KT88
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Posts posted by KT88
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I have just seen this ebay offer by chance, if you do not already know about it. Having all the parts a local tech should be able to do the job.
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sorry double post, the Klipsch site was not accessible after I posted.
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35 minutes ago, Schu said:
this is... ONCE AGAIN... an issue of Economics and not one of scientific relevance. If anyone wants to spend 500$ on a machined billet aluminum bracket when a 10$ stamped steel bracket can do the same work, why should we not be allowed to use Billet aluminum? Common mass mentality is that you've wasted 490$ when if fact you merely made a decision based on economics.
if you want beautiful stranded and woven cables, by all means use them.
in as far as 'expectation' bias... I have a different view point. if I am choosing to use something that costs me inordinately more to use, my 'Bias' is not one of justification, but one of criticality... In other words, I am actually going to be MORE CRITICAL of that item, not less critical.
I don't want to recommend or suggest anything to anyone. What was the starting point for my first post: The thread opener has been using quite expensive cables that he liked. He needs more of them due to changes in the stereo setup. So for this specific case he asked and I thought about it, what is just as good but not as expensive? I thought I could give input because I recently had a very good experience with a much cheaper cable than the price of my old Kimber 8TC cables by chance.
So my post was just referring to this specific case where someone wants to save money but still get a comparable solution.
Apart from this individual case, everyone can do what they want. There are so many types of hi-fi enthusiasts, so many budgets and so many preferences. Everything has its justification and everyone should have fun with what they consider to be beautiful and important.
When the discussion of the answer posts started, I wanted to point out to the supporters of the camp of inexpensive cables that there are cables for marginally more money that could be significantly better. If someone from the exclusive cable camp wants to enjoy their expensive cable, they are welcome to do so. I hope that the forum members have understood me in this way. Everyone has weaknesses for expensive and perhaps not always rationally explainable products. That's all very well. For example, I enjoy a Les Paul Beano Eric Clapton. Rationally speaking, a normal Les Paul would be perfectly adequate for my playing style. Very probably a Korean Les Paul copy would be sufficient for my playing skills. So what's the point. I respect people who are economical just as much as I respect people who enjoy special things, even if they are speaker cables. There is no reason to polarize this discussion from my point of view. I totally agree with you that anyone who likes it should buy natural wool braided cables.-
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9 minutes ago, wuzzzer said:
The human brain is an amazing thing. If you spend enough money on something that's supposed to make something sound better, it will.
Nevertheless, I have the impression that you don't differentiate in a way that someone could. I think spending hundreds or thousands of dollars on speaker cables is a lot of nonsense. But if I can buy a cable for 6 dollars per meter that can keep up with the most expensive cables, why should I prefer a dollar for a meter of lamp strips? that's a difference of 40 dollars for 2x4 meters, for example. So not more than one fill-up. In my experience, it's really worth it.
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23 hours ago, wuzzzer said:
There shouldn’t be any reason why going from 3m to 8m long cables should cost more than $20. And since you have Klipschorns I’m assuming you can afford that.
Ok, we have a faction here that says that the cheapest cables are good enough. I don't belong to that camp. In my experience, cables can make a difference. However, the Canare 4S11 is not a "compromise". Some people have given up their €2000+ cables for it.
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1 hour ago, Capitalcityguy said:
I also use the Canare 4S11. They took awhile to burn in but once they did, I found them to be better in my system than the any of the other more expensive speaker cables I have tried. These include the Sword Supras, Audience AU24, JP Labs.
See also the „extended version“ in the other thread. Meanwhile I also think that the 4S11 becomes more and more 3D
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Congratulations on your new acquisition. I can't wait to hear what you have to say. Especially as you have the HJ in the same place in the same room and have obviously gotten to know the UJ very well over the years.
