TheChad

Now I know I'll get flamed for this, But years ago I use to work for a High End Audio/Video store, where once a month we would go to a weekend training, that would include Denon, Yamaha, Monster, Energy Speakers, Bose, Lucas Film etc, etc. We were shown the product, the Testing, Shown differences in nothing but wire alone, on and on.<?xml:namespace prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" /> It's been awhile, so I may not be explaining this right... But The Time Correction works by taking the inside of the wire and wrapping it around the center non-metallic core, while the wire on the outside runs straight. This makes the inside of the wire longer than the outside. If I remember correctly it is bass that travels on the inside of the wire with least resistance, So Time correction allows all the frequencies to arrive at the speaker at the same time. That's a rough explanation. But I have heard/seen first hand everything from a $500 system, to a $20,000 system with nothing different but wire/cables, and it is like night an day. However that is in the perfect environment sound proofing, etc. Can you see/hear the difference at home? Yes! Depending on allot of variables. But as always, the best part of your system is only as good as your weakest link. So even if you have $5000 in cables, and you use 'Lamp Cord' Speaker wire, all the rest of your interconnects are only going to help to the limitations of your Speaker cable (Weakest link) As Ive said before, I don't agree with paying the SUPER inflated prices of Retail outfits. But you can get Good High End cable online for a negligible difference than the cheap stuff at the local Retail store, and you'll be allot happier with your system. As for the thicker insulation, thats a no brainier. Insulation helps to block out interference. In todays world, with microwaves, Wireless networks, ETC. Interference is more and more common. How much insulation is too much? Well I don't see how you could have too much, but there is a point where adding more/thicker isn't going to yield any better results. But 1/32 thick insulation, vs. 1/8 think, Ill take the 1/8th. You guys can believe what ever you want. I personally don't care, but I am willing to bet very few of you have had the opportunities to compare side by side differences with your own ears/eyes. You can find on the internet ANYTHING, If you believe the sky is pink, you can find a website online that will show you all kinds of information, studies, etc proving the sky is pink. But in the end, I'll go out side and look, if the sky is blue; I am going to believe the sky is blue. I don't care what the studies show. Same with this. I have had the opportunity to hear/see the difference, and there IS a difference. If you don't feel there is a difference, by all mean buy the cheap stuff. But for god sakes, don't tell people to buy $8000 high end speaker system, and tell them to use cheap cables. That's not fair to the good people trying to get themselves a nice high end system. Think about this... You pay $8 for a hamburger at a fast food place, you eat it, and within 24 hours its out of your body. You can buy a $20 cable that will be around for rest of your life, and provide you with decades of enjoyment. That's a no brainier! You guys can believe what ever you want, but I don't think it's fair to impose your personal believes on lower quality cable on newbies that don't know better. Everyone should tell people to use a High Quality cable, and advice that your best choice for purchasing cables in Online, and leave it at that. -TheChad

1. The speed of sound has nothing to do with the 'eveness' you're talking about. If your speakers have low enough an impedance, the resistance of your speaker wire may contribute appreciably to the frequency response and loudness of the speaker. This will cause the speakers to not sound as they should. If you're using too thin a wire, then having unequal lengths will cause your speakers to behave differently from each other, making the problem even worse. If the wire is significantly thick enough, then the length won't matter as the wire resistance should be negligible compared to the impedance of the speakers. 2 and 3 speakerfritz seems to have covered. 4. Frankly, there is no difference between 'brand name' monster wire and your ordinary lamp cord if they are both the same gauge. Copper is copper as long as it's free of impurities. I think it's foolish to pay for 'brand name' wire and companies like monster reap tremendous profits from their wire simply because they've managed to convince enough people that they're wire is somehow better. Radioshack brand is fine. I've used it and it's as good as any more expensive wire. Do not let salesmen convince you that wire A is better than wire B simply because it's brand A. If it's the same gauge and conductor material, then you're basically looking at the same wire. I wish people that obviously know nothing about High quality cable would stop spreading lies around the forum. If you want to use crap cables with your system, Have at it, but for god sakes don't tell others information that is untrue. 'Cheap' "lamp cord" type speaker wire is just wire. High quality SPEAKER wire, actually has thicker insulation, and Time correction. P.S. I'm not a sales man. Just some one who knows 1/2 the poeple here don't know what they are talking about when it comes to cables.

I am confident that you will be very happy with your Quintets. They are great speakers. -TheChad

Hi Djdiggler! Welcome to the Forum. I don't know much about that receiver, but I can speak for the Quintet III system. For small satellite speakers they sound awesome. I have the same sub, The sub works OK for me because I have the Large F-3's, C-3, and S-3's that can hold their own in the lower end. That sub will work for you, however you might find that you will want some more thump, as the Quintet III's are only going to offer you the Mid/High Range's. As for matching speakers, and I speak from experience. Stick with the speakers that are designed to go together. For years I have all different speakers in my system because I could never afford to buy all 1 matched set at a single time, and they would always discontinue the product line before I could buy the whole set. It always sounded OK, but, now that I have a full matched Set of F-3's, C-3, and S-3's, There's nothing like it. I would stick with your Quintet's, and invest in a Sub10, which will give you alot more power on your sub than that PSW10. If you do go and upgrade your center and/or mains, I would probably say the C-2, and F-2's. The C-1, and F-1's arn't going to do much more than the Quintet's for you. As Always, this is just my $0.02. In the end everyone's ears are different, and you have to do what sounds right to you. -TheChad

