Kenhorns

The K77M made by Electrovoice is a ceramic magnet introduced 10/24/1979. The previous K77 is Alnico Magnet. Per Dope from Hope, Klipsch considered the K77M a direct replacement for K77. However, based on posts on this forum some folks think there is a difference. Some say the K77 only goes to 12-13KHz and that the K77M has 2-3db more output than the k77 between 12-17 KHz and can reach 15-17 KHz. Crites' CT125 supposedly goes 20-22KHz,

SP12B Pic....this one has a red surround

Larry's 1959 date for EV15WK alnico end is interesting.... Per my Heresy history research, Model 8 (Heresy) was intro'd in 1957 as a center channel for Khorns with an ElectroVoice SP12B, 16 ohm alnico used on some units. The EV12WK, the 12" model, was also offered from 1957-1959 (12", alnico, 16 ohm modified for Klipsch with a DCR of 3.2 ohm). Then an EV, SP12B "variant" 16 ohm, alnico, with red surrounds is reported showing up and labeled a K22 in the "early 1960s". The next mention of a Heresy woofer occurs in 1972 when a CTS 16 ohm red surround alnico d shaped small magnet is offered as a K22. I wonder if PWK convinced EV to build the SP12B as a Klipsch spec 4 ohm as a result of maybe both the EV15WK and EV12WK going from alnico to ceramic at the same time???? We need some old timers to set us straight????

Actually, I tend to think it was probably more about cost than performance. Chromed castings had to cost more to produce. I hope someone will chime in and answer: Why were most all the original 1940-1950s woofers produced as 16 ohms vs 8 ohms, and why did PWK spec them to be essentially 4 ohms? This apparently continued in the late 60s-and 70s when Alnico went to ceramic and 8 ohm seemed to become the standard while PWK still specified a 3.6 ohm DCR making the 8s in fact 4 ohms speakers?

Here's a pic of Cornwall Ser# 229, 1960 Vertical, this one has the rear backplate porting up and down the center, and it has a Jensen 15PLL 15" woofer. Notice the small woofer opening on the motorboard.... the shadow in the grill cloth. It looks much smaller than a 15" diameter circular cutout. Was PWK loading the woofer using a smaller cutout???? If so, why??? Based on my Forum readings and study: CWI was introduced in October 1959 - EV15WK and Jensen P15LL were the offered woofer options. By end of 1959, a few short weeks, the K33J Jensen (the P15LL) became the standard supply on CWI. (The K33J started use on Khorns in April, 1960.) PWK is reported to have treated the surrounds on the P15LL with DBP (dibutlyphalate) to lower free air resonance. The K33M (believed to be Eminence) did not come along to replace the P15LL/K33J on CWI until September, 1967. I can find no mention of the P15LL ever being designed to Klipsch specs - meaning 3.6 Ohm DCR. Any information will be appreciated! On Khorns, the EV15WK is 1st used August, 1950, and used until March, 1961 - replaced by then used K33J. The P15LL began use as early as 1949, the year 26 Khorns were produced. Stephens 103LX2 was used from August, 1953 on Khorn, replacing the Stephens P52LX2 which began use in 1949 on 2 way Khorns. Both of these were built to Klipsch spec of 3.6 ohm DCR.

This one's a little better...

Here's a pic.

Here's a .pdf of a work in progress Excel File that's helping me learn more about Heritage Line History. This one is for the Cornwall, but I'm also creating same for Khorn, LaScala and Heresy. I've gleaned the data from existing Heritage Reference Data (V.2 - 9May2008) as well as various posts from this Forum and the internet. I started out to Document Pictures of the components over time as well as more info about each of them as various Forum posters have voiced this need. I would really apprecate if members would Post Pictures of the components that I have none for. I've gleaned the web and everywhere and this is it - down to someone actually taking a Pic of their unit, I guess. This exercise has caused me to formulate some strong opinions and raised some questions. For example, I speculate now that the transition from original CWI K55V Atlas to K52K CWII had a lot to do with keeping the price down over the 30 year life period of inflation as opposed to improving sound. Dropping the original Push-Pin Terminals on 1959 K55V and going to solder terms on the 1980 model, then going from a 2 piece, metal, phase plug to finally a 1 piece plastic unit while shifting thru vendors, and finally making their own units, are ways that I think Klipsch achieved cost containment over the years to keep the final product price competitive in the market. This says to me to replace my 1979 CWI K55Vs if I ever need to, with same units somehow, before substituting a later model. Woofer sourcing had to be based on price - best deal at the time, although I sense there is something technically significant with the transition from Alnico to Ceramic Ferrite Magnets. I'm still confused about when the 1st Ceramics appeared and were they 1st square, and why, when they all ended up round. I now want Stephens or Jensens in place of my K33Es if I ever have to change. And regarding Tweeters - I'll buy Crites 125s when I have to. Finally, I really appreciate my 1979 CWIs over my CWIIs. Please help wih the Pics! Heritage Cornwall History.pdf