I share the UJ with you and also your taste in whisky. A Port Charlotte, for example, among all the other potions on your windowsill also feels very comfortable in my home😀-
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3 hours ago, babadono said:
I paid probably around $2.25 a meter for what I use. And I chose it for how it looks once I realized what I built into the walls was not sufficient. My opinion is save your money on cables and put it where it counts...on your speakers.
There's no reason why I shouldn't try out these cables or similar as well if the occasion arises.
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43 minutes ago, babadono said:
I think he has La Scalas......
All my speaker cables in the 2 channel room are over 8 meters. Amp rack is remotely located in utility room. The longer the speaker cable the greater in size it needs to be to keep resistance loss as low as the shorter cable. Will there be a small loss in the higher frequencies because of more capacitance and inductance? Probably. Can you hear it? Only your ears will tell you that. Turn up the treble control or EQ on the high freqs.
Star Quad cable for speaker cable is overkill IMHO.
If you can have it for 6 Euros oder Dollars a meter? BTW the Audioquest 5 also is a kind of a star quad cable.
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8 hours ago, Flevoman said:
Probably this question will yield answers that are diametrically opposed. But I still hope it can lead me to a choice.😇
My situation is as follows.
My AL5 speakers were set up against the long wall in the width direction. My audio set neatly positioned between the speakers and connected with speaker cables (Audioquest 5).
For several reasons (including an acoustic issue), I have now set up my speakers lengthwise as a test.
This resulted in some very positive improvements to the sound. Therefore, I am strongly considering leaving this setup like this, but it will require a drastic investment, such as purchasing different furniture and speaker cables. Because to make this work, I can no longer place my audio set between the speakers and am forced to leave it in the old position, requiring speaker cables of 8m length now.My problem is that I have no idea if increasing from 3m length to 8m length will result in audible quality loss.
The only way to test this is to try it myself, but it will be a quite expensive test since I cannot return the cables if it turns out to be disappointing.What is your experience, does 8m length cause a loss in the audio signal?
And if this shouldn't be a problem, what values should I consider when choosing the cable? For example, is 2.1mm per conductor sufficient?I used Kimber 8TC for over 20 years and never thought about it again. For a year now, our daughter and her husband have had a nice little stereo system, a Bluesound Power Node together with Stirling Broadcast LS3/5a speakers that fit perfectly acoustically into their smaller living room (I also have such Stirling speakers in addition to my Klipsch speakers and I like them very much for what they are).
Then there was the question of the speaker cable at my daughters place. Having been out of the market for 20 years, I rummaged through some hifi forums. I noticed that cables from very professional studio equipment companies were mentioned very positively more often. So I took it sporty and built Japanese Canare 4S11 Star Quad cables (not as bi-wiring item, but two wires each for plus and minus together) as bulk cables at 6.50 € per running meter. I used Deltron banana plugs for 1.15 € each. In the end I was very surprised that I liked it even better than the Kimber 8TC (nowadays 140 € to 160 € a mono meter in my country). Less "hifi", so without the slight presence boost of the Kimber, which can be a bit too much with some music) but much more musical flow and neutrality delivered by the Canare.This is a very subjective topic and it is never possible to give a general recommendation or make an "objective" statement. But I can say that with the price difference between the Kimber 8TC and the Canare 4S11, my heart beats for the Canare in any case, not only because of the price difference. For a fair comparison, I even cut off the 20-year-old banana plugs of the Kimber cable (possible oxidation) and replaced them with newly soldered Deltron plugs.
In various forums, some people say that the Canare 4S11 needs a long break-in period of up to 400 hours. Personally, I don't believe in the myth of long break-in times, no matter what it is, caps, amps, tubes cables etc.
But...I do notice that the treble becomes more open and brilliant, much more spacious. The bass is drier, deeper and stronger. But no frequency range stands out unpleasantly. It is absolutely naturally balanced overall.
