strutter

I'm 36 and though I'm not sure i think they were reruns i watched as a kid. came on PBS. a couple of friends and i would get together and watch it whenever we could. it really would be disappointing to watch them now and not like it (so many other shows i used to love seem so corny now). i knew it was B rated scifi way back then though and still enjoyed it (i think thats why). the show definitely had a cult following ,even then, i think it takes a special sort of person to appreciate it. the only problem is they are a bit lacking in the bass, though just about any speaker that size will be. sort of what i was thinking too. difficult to get good bass out of a 5" speaker and such small enclosures. maybe I'll still give them a try..might look around and see what others are available first. don't suppose anyone makes an outdoor sub? could use the 8" Denon to rattle the deck boards! [<)]

it's a lot easier to hear that the speaker is clipping (being overdriven) because you will hear distortion; either the woofer bottoms out or chuffs and the midrange just gets real nasally and annoyingly shrill sounding. It's hard to hear when an amp is about to clip that was going to be my next question on the forum. i know what an over driven speaker sounds like but what does a clipping amp sound like? can you actually hear something missing from the sound? does it pop? sound scratchy? It's hard to hear when an amp is about to clip, which is bad because once it does clip at those volumes, the already warm voicecoils are quick to burn up it just toasts the speaker leaving you wondering why........by the time you hear it ,it's too late?

I think that makes about half a dozen guys on the forum that have seen the show. does that make me old?[][] don't think I'll buy the DVD's I'd like to watch them though I find it interesting though that Kait (the gf) totally picks out most everything I notice "wrong" with speakers too yep, sometimes i swear she's just ignoring me, especially when she repeats what I've just said in verbatim but says she didn't hear me say that when i tell her "thats what i just said" thanks for all the help. i think i will still be on the lookout for a deal on a receiver that satisfies my desires but wont be in such a hurry. I am currently looking at subs. and outdoor speakers. Christmas ain't far away, maybe i can talk the in-laws into believing that my kids really need them from Santa this year![6] do you have any experience with the Klipsch Synergy Series 2-Way Indoor/Outdoor Speakers Model: KHO-7 (found at BB site)

Drwho (loved that show as a ***/teen by the way, should be in rerun now but sadly isn't) wonder why it blanked out the word preteen above wonder if it will do it again? pre-teen....preeeteeeeen

jeff-The Denon speakers were surrounds that came with a home theater in a box. not sure about the quality of these surrounds but they do make some highly acclaimed speakers under the mission label. but none any larger than bookshelves. and yep i know the technics i had were crap. but they worked for me until i got more interested in real sound and video. and they were second hand at 50$ for the pair. and lasted me 5 years. thanks for the link.

Drwho (loved that show as a preteen/teen by the way, should be in rerun now but sadly isn't) wow thats a lot of info..exactly what i hunger for. The reason your receiver can go above 0 is if you have your channel settings set to 0. Let's say you boost the center channel by 18dB (i know it's not possible, but just an analogy). when you turn the volume up to 0, your center channel is actually at 18 which is now running the amplifier wide open. I'm not sure about your model, but I've seen them where the absolute max gets reduced when you boost the gain on a single channel. the manual says if the volume for any channel is set at +1db or greater , the volume cannot be adjusted up to 18db. (in this case the maximum volume is adjusted to "18db _(maximum value of channel level)".) If however your wife is satisfied listening at 0, then by all means keep your current setup and save your money for other more important upgrades...one of the main reasons we naturally enjoy loud music is because we enjoy having a physical response to the music. And one thing that greatly improves the experience is a really potent subwoofer - so I would suggest saving up for a Sub-12 to go with your mains - not only will you get more impact from the music, but you can set your mains to small which will greatly improve the midrange response she actually says 0 is too loud (feedback in her hearing aids) which is a good thing for my speakers i suppose. she has lost almost all of her high frequency and is overly sensitive to low frequency. a larger sub is in the works. she'll just have to turn it down when I'm not here if it bothers her . my current sub is a Denon 8" that came with the home theater in a box. 8" sub ha ha ha.. And lastly, does your Denon have a Zone 2 feature on it yes, actually it does. tried it with very small speakers, sounds crappy. before i fried the technics i would carry them outside and plug them up. they sounded good enough. i will look into the outdoor speakers or maybe some decent bookshelf speakers and just carry them out when i want to. yep. it's hurtin' ...but feed me as much as you can stand .. i can handle it.

the Denon volume is adjustable from -70 to 18db (don't know how accurate the db level is). lounging around listening to music i usually have it at about -10 and need to turn it down to hear people trying to talk to me. if I'm on the deck with windows open it may reach 0. kind of scared to go any higher but would like to be able to without damaging the speakers. i fried 3 Denon surrounds 80wrms, 2 tweeters in technics floorstand 120wrms, (separate occasions, same receiver) with the volume never any higher than 5. (they weren't near as efficient as klipsch). that is the cause for my concern. i paid a whole lot more cash for klipsch than i have ever paid for a speaker before (probably more than all totaled). i don't want to screw them up. by the way i have perfect hearing (tested yearly as work requirement) and have been loving it loud for a long time. SWMBO on the other hand has nerve deafness (from birth) and tends to listen at higher volumes than i. wish i could put a Governor on the volume knob to prevent her from inadvertently screwing up my speakers. if i were to purchase a new receiver what is a good rule of thumb for wattage? 1.5x speaker RMS per channel? (i know theres more involved than watts. THD,frequency response, etc, ) just questioning recommended watts right now.