MSRP = Manufacturer SUGGESTED Retail Price There are millions of products that sell at retail for far less than MSRP. Actually far fewer products sell at or above MSRP than that sell FAR below MSRP. -TheChad

$5,000,000? Why not $10,000,000, or how about $100,000,000? Is that realistic? Who that is using one of these HOME theater conditioners has even $400,000 in electronics? At that point it is just a pissing contest. The real question come if/when something does happen and your electronics get fried... Who can, and who will stand behind their guarentee? I don't know if Panamax can, or will, because I've personally never heard of them, But I know Monster Can, and Will. The Problem that gives monster a bad name is the Retailers, that rip off customers. It's not monsters fault the retailers are marking up their product between 100-300% PROFIT! You can buy almost any monster product online for a FAIR price with only little effort in searching. -TheChad

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It's better than a $20 Power strip for if no other reason, Monster Warrents like $400,000 in connected electronics If a power surge frys anything.. That in it self makes it better. But the Monster "Clean Power" Does make a difference. That is not to say that many other companies with their own "Clean Power" Are any less good. But a $20 power Strip really offers nothing more than multiple Plug-ins. It doesn't filter power, they really don't even much in surge protection. Monster among other brands, Do. -TheChad

The Cheapest Option is to buy the speaker stands at Walmart. They are like $30 a Pair. Then I did a custom mount to the stands by drilling 4 holes in the bottom metal plate on the built-in speaker mounts, that matched up with the 4 holes in the Stand base, and bought some scews and nuts, and bolted them to the stands, Then install the spaker base back tot he metal plate, and it looks great. Very stable, You can't see the screws, and It cost FAR less then any speaker stands you'll buy at an Audio-retailer. If you are interested in this let me know, I can get some pictures for you... -TheChad

Just my thoughts.. In a room that size I would go with Floor Standing Speakers, and a 12" sub, or a 10" sub with butt kickers in the seats as mentioned... In a room that size, assuming it is only being used for a HT, and not any type of living space, There is no reason to not use larger speakers which would more appropreatly fill the space, and give you better sound. Alot of people think going with book shelf speakers will be cheaper, but In the end, you have come buy speaker stands for them, or wall mounts, which are expensive, You will end up spending the same as buying the same model in a floor standing speaker. Retailers like to sell book shelf's because they know you are going to buy the stands or wall mounts, and this is huge proffit for them. Even more so than the speakers, which are also very profitable. Just my $0.02. Look at mysetup in my Sig. I am only set up in a 14x17 room. But it sounds awesome. Later My system will be moved into a 18x22 room and will fit the space nicely. -TheChad

I have a 60" Panasonic LCD-Rear Projection TV In my Living room, and a 42" Samsung Plazma in my bedroom. While the Plazma is brighter, and does have a virtually unlimited viewing angel. The Burn-in Problem that most retail sales men will tell you "Isn't really a problem any more" IS a problem. Thankfully Samsung Plazma's have Built in White wash Burn in remover, which I run once a week, since EVERY channel on TV now has their stupid station logo in the corner, and burns right into the Plazma panel. I do have to run it for about 2 hours to remove all burn in. My 60" LCD-Projection however has no burn in, I could leave a still image on the screen for days and it would not burn in. LCD-Projections are actually pretty slim, Unlike Old CRT Projections. They Don't have color guns, and Like was mentioned. The only thing that should ever really need repair is the Bulb which 99.99% of LCd Projection TV's are user replaceable, and will only cost a few hundred dollars to purchase the bulb. The viewing angel is not quite as good as the plazma, but Who watched their TV looking down the side of it? Any NORMAL view postion is a great picture on an LCD-Projection. Pound for Pound you can get more inputs, and a larger screen from an LCD Projection, for the same or less money. I think Plazma's are a good technology, but Untill the burn in problem solved, They will not take over the market. Just my $0.02. -TheChad