I thought it would be funny to make an experiment about which I have not read in the web right now: I soldered two pairs of the Canare 4S11 at the same time so that I wouldn't deceive myself. One pair has been playing in my system since 5 weeks, alternating between Underground Jubilees and Stirling Boradcast monitors. I put the other pair of Canare (same lngth, solder and plugs, made at the same day) on the shelf immediately after assembly. I won't connect it up for the first time for another 6 or seven weeks, say. Then I'll see if I'm just imagining any break in changes (which I now think they are there) or if the unplayed cable really sounds same same. This test I will do with friends and my family as well.So, Flevoman, if you calculate, your Audioquest 5 costs about 30 € per meter as bulk cable.
The Kimber 8TC costs about 140 € per meter bulk:
https://www.dienadel.de/kimber-kable-8tc-whiteclear-ls-kabel-meterware/a-353631842
The Canare costs ca. 6.20 € one meter bulk (the only place where to get them in Europe)
Regarding the length of the speaker cable:
If you scroll down the page/link below, the damping factor for the Canare 4S11 is 50 up to a cable length of more than 10 metres. By the way, don't be impressed when some people say "only stranded is good, or stranded is bad and only solid cable is good. It's rubbish and marketing. I give all cables a chance when listening. But what I have to say is that hardly anyone of the "high end" cables gives as many important parameters of their cable (R, L, sometimes even Z, C) as the professional companies do (Canare, Mogami, Belden etc.).Here about the length of the cable scroll down a bit:
https://www.canare.co.jp/en/products/cables/index.php?tid=4_008
There you will see that the Canare 4S11 has a damping factor of 50 for a length of over 12 metres. And a damping factor of 20 at almost 40 metres. For me, that counts for more than snake oil recipes. (I don't mean that e.g. Audioquest is dubious, no, it's a very reputable company, but there are also the black sheep).
So with a length of 8 metres (please do not "bi-wiring" such a 4S11 cable but take the two red and the two white wires together each) you are completely on the safe side. I use 5 metres and can't hear any difference to my daughter's 3,5 metres.
One more point about the plugs. If you use banana plugs. There is also a lot of metallised snake oil here. I don't think people talk about anything more stupid than plug quality and material. What influence should such a short piece of connector have on the overall length of a cable? If it were so critical, nobody would use gold-plated plugs. Because gold has only 30% conductivity (which many people don't realise) while silver has 80% conductivity. And if something exotic like iridium comes into play $$$, then you've fallen into the black hole of marketing. For me, a banana plug should be small, light and stable. And make very good contact with the amp and speaker.
I have used that plugs below in the link which fulfil my requirements. They are also hollow but a closed tube, i.e. stable and geometrically good conductors.https://www.tme.eu/de/details/579-0500/bananenstecker-4mm/deltron/
With white cap it costs 1,22 € instead of 2,18 € :))
It says nickel plated, but the plug is silver plated if you read the technical paper, of Deltron and if you want gold you can get it:
https://www.tme.eu/de/details/584-0100/bananenstecker-4mm/deltron/
I think I've seen some hifi shops selling these gold Deltron plugs under a different name (was it Naim?) for a lot more. And beware of Amazon in this case, they sell the very simple plugs like in the first link above for ca. 10 USD one piece.
https://www.amazon.de/-/en/579-0100-Banana-Black-Non-Insulated-DELTRON/dp/B013RLNX9S
So in the USA just shop at Mouser or similar.
The really important thing is that only these cheap but smart Deltron plugs have a steel spring and the whole plug forms a stable contact on the opposite side of the steel spring without gas inclusion. The surface area is much larger than that of normal banana plugs with their many thin, elongated springs or those hollow open tubes that are so prone to breaking off. And you get no vibration of the plug.
Well, Deltron comes from measurement technology and not from hi-fi fantasy land.
I'm not related to anyone at Canare or Deltron, just a satisfied customer.
