dhtman

Joe I would be fascinated to know what the Chenin does for you that your BBX doesn't. I have owned a Chenin since July 05 and was initially disappointed because it sounded a little lean and thin sounding. However, since moving to Klipsch speakers it is playing to its strengths and is very quiet. When I heard the BBX at RMAF recently I thought it sounded really good and had more punch thant the Supratek. I wished I had been aware of it earlier because it seemed to be pretty close and for the price of a good mc cartridge less! Location of the Chenin is critical - it is very sensitive to magnetic fields and doesn't like the two chassis stacked above each other - side by side works better. I hope your dreams come true! []

I hear what you're saying dhtman. But frankly if I had to worry about changing the VTA everytime I switched between various pressings - I'd sell my turntable and use my vinyl as frisbee's. [] Well if you want convenience an iPod is pretty good, or a Squuezebox. [] I guess we all have different priorities - vinyl can sound way better than CD, but it demands work and attention to detail to get it at its best. I don't enjoy listening to an LP played with the VTA off, I just have to get up and adjust it. I only have to slacken a hex screw a quarter turn, slide the arm post about a sixteenth of an inch up or down and tighten the hex screw and the job's done. Maybe that's why an ugly old DJ table gives you all that functionality - it's designed for professionals! []

Thanks Carl. The measurement between the center line of the drivers is 10 feet. My listening seat is 12 feet from the front wall. On the right of the rear wall there is a six foot wide archway into the kitchen/dining room. Sitting at the table about 36 feet away from the speakers sounds just as good! I tried Richard's suggestion and angled the HF horns out a few degrees. It sounded equally good - my experience is that the tweeters have a very wide dispersion pattern and I haven't found anywhere outside the sweet spot in my room. I'm having great fun turning up LPs and CDs I haven't played for ages and enjoying them anew. Tonight it has been Seal, Jess Roden and Free. I guess I'm in a raunchy, rocky kind of mood. D

Parrot, how are you getting on with your Lenco? Is it sounding good?

I don't count shimming as adjustable VTA because it isn't practical to change the VTA setting when going from a 180g pressing to a 140g pressing. I guess you could set the shim to be somewhere in between, so that the neither weight of records sounds its best! [] Take a listen to an LP12 playing complex rock - anything loud and fast with guitars, keyboards, voice and drums. Note how you get lots of upper mid bass, no real extension and in the loud passages you can't follow each of the parts - it goes kind of muddled. Then try the same track on a Galibier or Teres Certus. I know that Roy Gandy of Rega says that VTA isn't important - that's pure salesmanship protecting his interests and he would say that wouldn't he? The Rega with a solid diecast arm tube has no way of setting azimuth - it's very rare that the cantilever and stylus are absolutely perpendicular to the top surface on a cartridge body, so azimuth adjustment will invariably improve the set-up. The trouble is, we have all been fed a diet of half truths and fairy tales by the audio press and dealers. The reality is that modest gear, if properly set up can sound magnificent. I tried the Lenco experiment and in the process taught myself how to set up an arm and cart properly (designing and making my own set-up tools along the way) and I discovered for myself that it is possilbe to make a few hundred dollars worth of parts sound better than tables costing over $2000. But there's no money to be made in commercial audio saying that (the advertizers wouldn't like it) and there is an element of fashion in audio that has an influence - it requires self-confidence to pursue your own direction when there's so much peer pressure to conform.

Many belt drives I've used and worked on have perfect speed stability. What belt drives have you listened to that had poor speed stability? I think you'll find that with a motor that cogs and an elastic rubber band (that is intended to take up that uneveness) you won't get close to "perfect." When the stylus tracks a heavily modulated loud transient, the increased stylus drag momentarily slows the platter, increasing the tension on the belt, then releasing it again as the speed returns to the nominal. This is clearly audible when compared to a direct drive, and idler drive or a belt drive with an inelastic belt (Galibier, Teres, Redpoint and Morsiani all use mylar, except the newes Teres which are now direct drive). The thing is, if you have only listened to rubber belt drive tables, you don't realize this effect exists, because that is your baseline normality. I have heard this on the Linn Sondek LP12 (I owned them for 25 years), the Regas, Nottingham Spacedeck and Hyperspace, the Michells, the Avid Volvere, the Kuzma Stabi S, the SME 10...

