Domain

bacvaedo, Well, you've saved me the trouble of posting something very similiar My setup is very similiar to your own (Denon 2801 / KSW-12 / Sub Out + Y Adapter). I find myself changing the level on the sub 10+ times a day, never finding a middle ground between music / HT. Now, i'm new to all of this (but working very hard to learn), so I could be (and most likely am) wrong, but I think the first problem lies with the Denon's Sub Out (at least in my case). I've calibrated the Denon's channel level (all to 75 db) with a SPL meter, and this seems to be good for HT application, but for music is seems useless. (In my room, the calibration produces the following results: Denon's Sub channel level @ 0db, Sub level at 9 o'clock). I listen at fairly low volume levels (-30 to -25 on the Denon volume level), and these settings prove good for HT (plenty of low end punch), but in music the sub doesn't even "wake up" at these volume levels. Upping the volume on the Denon to around -20 will activate the sub, but even then, its not audible (I have to crank the Sub's level to 12 o'clock to have nice, blending bass). Now, it would seem logical to just to leave the level on the Sub's at 9 o'clock, and up the Denon's Sub level, but this does absolutely nothing on my unit (no audible difference from 0db to +8db). The only way to get decent bass (without changing the Sub's level) its to crank the volume level on the Denon, which seems to double the bass output every +10 on the volume level (but makes it somewhat uncomfortable for casual listening). So, I'm beggining to think that the Sub Out isn't a good way to hook up the Sub, and after I finish moving, I suspect I'm going to try Speaker level.... Now as far as LFE is concerned, from what I've read, the "standard" provides for a 115db output on the sub at "reference" volume levels. However, the same sources also explain that this is not pratical for a HT application, since (at least lower end) consumer level equipment won't be able to produce these levels properly. I would also think that a "reference" volume level in a HT application wouldn't be very comfortable (105 db for the mains would be painful, and easily damaging to hearing). I would assume that calibrating the sub for +10db for LFE would not be an issue, as long as you didn't try to reach these "reference" levels, since it will never actually reach 115db output (but still get +10db over the other channels). Finally as far as Avia is concerned, I've been told that it is NOT recorded at +10db on the LFE (but Video essentials IS). I can't verify this, since I haven't purchased Avia yet (but plan to in the near future). There are a lot of links to LFE information (like BOA posted), and I read a really good one the other day, but I can't find it at the moment, so when I do i'll post it here. Domain Heres a link HornEd posted on the HT forum regarding LFE http://www.hometheaterhifi.com/volume_7_2/feature-article-misunderstood-lfe-channel-april-2000.html

I definately have to agree with jefnel1, U-571 (the depth charge scenes) is absolutely intense. You're sitting there...then boom, boom, boom... BOOOOOM. I had to look around to make sure it was the movie shaking and not the room. Domain

Thanks for the responses I called the dealer this morning, and he said I could just pay the difference to do a trade up on the KSW-12, so I suspect i'll head down there tommorow and make the trade. I'm still thinking the KSW-10 is capable of producing more then its currently is, but either way, i'd rather have more then enough power and turn the level down, rather then having the sub level on max all the time. Anyway, I appreciate all the information / advice. Domain Well I traded to the KSW-12 this afternoon, and it was an instant improvement. Everything sounds absolutely stunning now, and finally nice, tight bass. All thats left is just making a few level adjustments when the SPL meter finally comes in Anyway, many thanks for all the advice and help, I'm off to listen to it for a long while

Well, I finally got home, switched the Denon setup to Front , Sub , Sub , unfortunately there isn't any noticeable difference in the sub output. Just to make sure i'm not crazy, I had someone else come listen with me, and they couldn't tell any difference either. I'll deal with it some more when I have a few days off, test the cable theory, and if it doesn't improve, i'll probably talk to the dealer to see what we can arrange on a KSW-12. Boa12, I think your refering to the SP-1's?? The SF-1's have a tranix horn/mid bass driver, but not the powered woofer. PaulE, I ended up with the Denon because it was more along the lines of what I wanted, and there would have been another reciever purchase in the future anyway (someone else in the family is looking at a set of Quint's). So I figured i'd get it out of the way now, get what I want, and be done with it Domain I didn't mention, but I played around with turning the sub on/off, and its not apparent that is even missing unless the level is past the 3 O'clock mark

I know how you feel on that, In the past month, 3 shipments from Fedex/USPS were "lost" with no explination. Two of them were backordered items, which now I have to wait on again. Fedex also pulled a great stunt the other day, I had ordered a DVD player, and he just "tossed" it under my garage door (didn't ring the doorbell, nothing). If I hadn't gone out for a smoke, I would have probably backed over it with the car. I dunno where the people who "cared" went, but I know I don't get to deal with them very often. Domain

DLUngurait, Thanks for the response Luckily the new monster cable will actually be cheaper then the one I am returning, so I really can't lose there I think. I'm only replacing the cable on the off chance that its having a problem (I read about someone having a similiar problem on the powered subs forum). I "think" this unit should be able to produce more then it is currently...I could be wrong though. As far as room placement, I've moved it just about everywhere, and the results are still unfortunately disappointing. Right now its at the far corner of the room, just about 6" from the adjoining walls. Anyway, after I try some of the previous advice/replace the cable, and if the results are the same, i'm think i'm going to go with the KSW-12. I hadn't planned to drop the extra $$$, but I don't think i'll happy unless I do. Domain