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9 hours ago, Fotis1972 said:
Many many thanks for your help, you are very informative, I have eversolo a6 and now with new firmware there is eq, peq, fir etc so this would be helpful
What cables do you use, did you see changing cables big sound variations?
I'll try your bad recordings to see how they sound to my system now
Unfortunately I have android so can't use house curve, but I'll found a friend with iPhone.... 😊
Thanks again 😍
About the speaker cables, I used Kimber 8TC for over 20 years and never thought about it again. For a year now, our daughter and her husband have had a nice little stereo system, a Bluesound Power Node together with Stirling Broadcast LS3/5a speakers that fit perfectly acoustically into their smaller living room (I also have such Stirling speakers in addition to my Klipsch speakers and I like them very much for what they are).
Then there was the question of the speaker cable. Having been out of the market for 20 years, I rummaged through some hifi forums. I noticed that cables from very professional studio equipment companies were mentioned very positively more often. So I took it sporty and built Japanese Canare 4S11 Star Quad cables (not as bi-wiring item, but two wires each for plus and minus together) as bulk cables at 6.50€ per running meter. I used Deltron banana plugs for €1.15 each. In the end I was very surprised that I liked it even better than the Kimber 8TC (nowadays 140€! a mono meter in my country). Less "hifi", so a bit less spacious but without the slight presence boost of the Kimber, which can be a bit too much with some music) but more musical flow of the Canare. This is a very subjective topic and it is never possible to give a general recommendation or make an "objective" statement. But I can say that with the price difference between the Kimber 8TC and the Canare 4S11, my heart beats for the Canare in any case. For a fair comparison, I even cut off the 20-year-old banana plugs of the Kimber cable (possible oxidation) and replaced them with newly soldered Deltron plugs.-
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I'm glad that I have a tone control, even if it's only analog and simple. But it makes many albums easy to listen to.
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Congratulations. I would listen to and enjoy the Macintosh at my leisure. You can always buy another amp, a tube amp. But what's wrong with your amp? Even if the CW4 has high sensitivity, it will still thank the amp for its good bass control. So first listen to what you have. And the SQ in all frequency ranges is proverbial with Mcintosh, whether solid state or tube.
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2 hours ago, Capitalcityguy said:
Thanks for chiming in everyone. Very helpful. I have had a lot of speakers, but was kind of an idiot when it came to audio. I kept trying gear and speakers to try something I liked. I never treated my room, so I was always looking for that magic formula. At my old house with a 14x20 room I had Montor Audio GS60s (harsh sounding), Fritz, Elac FS 409s, Elac 407 Black Edition, Proac D48Rs, Tidal Pianos. Most of those speakers were probably pretty good to okay, but again I was naive about room treatment and set up. It is all good, I learned a lot along the way. In 2022 I developed tinnitus and had to find speakers that were smooth but still enjoyable. I found the Warfedale Lintons. I loved them, yes they couldn't do some things that $16 grand Tidal Piano could do, but oddly enough, I enjoyed them more. I just moved to a new house with this huge room, I knew that Lintons couldn't move enough air for this big room so I bought the Polk R700s with the budget I had left after the move. I'm getting the best sound I have ever had, but this room is treated, I have dialed in my cabling and my amp really jives with the R700s, I could seriously live with these.
Because of tinnitus, I don't really listen loud and if I do it is not for long periods. The R700s are okay at low listening levels, but really come alive as you juice the volume. I am interested in the Corwalls because I keep reading they sound great at lower volumes. Plus, as mentioned looking for more extension on the guitars. The only time I have ever heard a Klipsch (other than my brothers little bookshelves and those were harsh/bright), was back in 1982. I was just 14 years old. I don't know which model it was, All these years I thought it was always the Klispchhorn, but that is to tall, the ones I heard were shorter/squatier so it may have been a Cornwall. My friends brother dropped the needle on Asia's Heat of the Moment (don't laugh) and I could not believe it, the opening guitar riff, so thick, so alive, so extended! I have always used that track to test speakers and to this day, I have never heard that track sound like it did in 1982.