Ok guys, Kevin inspired me so here's what I did. I took a plain ole' consumer grade JVC XLV221 single disc player and connected to my Sophia EL34 and my beloved Khorns. Put on some Enya Watermark. Results: same ole' sound I'm accustomed to. But then, I removed the cover from the JVC. Results: The CD became lightish in balance, with slight forward upper midband and modest exagerration at the very top, which added a slight wispy edge tinkle. Midrange appeared a little thinner - this was mild however and certainly not objectionable. Lows were lighter in weight but bass extension was excellent, percussions having clean leading edges and powerful following tones. Midbass however was a little woolly, almost grumbly. So then I took 4 raquetballs and painted them pink with my wife's watercolors. Rested the open CD on the 4 'pink' balls. Results: The very low bass was solid and massive, rich and expansive, without being taut to the bursting point. Sound was definitely on the warm, velvety side but with immediacy, transparency and clarity. The sound was on the warm side of neutral. So then I took the 4 raquetballs and washed off the pink watercolor paint bringing them back to their original 'blue' humber - "Blueballs"! Rested the open deck on the blueballs. Results: Velvety-smooth overall tonal personality with stable soundstaging and smooth musical flow. The soundstage seemed taller and wider but not deeper. Midbass was clean and vibrant. Bass extension was excellent and had weight.You could feel the strength in the recording and immediately became centered within the music. An aura of blue panoramas was sensed thru the music. This was by far music that I had not heard before. Bottom Line: Audiophile Voodoo CD Tweak Take off your CD covers and set your equipment on "Blueballs" - they'll Rock You! or try Pink ones if you're into "warm & fuzzy" but either way, make sure you run your CD player Naked.

How interesting! Someone applying "Common Sense" .... way to go Kevin. Good thinking.

Thanks Gil, I suspected it was Voodoo - searching the web for CD Laser tech articles recently, produced no discussion or observance of any generated sound harmonics, but as stated before, I'm a novice and not a qualified guru. So, no trip to Home Depot and no $1.25 outlay for linoleum tile damping material, for me. Again thanks, I am now considering purchasing "blue balls"!

Ok, the ball jokes were fun and the ball leveling systems very informative, BUT, I still don't have an answer to my question, or you guys did answer and I just continue to be a dumb novice, or you guys are being nice and just ignoring my ignorant question. Do lasers within CD Players produce any weird harmonics that need to be mitigated? and, (see this original post), is linoleum tile a viable remediator? As an anology, please recall that for instance on Cornwalls, inside cabinet standing waves, I have learned from this Forum, are mitigated by adding foam/philloux paper baffling to the inside cabs. Is there any similarity to CD players and laser harmonics, or again, is my Garage Sales Tech just espounding Audiophile Voodoo?

I Love IT! Cemetary tonight? Gravestone - slab of marble. Got lots of tennis balls!

Interesting comments so far. I do not think my Garage Sale Voodoo Technician had case or cover vibration in mind when recommending the linoleum tile damping....rather, something about the laser producing weird harmonics inside the cabinet. Sorry I left that out in original post question. Can/do lasers produce undesirable harmonics that impact the music negatively? If so, how do u remediate, or should u even bother? Or, alas, is this really just "audiofool voodoo"?

Anybody ever heard of doing this? What's the technical explanation behind it, if in fact it's not just superstitous Voodoo? Just bought a 3pc Onkyo setup at a Garage Sale Saturday for $50. Onkyo A-RV401 amp, T-403 Tuner, and a DX-C101 CD Player. Best I can tell this is 1991 stuff. Seller buys/repairs/sells audio stuff. Appears to be a knowledgeable electronics tech. In conversation regarding CD players he stated that they produce weird harmonics within their cabinets. He suggested the best and simplest modification that one could do to improve sound quality of their unit is to purchase a 12"x12" piece of pre-sticky linoleum tile at (say) Home Depot, cut to size, and stick to the inside top of the player's metal case cover. Supposedly, remediates these harmonics. He admitted it sounded like Voodoo, but insisted that it be tried.

On9Mart responded with the attached schematic for the Yaqin MC10L. Can someone give us an opinion on the "quality" of the circuit, please?

Great Idea on the schematic request, Dave. I just emailed them requesting 3 for various products - let's see what response we get. I would love to have Mark's and Eric's opinions here. I sure hope they see this and respond. Good points Speakerfritz! Kinda like Melamine in the Milk, huh?