At 1 watt your F3's are pushing out 97dB (notice the sensitivity rating on the website). For every doubling of the watts you get a 3dB increase in volume (so 100dB = 2 watts, 103dB = 4 watts, 106dB = 8 watts........115dB = 64 watts). 80watts comes to about 117dB of output. 150 watts is 119dB, so you're only going to gain 2dB by going with the Denon amplifiers. Keep in mind that this only corresponds to maximum SPL (SPL = sound pressure level and is a measure of how loud something is). I'm not really sure it's worth all the trouble just to gain a small 2dB. just reread all this again.......veeeerrrrrryyyyyy sloooooooowly this time. i think i understand so how does one determine SPL?

so in your opinion is my worry about clipping an 80wpc amp powering klipsch synergy F-3's a necessary worry? A speaker rated at 90dB will be 90dB with 1 watt, etc etc. Basically the sensitivity of the speaker dictates the starting point and then you can calculate max SPL's and all that from there so does sensitivity = decibels? a 97 sensitivity = 97 decibels @ 1 watt?

if you want a killer theatrical show nothing beats KISS.

Eric Carr for skill Peter criss for flamboyance drum kits rising 100 feet above the stage, fireworks, explosions. they even rotated it completely upside down and never missed a beat! thats showmanship and skill. their drum solos on the live albums are killer. i rely miss the solo's that were so prevalent on many 70's rock tracks.(both drum and guitar)

Thanks a lot. i didn't know what 80 watts = in decibels. it does seem that i don't have much to gain by adding the 150w Sherwood. the system plays plenty loud in my 22'x27'x11' room. i was just really worried about clipping the amp and damaging the speakers. i do love it loud! and since the neighbor don't mind mowing lawn at 10 at night i don't mind cranking it early Sunday morning.[6]

quick comment on bill h. quotes. had it not been for BB carrying the synergy line i would not have purchased them. mine were paid for entirely by gift cards from BB. i would have probably ended up with JBL or something less enjoyable. the JBL's i listened to at BB simply were not in the same class as the klipsch even though similarly priced. i am very happy with my purchase. even got some money back as they went on sale shorty after i purchased them (you gotta keep checking, most people don't) and am glad BB had them. However the sales man was quick to sell me any speaker i was looking at and whatever i was looking at at that time was "the best" in his opinion. i let my own ears decide.

I like mine ........a lot. i can hear picks on guitar strings and singers lips smacking when singing. things i never new where there before. mine are powered by a Denon AVR683. you are getting a darn great deal!

thanks Michael, great elaboration, now i understand. dragonflr.. i like your signature.. its like I don't know what I don't know

KISS first and foremost. but love all heavy metal ( black sabbath all versions, Ozzy , iron maiden, Judas priest, quiet riot, twisted sister, anthrax, bio hazzard, ac/dc) you get the point. new rock (not sure what they call it) (evanescence, nickle back, green day, chevelle) new metal( metallica, pantera, megadeth)goth metal( Marilyn Manson, type o negative) old punk ( corrosion of conformity, misfits , circle jerks, plasmatics) Rock ( journey, Chicago, heart, reo speedwagon, fleetwood mac. ect.) guitar rock(malmstein, Santana, Zack wylde)some country (mostly old) (Conway twitty, George Jones, johnny cash, Charlie rich, Charlie pride, Freddie fender).old rock ( Janis Joplin, jimmy Hendrix, doors) rock n roll (50's) don't listen to much symphony or jazz..........but i would before i did rap I LOVE IT LOUD

colterphoto1, interesting. could you elaborate on everything you said. I'd like to understand that better

thanks travisc.....glad to be here....some other forums arent very newbie friendly.[] sad to hear that i may not be able to connect the two. i suppose i'll have to look at other ways to feed more watts to the F-3's

if its supposed to actually be labeled pre amp out ....then no.

thanks marvel i check that out also

the best for the least is my motto. but if i had to put a number on it i suppose "SWMBO" would let me spend 2k but i could probably find a little more if needed and hide the receipt. I'll check out the B&K (ugh, is that the actual name or is that short for something?) and determine if it is adequate for my needs. I'm not very hip on the amp and pre amp thing , I've never dealt with separates before. what should i look for to be able to connect these two components together. could you point me toward a web site that describes the connection ? i live in a really rural area there are no high end shops around here, even the nearest best buy is 40 miles away. all they carry is integrated units. i had to drive 50 miles 5 years ago to get my Denon. i shop for info on the web, narrow my choices, then make the drive to finalize. Not doing to good a covering up the newbie am i? always learning

I've been trying to figure out how to connect a older Sherwood 2 channel receiver 150 watts per channel @ 8 ohm to a not as old Denon 5.1 avr683 80 watt per channel @ 8 ohm . my intention is to get more watts. per channel out of the Denon. can this be done? if so exactly how do you accomplish this?

i am interested in hearing what 5.1 receiver you all suggest for my situation. the room is 22'x27' with 11' ceilings. half of this is carpet. half is hardwood flooring. walls are fairly sparse so i know i have some work to do with the acoustics. the sound is somewhat bright at times but not at all unbearable. speakers used are F-3, C-3, S-3 all Klipsch Synergy III. the sub is an 8" Denon (soon to be replace by something bigger)The receiver will be used for 50/50 music and movies. i love it loud so it must supply lots of clean watts without clipping. currently i use a Denon AVR-683 80wpc @8ohm .05thd. i had a transformer in it replaced not long ago and while out for repair i also bought all new speakers to replace 3 blown ones. i would like to retire this one to the bedroom where it will lead a less stressful life. can anyone suggest a reciever that will push these speakers to their full potential without clipping? what amp will sound best with klipsch synergy III speakers and why?