Welcome to the forum, Capitalcityguy. I don't have a CW4 but vintage LaScalas and 2008 Underground Jubilees. What I also have is tinnitus, fortunately sometimes below the threshold of perception, but on some other days very noticeable and annoying. I can say from personal experience that horn speakers send the music "through the tinnitus beep" into my heart. I lack a better description. Even though I love my LS3/5a BBC speakers in a smaller room, the Klipsch, both models, manage to overcome the tinnitus much better with music in our larger living room at lower volumes than any conventional radiator. The big benefit of this is that you're not tempted to turn up the volume like with normal radiators. Because in the end, it is precisely the louder volume that is contra-productive for tinnitus. I think from what owners and reviewers say about the CW4, it retains the benefits of Klipsch sound and is smooth and non-fatiguing at the same time as I experience the merits of a tractrix horn with my UJ speakers which in principal the CW4 also uses in a smaller scale.
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@Flevoman I noticed something with my interlink cables that reminded me of the resonance problem with your LaScala. I have always used ready-made RCA cables, most of them with one running direction. Often the shield was only connected on one side, and the conductors were " quasi symmetrical". Now, out of curiosity, I have made up my own cheap Canare L-4E6S interlinks. The net is full of a lot of wrong and maybe right advice on how to configure an RCA cable. Most people say that they only connect the shield on the source side. The Canare L-4E6S is actually a star-quad microphone cable, it is used successfully in many studios as an XLR cable as well. On the forums of sound engineers and studio workers, however, it is emphasized that this cable must have the shield connected on both sides, even as an RCA cable, because only then does it really shield. In addition, the negative conductor together with the shield should have an even lower resistance than the „hot“ wire. Be that as it may, I tried it out and ended up using my ears as a benchmark.
1) Canare with only the shield on the receiving side: cloudy and undynamic
2) Shield only on the transmitting side, very dynamic but with just such a dull resonating sound around 100 to 150 Hz.
3) Shield on both sides: The thickened, flabby upper bass range has completely disappeared, even on different speakers. It is a clear and very defined spatial sound image with deep resonance-free bass...at least there is no added boominess.
Now I don't know if you are using RCA cables at all. But if you do, are they quasi-balanced cables or do they have the ground connected on both sides? If you happen to be using quasi-balanced cables, try a different RCA cable that has the shield connected on both sides, even if it's a cheap one just for a try. My next experiment will be RCA coax cables. A very friendly Japanese employee of Canare in Düsseldorf recommended them to me on the phone as the best for RCA.I don't know if my post is of any significance, but I didn't want to leave it untried
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12 hours ago, shawnwes said:
First post on the site and unable to message members directly yet.
Found it as I was searching for VTL Ultimate on the web as I've just purchased one and am looking for available documentation such as owners manual, schematic, etc. It's an early one - #106. Cal Blacksmith if you happen to see this post I know you still owned it as of a year ago and was wondering if you had any documents, and have the ability to scan, if you'd be willing to share a copy of whatever documentation you might have. I have found a copy of the VTL book vol 1 by David Manley and there's apparently some documentation there - hasn't arrived yet. Couldn't find anything on their site and have read they don't really make info avail or even sell it.
anyways it would be nice to hear about your experiences with it over the years & what if anything you've had to repair or modify, tube experience, etc.
Cheers,
Shawn
Kelowna, BC
@Cal Blacksmith Hi Cal, please see above.
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Thanks and back to Altec vs. LS.
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I'm a fan of active pre amps, but it doesn't necessarily have to have gain to get a good sound. I have the smallest pre amp from Croft from 1991, he built it as a pure tube cathode follower, so just this one stage. (with an additional phono input). Its purpose was to be used with vintage Leak amps which have a very high 10mV input sensitivity, almost like a guitar amp. I have two Leak Stereo 20s and a 30% attenuation of the gain in the Croft pre amp is exactly what I need when, for example, a CD player comes out with 1.5 V output voltage. The difference to the passive pre amp is that the Croft provides a rich and musical signal with a low output impedance, even though it does not amplify but attenuates.