I would choose the Technics. I can't live with the poor speed stability of rubber belt driven tables. The Rega arms don't allow VTA or azimuth adjustment which makes it hard to get the cartridge set up properly. The Technics, with its detachable headshell, allows for a cheap ($40) upgrade to a headshell with azimuth adjustment. I have a 20 year old Technics SL150 mkII and it works really well provided it is isolated on a sandbox on a wall shelf. I bought it cheap on ebay because I had a hunch that a direct drive would have more stable speed, so better pitch and dynamics. It also has a cleaner, more analytical presentation that I enjoy.

Haven't tried angling them out further yet but I will do. We had family with us on Christmas Day and I was the butt of a load of Spinal Tap jokes. My brother in law even gave me a Stonehenge cake - all wrapped in Christmas paper. When I was a kid, my dad always got to choose the music that played whilst we ate Christmas dinner. Now it's my turn, so it was Pink Floyd's The Wall! Better than Bing Crosby and Dean Martin, lol.

Here's the room. The Dx38 is on the bottom shelf. The pre is a Supratek Chenin. I'll get the cabling tidied when I'm done swapping amps in and out! The shelves are 4 feet long and the top shelf is 33 inches above the floor.

Happy to oblige. It's badged Goldring Lenco GL75, like all UK supplied L75s. I cut the rear, right hand corner off the chassis to allow more choice of arms.

Lol! Linkwitz is one of my audio heroes and his Orions are very good - the least imperfect speakers I had heard until the Jubilees. My amplification is a transitional set-up - I'm using a pair of Ron Welborne's DRD 300bs on the HF and a pair of Valvet A1s (20 wpc, pp solid state design) on the LF. I also have a pair of Valvet E1s (10 wpc single ended solid state) to try out.

I like the Denon DL-103, it is punchy with good bass, it's dynamic and tracks well, whilst not being the best for detail. Because it's low output, a step-up will add expense. Therefore I suggest you consider the Dynavector 10X5 - it's a high output design, has good tracking, is very lively and will do a great job. The other high output cartridge I have heard that I really like is the Benz Glider, which is very sweet sounding, but I'm not sure of its pricing.

[] Seti you are absolutely right about me and Santa! My family are all buzzin' about Christmas and I'm thinking "I don't mind if I get the most boring presents tomorrow, I've got my Jubilees. Socks and handkerchief are cool." Actually I know that Santa is going to leave Joe Zawinul's new CD "Brown Street" in my stocking, so the house will be rockin' from about 8 am!!!! So, what can I tell you about the Jubs - this has been such an incredible experience. These speakers are so revealing. I was listening to Paul McCartney's Greatest Hits on vinyl last night and the imaging is so precise, the detail so clear, I'm lost for words to describe how good a stereo system can sound. I played Clapton Unplugged and, just as Mike predicted, it's like having the band in the room. I do have a hum problem to resolve (the bane of high efficiency speakers). I had a scare on Friday evening when I swapped my amps around and lost my right woofer. I agonized for an hour over dinner, praying I hadn't done something stupid and blown something on the Dx38. After dinner, I swapped back to the original amps and all was restored to normal. The insulator on the RCA input of one of the amps had pushed in, stopping the hot connection making, so no sound. In tracing the source of the hum I swapped my 300bs to the woofers and the single ended transistor amps to the hf. What a difference! It was like listening to a pair of single driver Lowthers - a little too bright, light and soggy bass, and yes I had adjusted the Dx38 output levels for the amp sensitivities. So the speakers are ruthlessly honest and revealing. They are challenging my beliefs, formed over 35 years of dabbling with audio. I've always thought that it is hard to attribute praise and blame to components in a system unless you have tried lots of combinations. I'm concluding that most conventional speakers lose detail, passive crossovers can introduce massive colorations that mask excellence upstream, the Linkwitz Reilly crossover is the best by far, and I have re-confirmed that horn speakers are the most rrevealing speakers money can buy. The amazing thing about the Jubilees is they have all the strengths of horn speakers and none of the weaknesses - no honk, no colorations, just gorgeous, full fat, rich music. To enlarge upon my previous paragraph, I have been taking part in the great Lenco experiment, on Audiogon. I have a L75 in a solid ash plinth, with a Fidelity Research FR64s arm and Koetsu Black cartridge. Until now, I have pretty much agreed with the consensus that the Lenco delivers a very punchy sound, very pitch stable, yet lacks image depth. Playing that rig through the Jubilees (including AD and DA conversion in the Dx38 - digital kills soundstage right?) there is incredible imaging and image depth. I think it's due to very flat frequency response and the absence of intermodulation distortion between the drivers. Also, because the Jubs are in the corners of the room, there is a reduction in reflected sound. The other thing that's striking is that the Jubs are ruthless in revealing arm/cartridge set up errors. I had my VTA set for average 140g pressings from the 70s and 80s and when I tried to play current 180g pressings at the same VTA setting it was so noticable that the treble was rolled off due to the geometry change. I have a Triplanar coming soon which will help with it's VTA on the fly and calibrated VTA adjustment. I hope that gives you a flavor. Like any good piece, we are hearing new things in our favourite music and enjoying it more. I don't want to sound like a cheesy Stereophile reviewer but there is a totality, a completeness that the Jubs present that I haven't heard before. Earlier in this thread, Roy asked me to PM him my thoughts and to be ruthlessly honest. I told him that the Jubs sounded quite similar to Siegfried Linkwitz's Orions, but with tighter and deeper bass. The Orions need about 65 watts per driver (8 in a stereo pair) whereas the Jubs do nicely on 8 watts per driver, but it's not so surprising the two speaker designs sound similar, given that both use 30dB/octave Linkwitz crossovers and correction to give a flat frequency response. Did I answer your question? Happy hollidays to all. dman [] (in audio nirvana)