Steve, Thanks for the advice. I'll give that a try after I get off work late tonight and see if it makes a difference. I'm going to go ahead and return the current cable, and replace it with a Monster Bass 400. If that still doesn't make the difference, I'm considering talking with the dealer and see if I can just upgrade to the KSW-12. I don't need earth-shattering bass or anything, but if output is still a problem after all the above, I don't think the unit is powerful enough to keep up with the rest of the system. The SF-1's need very little volume to fill the entire room, and start filling other parts of the house too Thanks again, Domain

Finally got home, checked the cable, it does have the same "signal path" printed on the my particular Monster cable, but alas it was already going in the correct direction. Just for testing purposes, I reversed the cable, but it had no noticable effect. Thanks for the advice though Domain

Thanks Doug My main concern right now is the sub, which has little or no audible output. Currently this is how it is setup: KSW-10 (low pass @ 100Hz, level @ max) connected to line in via Monster M351??? subwoofer cable (w/ y adapter) to the Denon. The Denon is set to speakers all @ small, subwoofer to yes. However, even with the subwoofer level @ max, I have to crank the Denon subwoofer level to +6db or more to get any real audible output, otherwise, it just sits there looking pretty. (This is true for all sources, be it CD/DVD DD 2.0/DVD DD 5.1, etc). Its a small room ( 10x12 ), so I figure it should be potent enough for my needs, but right now its producing say about 1/10th the output of my Promedia v.2-400 sub ( only thing I have ATM to use for comparison ). I'm thinking the cable may be bad (after reading a similiar problem from the Powered Sub Topic), but unfortunately I can't get another until Monday (no one around here carries anything similar). Domain

Doug, The local Radio Shack supposedly ordered me that model a few days ago... I'm a little leary of having anything shipped lately, Fedex / USPS have "lost" 3 items shipped to me in the past month alone (its a conspiracy I think) Tom, Yes, I did end up purchasing the Denon 2801, and so far i'm extremely pleased with it. I'm still trying to get it setup "right", I'll figure it out eventually I suppose. Domain

Just when you thought this thread died Well, I ended up with the Synergy Towers (SF-1/SC-1/SS-1/KSW-10), which I hadn't looked at originally. I spent some time with the dealer, and eventually he twisted my arm until I bought them They sound excellent (though I really haven't had a chance to put too much volume to them yet), though I'm a little worried about the output on the KSW-10. However, I haven't really done any calibration/tone levels yet (waiting for my backwoods Radio Shack to get a sound level meter in stock), so I figure it will be best to judge once that has been completed. Anyway, thanks again for the previous assistance Domain

djanecek, you might want to take a look at the ProMedia CP-1 Control Pod Preamplifier. You can use it to upgrade your existing v2-400 system, gaining headphone jack, speaker engage / disengage, and an extra input. Domain

I recently purchased Video Essentials at a local Suncoast for $34.95, and I have to say it was money well spent. As Stevelee said, the difference between uncalibrated vs calibrated is amazing (or *can* be amazing is probably better). As far as Avia, I hear its quite good also, but I've heard complaints that the audio portion doesn't include a dedicated LFE channel. Domain

I think i've made a decision, and am going with a Denon 2801. The 1801 is missing a few things, and I like the 5 channel stereo feature on the Denon's. So now its a just a waiting game till it all gets here (Man the neighbors are going to hate me now) Domain

Thanks for the replies I've heard alot of good things about Denon 1801, and i've also been looking the Onkyo TX-DS575X, so at this point i'm just stuck with making the final decision. At this point in time, i'm really looking for $499 and under recievers, so these seem to be the most recommended. Either way, I'll would have use for both the existing / new reciever so... Unfortunately, getting much "first hand" experience with the products is a problem for me. The nearest Klipsch dealer is almost 200 miles away, let alone any other "quality" audio dealers. So i'm going off a lot of opinion / reviews at this point. I'll figure it out eventually Once again, thanks for the help Domain

I've been extremely impressed with what little i've seen of Klipsch's products, so they should sound good I have been scouring the forums all night though, and it seems the STR might not be the right choice (STR's are almost a bad word in some forums). This might not be the right place to ask, but would I see a large difference in say a Denon 1801? The Sony was a "hand me down" situation, so i'm willing to put the extra cash in to a "better" reciever. Domain

I appreciate the response. The naming convention had me somewhat confused, so I'm guessing i'll just go with the SB1/SC-.5/SS-.5. As far as the RB-5 those are unfortunately going to remain out of reach, at least for the being. Domain

I've been looking for a relatively "small" home theater setup, and after some debating (and reading some posts here), it seems System 6 would be the best choice. Now i've run into a few questions that hopefully someone could answer for me First of all, I am curious as to the SB1 vs the KSB1.1. Is this just a updated model? I spoke with my local (well not so local) dealer, and they weren't sure as to what the difference were... Secondly, as far as component matching goes, if the KSB1.1 is a updated SB1, would it be suggested to move up to the SC1 & SS1, or remain with the SS-.5 / SC-.5? The speaker matching chart suggests this, just curious as to some user opinions. Ideally, i'm looking for a nice clean sound, as the room size is fairly small, and I won't be taking the volume very high (the neighbors already dislike me). Finally, as far as a reciever is concerned, I already have a Sony STR-DE945, and am curious if you think this would be a good match for this particular setup. (Forgive me for my lack on knowledge on this topic). I appreciate any information/comments that you might provide Domain