Did you by chance hear the difference during a double blind ABX listening test? If so, I think there is a million dollar reward out there waiting for you. And if you actually knew anything about transmission line theory you wouldn't be making that analogy. Sorry to be blunt, but the thousands of volts and DC currents used with spark plugs have absolutely nothing in common with the small voltage AC currents used with loudspeakers. The wire you choose is dependant on your source, load, and the signal you're trying to transmit. The only fancy high-end cable one should even consider is one that is optimizing for your specific application (and even then you're talking differences on the order of 0.01dB). Btw, how do you KNOW that the more expensive wire is helping the electronics travel better? Ever tried measuring it before? What's even more interesting is the high-dollar cables that are using the exact same wire as cheaper off-market brands (no, it's not all of them). But throw on a fancy label and charge crap loads more - and everyone always claims the more expensive wire sounds better (even though it's identical). Gotta love psychoacoustics. Go visit any of your local high-end professional cinemas - heck, go visit your local IMAX theatre. Have you ever seen the kind of cables being used in the studios making your recordings? Heck, I've fricken seen guys unbending wire coat hangers when in a pinch... When the masters of recording aren't using fancy cable, then why bother with it in the home? If anything, a better cable should make things sound worse as you reveal the flaws in the original wiring being used in the studio. [] I would propose that the difference is more likely that your room has better acoustics. I can think of plenty of other variables that will affect the sound far more than any differences in wire. But alas, I don't want to get in a pissing match about the audibility of different wires (let alone trying to argue if it's an improvement). My original question which you conveniently didn't answer was "Does the more expensive wire really make your F3's sound better than better speakers with cheaper wire?" And have you personally done an AB comparison? Anyways, congrats on your purchase and welcome to the forum. The F3's are quite a lot of bang for the buck. I have no intention of arguing either. But i love a good discussion... and would like nothing more than to have us both in the same room playing with everything trying to prove our points. Just for fun. But in all reality. It doesn't matter, because I already had all the cables. I didn't spend $70 a cable, or even $40 a cable. I got them all at cost which was very cheap. Before I was running Premium Gas, with a premium car, using 2 bald tires, 2 OK tires, and a Z-rated Spare tire. Now I am running Premium gas, with a premium car, with all Z-rated tires. That's all that really matters. The Premium gas is the cables. There has been debates for years as to weather Premium gas is any better for your car than Regular. Same here. Personally I like my premium gas. But You like your Regular, In the end, We both get to where we are going. Just for my last $0.02. The wire inside the cable may be the same, but what you are getting with the better wires, is FAR better insulation, far better connections on the ends, and far better connection between the wire and the connectors. Your cheap wires are 1/16" around, have no real insulation, and are molded or crimped to the connectors which are cheap plated connectors. Your premium cables reguardless of the wires inside, have much better insulation, sometimes several layers of insulation, the wires are soldered to the connectors, and the connectors are old gold plated. This is worth some extra money to me. You spend $40 on a premium cable that is guarenteed for life, or $6 on a cheap cable that you will replace several times Especially if you connect/disconnect the cables often. I set up my F'3, C-3, and S-3's Today, and watched My Big Fat Greek Wedding Which has good acustics (I got my speakers, and let the wife choose the movie). So far I am very impressed. Crystal Clear. Very well blended between speakers, (This is what I'm not use to with my old setup due to having all different speakers) I have not yet tuned the system. But It already sounds great. Thanks for the input. -TheChad

I did Yesterday. Not side-by-side, but I went to the Best Buy / Magnolia Home Theater Store, and listend to them both. The Sub-12 Is an awesome sub, As long as you are on wood floors. To be quite honest I was VERY unimpressed with the RW-12D. It didn't sound good at all. Very boomy, Not Crisp. I think I am going to end up with an Energy Subwoofer. Energy Is now owned by Klipsch Company, But Energy Forward fireing subs are some of the Crispest subs I have heard. -TheChad

I actually went to the Magnolia Home Theater store today, which sells Klipsch Ref Speakers. I asked the sales man what the difference was between the same speakers in the Ref series, and the Synergy F-3, C-3, S-3. He printed all the specs of the 2 speakers and went threw a book they had there, and said All the specs were the exact same, and the only difference he could find was that the Ref speakers had a Titainum Tweeter, vs and Aluminum Tweeter on the Synergy speakers. They were a little more than the Synergy series spakers, But not much, Though I did get the Synergy's on sale which made them quite a bit cheaper.. I have listened to the F-3's MANY times over the last year, and each and every time I have been impressed by their sound. -TheChad

What good is a $3000 System, with "Regular" cables. That's like Buying a Corvette then trying to use cheap Gas. It would be more like putting $50k tires on a $70k car. Why not just go for the $120k car and get way more performance? (not to mention more bragging rights). The extra money put into the tires is a huge waste in comparison - despite any claims one might make about better performance with the cheaper car. Ultimately, the important question here is do you really think you are improving the sound more by going with more expensive cables instead of say a better reciever or better speakers? Have you heard the difference (or lack thereof) for yourself? I'm just wondering what your source of information is - Monster brand cable is most certainly not the industry standard [] Actually I HAVE heard a difference between Cheap cables and Quality Cables. Take you $120k car and try to run the spark plugs off a 1/16" plug wires, then try to run that same car off 1/4" plug wires. It's been proven 1000x times over. You will gain performance using the better wires. If you want to buy an Expensive Amp, and Expensive speakers, and use Cheap crap cables, That's your right, but Show me one THX certified Theater that uses cheap crap cables, and I will withdraw my statements. ..and THX IS a Standard, One most every high end component manufacturer strives to achieve. I personally have had people come to my house hear my system with cheap speakers, and a middle of the line receiver with all my Monster cable, and go out and buy a Good amp, and better speakers than mine, and come ask me why theirs doesn't sound as good as mine. One Answer... CABLES. What good is all the power in the world, If you can't deliver it. I am not saying Monster is the only "Quality" cable. But they are good cables. I just happen to have all Monster because I was able to buy it all at cost. -TheChad