I don't like laying out large sums on audio either. After looking for over a year for a used pair of Khorns which change hands in England for $4000 minimum, I figured that it would be worth springing for what was intended as the successor to the Khorn, especially as the Jub was designed to address the flaws in the Khorn's design. And my $4000 on Khorns would have been just the start - professional wood refurbishing, replacement drivers and crossover could easily have doubled the outlay and it would still have been an old speaker. I'm still using the FR64s I bought in 1981- I had massive doubts about spending so much on a tonearm back then, yet it has given so much pleasure for so long that it has turned out to be a bargain (and I could probably sell it for more than I paid for it if I chose). I expect the Jubs to be similar in giving many years of enjoyment. I opted for the bi-amped version of the Jubilee. The Electrovoice crossover is a very sophisticated device - it would certainly be possible to adjust the EQ to take care of any undesired room effects. That said, my personal experience is that every piece of audio that has sounded convincing in someone else's room has worked really well in my room too.

Well, beauty is in the eye of the beholder! I choose my wine on how it tastes, my TV on picture quality and my audio system on how it sounds. I guess, using your logic, I could have a more interesting life buying audio on looks, TV on how it tastes and wine on how it sounds (glug, glug, glug). [] Better an ugly speaker than an ugly wife! [] Actually Alan, the thing outstanding thing about the Jub is that it does all the everything a PA speaker can do (loud, real extended bass and feel it in your gut connection) whilst also doing the audiophile "flat as a ruler" frequency response thing. I'm going back to the GRP "Come Together" Beatles compilation. Can't wait for Christmas day - my wife is giving me Joe Zawinul's Brown Street.

I wasn't intending to provoke that kind of response. My point was that these speakers are so good they deserve to be in many more homes. I heard some horns at RMAF (the Azzolina Gran Sfera) whose design borrowed heavily from the La Scala - yet they retail at $15,000 and there were people saying how good they are and no doubt buying them. Also, there was a field coil speaker on dem, called the Cogent True to Life, retailing at $57,000 - it was fun but not as good as the Jub. My point was more that there are a lot people spending upwards of $10,000 on speakers that don't come close to the Jubilees and if they knew how good the Jubs were they would be sore.

