MD1032 Posted July 21, 2005 Share Posted July 21, 2005 Hey guys, I'm planning to upgrade my PM4.1's to a pair of Klipsch B3's hopefully by the end of the summer, but I need advice on what subwoofer I may or may not want to pair with it. Those who have them say that you don't need a subwoofer, but I'm guessing I'm going to want to add some extension to their sound, and seeing as how the RW-8's are going so cheaply on ebay, I was thinking I'd get one of those when the time came. Powerful 8" woofer, advanced port technology that undoubtedly has a miniscule amount of turbulence compared to my PM4.1 subwoofer, large amp. It looks like a budget beast to me. I don't think it will have a problem not only filling my very small room (10' x 13.5' x 8'), but adding that extension that I may desire that the 6.5" woofers on the B3's may not give me, though I have heard they put out some nice bass. Thanks for any advice. The RW-8's go for about $225 on ebay, so if you're going to recommend something different, keep it around there. I heard the sub-10 in Best Buy and it sounded horrible. Hopefully your experiences are otherwise. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrWho Posted July 21, 2005 Share Posted July 21, 2005 Well I would vote for the sub-10 or sub-12, which would end up costing you about the same. The fact that they didn't sound good at best buy doesn't mean much because those demo systems are never set up properly...not to mention the poor acoustical environment. I don't think I would even consider going the RW-8 route...too small of a driver to do anything usefol (especially for $200). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MD1032 Posted July 21, 2005 Author Share Posted July 21, 2005 ---------------- On 7/21/2005 3:19:33 PM DrWho wrote: Well I would vote for the sub-10 or sub-12, which would end up costing you about the same. The fact that they didn't sound good at best buy doesn't mean much because those demo systems are never set up properly...not to mention the poor acoustical environment. I don't think I would even consider going the RW-8 route...too small of a driver to do anything usefol (especially for $200). ---------------- So you don't think that even though it's an 8" driver it won't supply any real extension? The sub-10 is probably not setup correctly as you said. The entire control console is messed up and I wouldn't doubt their setup is less than spectacular. So you think the sub-10 and sub-12 would end up costing about the same? They differ about $70 I think in retail price, which is a significant difference for me. Where would you recommend I get either of these where they would be cheaper? Thanks for the advice. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CAS Posted July 21, 2005 Share Posted July 21, 2005 ---------------- On 7/21/2005 11:51:35 AM MD1032 wrote: but adding that extension that I may desire that the 6.5" woofers on the B3's may not give me, though I have heard they put out some nice bass. ---------------- To what point are you desiring usable extension? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MD1032 Posted July 21, 2005 Author Share Posted July 21, 2005 Well I'm really just asking for whatever will get me to the depths of most normal music, as well as being able to shake things around with bassy songs. I want to be able to hit 30 hz. "with authority", as RDMarsiii would say. Right now about 35 hz. is where the PM4.1 is truly "usable" to, though I can obviously reach lower. Right around there is where things begin to drop off steeply. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrWho Posted July 21, 2005 Share Posted July 21, 2005 RW-8: 32-120Hz ±3dB 103dB @ 30Hz 1/8 space, 1 meter PM 4.1: 29Hz - 20kHz 110dB SPL -------------------------------- Not only is the 4.1 sub going to give you more output, but it's also going to play lower. I would suggest just dropping in the new sats and then later down the road save up your money for a bigger better sub. No sense in buying something that won't be with you the rest of your life, let alone won't outperform what you already have. Sub-10: 28HzHz-120Hz +/- 3dB 115dB @30 Hz 1/8 space 1 meter Sub-12: 24Hz-120Hz +/- 3dB 117dB @30 Hz 1/8 space 1 meter I originally thought the new synergy subs were cheaper, but alas they are not. Sub-12: $500 Sub-10: $400 You pretty much won't find them for cheaper unless you can find some B-stock or win a bid on ebay. They're relatively new so I can't imagine the used market being that big yet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MD1032 Posted July 21, 2005 Author Share Posted July 21, 2005 Thanks for the reality check! I'll save up for the sub-10 unless anyone else has any other recommendations for a better subwoofer for under $300 or so. I'm not "dropping in" the B3's, so to speak. I don't think the 4.1 amp would drive them nearly the way I'd like them to be. I'm actually going to be pulling out our "vintage" you could call it, Pioneer SX-3700 amp, which is in 100% working order (ok, maybe it needs a little deoxit) and is rated at 45 WPC, if that means anything. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrWho Posted July 21, 2005 Share Posted July 21, 2005 That was going to be my next recommendation, sounds like you're getting on the right track! You're gonna have a pimp system by the time you get into college...and that's when the fun really begins Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
