April 22, 2002 Author Share Posted April 22, 2002 Ed, You are right. Thats the way I did it, and I can't get over the difference. Im really happy about that because I was wondering why my center just did not sound the way I thought it should. I could not put my finger on it. Now I know exactlly what was missing. Thanks for the input. ------------------ MM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boa12 Posted April 22, 2002 Share Posted April 22, 2002 oh thanks guys i have no choice spacewise but to put my c7 right ABOVE the screen. i have the horn aimed right at the sweet spot & the delay/distance set so that the sound seems to fall into the screen (distance set 4ft closer than the fronts). this can make a signif dif especially w/ the discrete center material. of course the low bass is filtered off to the sub which is pretty much right underneath the center/tv. afraid that'll have to work til i get a he type center &/or more placement options. ------------------ My Home Systems Page This message has been edited by boa12 on 04-22-2002 at 03:48 PM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marathon Man Posted April 22, 2002 Author Share Posted April 22, 2002 Boa12, I know what you mean. The last thing I wanted was something else on the floor. I really want to hide all my gear speakers and all, and only have the TV showing. Sometimes when you step back and look at the room it looks like just so much stuff to watch a movie or listen to a cd. Hopefully I will be getting a projector and screen at least im starting to work on my wife with that idea anyway. That will make things look much more tidy. Back to what I was saying. The last thing I wanted was something else on the floor, but after hearing over and over again that the ideal place for the center was under the screen I had to try it. Once I heard the diffrence I had to make it work. One other thing I did, and you should try this especially with the C7, of which Im sure you have either rf-5's or rf-7's to match. Set the main and the center to large. Leave the crossover on the ref-30 to default, then use the crossover on your sub to blend the crossover point. You may have to play with the slope to get it just right. I found that to make a difference as well even with the center on top of the TV. Out the window with the THX specs I say . I have all this time run all my speakers small. I am finding out that I have been missing the boat. ------------------ MM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boa12 Posted April 22, 2002 Share Posted April 22, 2002 m-man, i've been all thru the ropes on the bass mgmt, lg vs small issue. trouble i find w/ engaging the low pass on the sub itself is the ref 30 like most sends all LFE to the sub out/sub (no matter what the low bass mgmt. settings are). so the sub LP will cut LFE if engaged or set lower than 120hz (dolby specs). some may say LFE is just the sub 80 or 40hz stuff anyway, but when i tried the sub's LP here I did notice it was cutting LFE. i use the small for all & 50hz crossover point. 12db/oct slope for both high & low. i switch OUT the x-over on my velo hgs. believe me i've tried every dif connection & setting & that's what works best overall for me. of course all mileage may vary. ------------------ My Home Systems Page Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marathon Man Posted April 22, 2002 Author Share Posted April 22, 2002 Boa12, Dos'nt the subwoofer ultra setting cancel that? Im not sure I was planning to play with that tonight. ------------------ MM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boa12 Posted April 22, 2002 Share Posted April 22, 2002 m-man, no. that's a big reason why i got the ref 30 - something w/ an adjustable HP & LP (though it is global) so i could switch out the LP on the velo & drop down the cross from 80hz on the small settings. i've tried the ultra but still a bit better quality setting the mains to small (they're crossed down at 50hz anyway). w/ the ultra the mains play full out but the sub is still LP'd at the cross point in the ref30. just seems a bit smoother to me going w/ small there. LFE is really meant to go to the sub so you can't blame the makers for sending it all to the sub out as long as sub:yes is selected. the LP on the sub's go back to the days of running the sub with the old stereo receivers. no reason to use them w/ today's processors imho. they do that. the only way to not lose some LFE would be to send LFE to both the sub & fronts, though i don't think that's good either - fronts shouldn't be handling LFE. so w/ most set-ups, engage the sub's LP crossover & you lose LFE if it's there. only exception i've seen is yammy that does have a setting to send LFE (not just low bass) to both sub & mains. but again i wouldn't want to do that anyway. ------------------ My Home Systems Page Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marathon Man Posted April 22, 2002 Author Share Posted April 22, 2002 gotcha, I guess I could set the mains to large, cancel the lp on the sub, then set the crossover on the ref-30. This way I get full range to my large speakers, LFE to the sub, and my small settings which are only for two side in walls would be crossed at whatever I decide. Best of both worlds. Good point. I have the sub lp engaged, and have the ref-30 crossed at 75 Hz. I can flip that around as mentioned above, and not miss any LFE. I did not even stop to think that the subs lp would effect theh LFE, but I guess thats just common sense. Oh well Im getting old what can I say. ------------------ MM This message has been edited by Marathon Man on 04-22-2002 at 04:50 PM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danartdis Posted April 22, 2002 Share Posted April 22, 2002 Hey Boa, How long have you had your Velo? Did you audition lots of others? It seems to me to be the best combo of size and performance. I have the JBL that everyone is getting and finally got it hooked up on Saturday. It sounds much better than the KSW-12 but this thing is big, maybe too big. Would love to get the HGS-18 someday but I cant scrape together 2K right now. Anyway, thanks for any comments. Dan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boa12 Posted April 22, 2002 Share Posted April 22, 2002 m-man, beware though when you lower the cross on the ref 30 it also takes the speakers set small HP down lower that you may want (crossover is global). that's what makes it a delicate balancing act when you have both big & small speakers (i have klf-30, C7(2), & cornwalls. i've found the 50hz point works best for all taken together overall. dan, love the velo though i would have prefered a lower price of course. does it all for me in music & HT but would be best to demo one w/ your set-up. heard the HGS II is even out or coming soon so maybe they'll lower prices on the I. it's pretty small in size considering the punch it packs. ------------------ My Home Systems Page Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marathon Man Posted April 22, 2002 Author Share Posted April 22, 2002 Boa12, yeah I know. I have not changed it yet. It was just a thought. I might set the fronts and the center back to small now that I have the center below the screen. I only set it to the large setting trying to make the thing sound better when it was up high. I will play around with it and go with whatever sounds best. Thanks man. ------------------ MM This message has been edited by Marathon Man on 04-22-2002 at 06:56 PM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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