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Active in the sense that it makes the output impedance low.
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1 hour ago, Invidiosulus said:
For many years the Altec horns were considered THE upgrade for a K400 on the LS/Khorn.
My LS will keep up with a lot of speakers out there but part of me still wants to build a set of A7 cabs.
Or maybe I’ll just refinish my LS in VOTT gray.
Do you hear a difference in the LS with your braces? Sorry if this question doesn't belong in this thread...but I'm curious.
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18 hours ago, Klipsch_Kid said:
I've got a jubilee speaker just sitting under my living room table I've got the horn with 6 of the kpt 250 cinema speakers I got then from the roll of dumpster outside of the movie theater in my 2 bedroom house I can only hook 2 up and they are still too much in interested in selling them but what to ask for I see the jubilee is going for 35k really and each one of the kpt-250's are going for $1900 really I mean I can kinda see it if the 2 I got hooked up are plenty for a concert I mean I never heard of klipsch until I found these I got video of the two hooked up in trying to post
I'm not sure if you can upload videos here, better on Youtube. As far as I know, you can only upload photos here in the forum. Otherwise, you could just make a few stills from the video to show them here?
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On 1/19/2022 at 6:50 PM, Khornukopia said:
A pair of Faital Pro HF 206 for the K-402 topped Klipschorns in the garage.
I first overlooked this Faital driver in your thread when I looked at your whole thread again two weeks ago, so actually I just looked at all the pictures again without reading the text and I thought back to the Corona time when some of us had a lot of time for things like handicrafts. So in 2009 I got a passive xover for my UG from a well-known third party provider. It was designed for the Faital HF200. I think it sounds quite passable, not comparable to my DSP solution with the TAD4002, but with better dispersion in the highs than the TADs (hence the second phase plug from Roy for the HJ, even if they use the Celestion).
For my passive third party Xover I bought Faital HF206 about 10 years ago, just like yours, so I used the HF206 with the Xover which was actually designed for the HF200. But the frequency response shown on the Faital page showed a smooth response, so I gave it a try. Before I saw your photo, I hadn't seen anyone using the HF206 with the K402 the same way I tried it. Because the HF206 uses a polymer diaphragm, the highs are very pleasant, vocals, violins etc all sound very good. But there is a lack of energy in the lower frequencies. It sounds too delicate and thin. The HF200 has a titanium diaphragm...very good for snares and toms. The HF206 is weak in precisely this frequency range. Do you have the settings for an active DSP for the HF206? I would like to try it again if, for example, the 500 Hz range gets a little boost. The dispersion behavior in the K402 is very good with the HF206.
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14 hours ago, Delicious2 said:
MyGod, it's full of stars...
…around a black hole.
@Khornukopia At first I didn't really like the "carbon fiber" look on the K402, I first saw it in your thread on April 22, 2020. But I like it more and more, actually a very cool look. And certainly not as demanding to do as the wood veneer foils (which always look very well done on your horns).
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10 hours ago, Ho_Leung said:
Try the Truth from the Horn Shoppe, it is an active pre, possible the best any where. hard to beat. Funny volume, but the remote is the bomb. it should be called the naked truth.
Interesting, I never heard about it before.
https://www.tnt-audio.com/ampli/the_truth_e.html
Need a reputible repair shop for a Nakamichi 482
in 2-Channel Home Audio
Posted
A very silly question, but sometimes it helps. Have you tried different cassettes? I remember in the past that some cassettes simply had too much friction and the take-up spool was not free. Or that the unwinding spool was blocked and the friction wheel together with the drive shaft could not transport. And cassettes become not better when aging.