007 Posted July 21, 2005 Share Posted July 21, 2005 Go with the sub-10, ask for 10% off at best buy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MD1032 Posted July 21, 2005 Author Share Posted July 21, 2005 Ask for 10% off? You mean if I ask for it, I'll just get it? You mean the amp thing, DrWho? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrWho Posted July 21, 2005 Share Posted July 21, 2005 ya, going to a seperate amplifier should have all sorts of benefits not to mention will run a lot colder (which is nice when it's hot in the summer and the last thing you want is more heat in your bedroom). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MD1032 Posted July 21, 2005 Author Share Posted July 21, 2005 The PM4.1's run pretty hot. In fact, they are warm all the time just sitting here. My biggest concern using the B3's with the PM4.1's, if I went that route for whatever reason, would be the limitations the amp would put on them. It just wouldn't drive them properly, and also there would be a crossover I wouldn't want in there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
InnovaZero Posted July 22, 2005 Share Posted July 22, 2005 I agree go the sub-10 or sub-12 route. It sucks you had a bad experience, but I can assure you they are quite something else..esp. the sub 12...that sucker has some grunt. However just to clarify, the 4.1's in no way reach 29 hz, not unless at an EXTREMELY low volume, or with a tone of port noise. They are good to abut 35hz in movies, and about 40hz in music. The sub can reach around 105db at max volume, around the ports tuning freq. which is I believe 50-53hz. MD, even though it's pretty much agreed that the 4.1 has the easiest going slope of all promedia systems (basically, they leak as far down as the 80hz area at higher volume, reason why the midbass drivers in the 4.1's always over excursioned at 100db or more). I'd still go for a seperate reciever or what not. Better quality, more freedom to do whatever, and would run cooler, more efficently. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MD1032 Posted July 22, 2005 Author Share Posted July 22, 2005 ---------------- On 7/22/2005 9:59:30 AM InnovaZero wrote: I agree go the sub-10 or sub-12 route. It sucks you had a bad experience, but I can assure you they are quite something else..esp. the sub 12...that sucker has some grunt. However just to clarify, the 4.1's in no way reach 29 hz, not unless at an EXTREMELY low volume, or with a tone of port noise. They are good to abut 35hz in movies, and about 40hz in music. The sub can reach around 105db at max volume, around the ports tuning freq. which is I believe 50-53hz. MD, even though it's pretty much agreed that the 4.1 has the easiest going slope of all promedia systems (basically, they leak as far down as the 80hz area at higher volume, reason why the midbass drivers in the 4.1's always over excursioned at 100db or more). I'd still go for a seperate reciever or what not. Better quality, more freedom to do whatever, and would run cooler, more efficently. ---------------- Yeah, I'm saying I WANT usable bass down to 30 hz. The PM4.1 I've found has present and acceptable bass down to 40-35 hz. like I said, and after that you get seriously diminishing bass quality. So how low can the sub-10 hit? I'm actually not quite as concerned about depth as I am tightness. I want zero port noise. Nothing but what I need. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kenratboy Posted July 23, 2005 Share Posted July 23, 2005 Well, I hope to do a full writeup when I get my SUB-12, I have a few other things to compare it to/I know what sounds good at home. I am optimistic that the SUB-12 will be the $500 (retail) sleeper - if you go to Best Buy, pull it off the shelf, and look at it, there is no question it is a serious piece of hardware (for example, the RCA inputs are heavy lugs like you find on a $3,000+ amplifier, not just a little RCA jack sticking out of a hole) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MD1032 Posted July 23, 2005 Author Share Posted July 23, 2005 So would someone mind explaining how I can get that 10% off on the B3's or sub-10? That's a pretty decent amount of savings. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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