I would appreciate the valued input and opinions from Forum Members on the equipment offered for sale by Hong Kong Retailer/Exporter "On9Mart". www.hi-end.on9mart.com/index.html They seem to offer low priced tube gear, with very expensive shipping from Hong Kong to USA. They also advertise and offer their equipment on eBay, both Auction and Buy it Now terms. Some of the auction stuff is tantalizing ... meaning the opportunity to buy something that supposedly sells for $500.00 for $100.00 plus $250.00 shipping, for example. Do any of you folks have any experiences with any of this gear? I expect to find that most of us - just don't know - but whaddayathink? Your opinions on the Pros and Cons of it? Would you gamble on buying any of it? Thanks

As I said earlier..."knowledgeable and helpful folks on this Forum"! Thank you all for the responses and information. Colt, I agree with keeping as much original as possible - but sometimes we buy stuff from previous owners who just didn't appreciate and take care of these masterpieces. Groom, i really like the u-line phyllo paper you found (closest to original I've seen so far) - I can see stacking 3 of those 1/4" thick sheets together and using some cotton cord (like original) to staple down like the original in my cabs if I ever run into a pair that needs the phyllo replaced. I went to Wikipedia and and Google and searched "standing waves".....nothing related to speakers there. What are they, and how do they get produced inside my Corns, and what's so bad about the puppies? Can you see, smell, touch, or most important, hear one of them? If so, what do they sound like, so I can tell if I ever get them? I assume, we all now know how to get rid of the critters - foam or phyllo paper!

Thanks Groom....may I add an additional question? same subject - Cornwall Foaming - as I said, I am redoing this pair..... My cab sound absorption is the original phyllo type paper - see photo. What thoughts on replacing this with something else? I've seen in other posts the use of egg crate type foam (1-2" thick stuff) and it can be sourced on the web www.foambymail.com. As my phyllo stuff is in good shape, I really don't need to change it out (and as I wish to keep as much original as possible, I will not change out this pair) , but curious for possible future refurb jobs if I run into deteriorated phyllo. whaddayallthink about replacing foam, with what, how do you know/assure/measure that you are not destroying the original 'Klipsch Sound' and replacing with something that is really close to the original design?

Yep Maron, I thought 'winterizing' the backboards would help as it gets cold down here in Florida - below 70F today - I'm now trying to figure out how to add some anti-freeze to the crossover caps! Seriously, my thoughts were that assuring any sounds inside the cab were 'pushed/forced' out the front bottom ports rather than 'leaked' from the backboard cracks might as Martha likes to say....."Be a Good Thing!" I know from recent experience that this Forum has some very knowledgable and helpful folks when it comes to vintage Klipsch technology and thought I would just reach out and inquire to same.

Currently refinishing my '79 Cornwalls. Found some 1/8" white high density foam and decided to seal the joint between the backboard and cabinet. Cut foam into 1" wide strips, mitered the ends, and mounted in a picture frame fashion around the inside edges of the backboard. Used Elmer's White School Glue to glue the foam to the unfinished backboard wood as my pretesting proved Minwax Furniture Refinisher (stripper) with steel wool will remove the glue in case I wish to undue this addition in the future. Now for the Technical Question; Have I messed up the sound of my Cornwalls with this addition or have I helped it in any way? I'll try to upload a picture, but have failed in this regard in the past.....

Got up this morning and put Harry Chapin's LP on, "30,000 lbs. of Bananas"! Yikes! I swear my speakers are turning 'yellow' already! Anybody got any ideas on how I might mitigate the coat of Boiled Linseed Oil I put on them? I hate to listen to KHorns in the DARK for the rest of my life.....thought about Bar-B-Que Grill Covers, a Tent, film on the House Windows, etc., but maybe someone can recommend a different Oil that I can use......

Not sure whether to post this here or under Upgrades and Modifications, but it does apply to Selling Your Speakers! Here's a "Tip" from Forum Member Keith "T2K" - See "Klipshorns" Post here. Boiled Linseed Oil is GREAT for original oiled cabinet finishes. Keith says it is what Klipsch recommends and I concur, having just oiled my Khorns. Lowes sells a Quart for $8. Take a cotton cloth patch, dip, squeeze, rub on, let stand 5 minutes ....then, wipe off with a clean terry cloth towel. Fantastic results!!! I used a 1" pure bristle brush, the cheap one's at Home Depot made in China/Indonesia ($0.59) to apply the oil next to the grill cloth. Yeah, took the easy way, rather than removing the cloth,but was real careful using just a scant amount of oil on the brush bristle tips and making sure not to touch the grill cloth. Use an ample amount of oil on your patch, but not too much. No dripping. No soaking. Just a good dampness to the patch. The key is to wipe the oil off with the soft, clean, terrytowel after 5 minutes. Let it soak in and dry for 24 hours. Cheers!

Thanks Gil! Appreciate the response. I'm reading the past posts on the Mini Box now - interesting stuff! You just put me on hold until I can review all this. Looks like you source the Mini Box from Mark @ Juicy Music? though, It's not listed on his website. Any suggestions on a decent Monoblock Integrated Amp that might match well with my Sophia Electric SET EL34? Ken