I had some time today to solder up the interconnects to the EV crossover. I spent a leisurely few hours connecting up the pre and power amps to the crossover. I have learnt to take these things easy - in the excitement it's easy to make mistakes, drop stuff and scratch cases (the voice of experience!) Likewise keying in the parameters to the speaker processor. We produced sound around 6 pm local time - disappointingly right had channel only (loose interconnect on the cd). So far I have played Marcus Miller, Queen, Yellowjackets and Pat Metheny. These are definitely the best speakers I have heard, period. And an absolute steal at the price Klipsch ask for them (compared to some of the dreck out there). The music just flows, with everything there, nothing missing and they seem to flatter the electronics driving them - transients and dynamics are effortless. I can't understand why only 4 of us are enjoying these awesome speakers. Got to go, the music is calling me! [] Big thanks to Roy for a brilliant design and your help in the purchasing process and to Mike and Richard for their insights and support in getting this thing together. I will post some more observations after extended listening.

The Dx38 was delivered yesterday. I need to get two more female XLR connectors so I can finish off making up the cables. Then the fun starts - setting up the 38 with my amps and then playing a few tunes. I think it's going to be a late night tonight! []

No worries Roy, it's not a problem at all. As Coytee suggested, a black magic marker will do the trick! I'm just thrilled to have them and can't wait for my Dx38 to arrive so we can hear them. [] I bought the Jubs for 2 channel music but yesterday my wife suggested we should rig up the lcd projector and dvd player to watch a movie (loud), with popcorn, sodas and all.

I had to open up a box and take a look inside. They have a great fresh paint smell! Note a small paint chip on the front corner. Hopefully it should touch up okay.

It was raining so I had to move my wife's car out of the garage to keep 'em dry. She wasn't impressed! []

Small truck. The Jubs are in three boxes on the right hand side.

Brains is a Cardiff brew - and very pleasant! I'm about a half hour from Heathrow, not too far from the M4 west, so if you're visiting you'd be welcome to call in and meet the Jubs. Your friend is right about the Khorn - they were perceived to be too big for the average British home (about 20 years ago) and Klipsch never realy established a toehold in the UK market. To be fair, there is a lot of home competition and a very partisan audio press that looks after its long term advertisers (editorially). To my ears, most Brit speakers are all a bit "me too" and with 5 inch mid woofers in narrow cabinets being so fashionable there's nothing available here that comes close to the Heritage range. My guess is the local audiophools will love the sound of the Jubs and will criticise the looks and the enormity of the Jubs. "They didn't sound too bad, but boy are they ugly" You read it here first! d

What a great question Tom. I think I'll go with what feels right in the moment. If it's a cd it might be Ian Shaw's Famous Rainy Day (he's a male, Brit Cassandra Wilson, if that makes sense!) or Francisco Cespedes' Vida Loca, or maybe Yellowjackets Time Squared or JamesTaylor's Hourglass. If I go for vinyl first, it could be Supertramp's Crime of the Century or ELP's first album, or DIre Straits Love Over Gold, side 1. I also want to hear Sting's Russians and the Power Station's Get It On. (I used to blow the fuses in my Mission 770s with that track in the 80s, lol). Damn, there are so many great albums that I'm just itching to hear through those Jubs. I guess it will be a long first night!

An insightful thread. I remember being called an audiophile the first time, about 18 months ago, and was quite surprised because I'm very skeptical of audio magazine reviews and the black arts of four thousand dollar interconnects. For me all that matters is recreating the emotions of being at a live concert. That means making the right compromises. When I heard some of the Stereophile class A components at RMAF recently, it was obvious to me that the designers and reviewers hadn't used live music as a reference because the music sounded quite synthetic. Certainly what sets audio apart from most other hobbies is the highly subjective talking-up of products in the language of a restaurant review and the associated pseudo-science and snake oil salesmanship. With audio there's no correlation between outlay and sound quality. If you take golf, sub-aqua or sport flying, there are key measurable attributes for any equipment you buy that translate into better performance, reliability or safety. Audio discussion boards tend to have their own "group think" - Audiogon's dominant belief seens to be "if you want good sound it will cost you" and expertise is perceived to be related to how much a poster has spent on their rig. Weird that - in any other area, cycling large chunks of cash on essentially the same purchase would be viewed as bad decision making! Mark's point about discernment is very well made.