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You could always place the port on access door Maron ? That way, if it don't work, just make another door ? So, what you are saying is the air spring will be lost if we tamper with the rear chamber I guess. I have seen dome compression drivers with felt pads under the domes, what's up with that ?

I was looking around Google, and found several instances of doing things with the back chamber of folded horn woofers. One scheme was to port that chamber, and allow bass below horn cut off. I really do not understand bass horns at all, or why the rear chameber should be any different then any other rear wave containing device like a sealed or vented box. ? Maybe as I learn more ? I will try the insulation, where do you get a water meter, LOL

Now, that makes sense ? I have my 'own version' of the ALK 'extreme slope networks'. It is called a Rane 24 db per octave electronic crossover. I might give it a try between the folded horn woofers and the mids ? Maybe leave the tweeter crossover passive ? Or, I could just use it on the upper roll off of the woofer, and leave all else passive ? Not so sure it is gonna help me though ? From what I read, all us folded horn owners are screwed because our stock horns only go down so far ? Sure, I could roll the folded horn woofer off really fast, but w/o a horn/driver to play down low, what is the point ? I just missed out on some big CD Horns that will play down below 300hz! I could fly em from the ceiling right above the folded horn cabinets until divorce is imminent I guess ? Before she leaves me I can say "But Honey, now I won't even need tweeters"

For what it is worth from a lover the bass reflex impact, I always heard that "woody" sound from my Khorns of decades past. Granted, lacking in LF depth, I never heard that from my LaS centers or rears. Always thought that the speed/quickness of the LaScalla bins was too fast for the sound to be very woody. Great gear always solves problems, but if ESN's tame the savage beast in a CW bin, (and they do), they might be the answer for a Tubby-Woody horn loaded bass bin. Just an un-educated thought. tc Ok, I learned what VRD's are and what a BBX is, and my aunt is a Fat Girl. She calls herself a BBW though. But WHAT is an ESN ?

Wish I could see a picture of how the pipe insulation is used Maron ? Does it just go on the tailboard ? Freddyi also suggested beefing up the access door ? What about sealing the bloody thing ? On the Speakerlab SK's, the woofer wires go through the door, gotta make sure no leaks ? HOW critical are a few small air leaks in a folded horn ?

Wish I could see a picture of how you have it applied ? Because of the moldings, the tailboard is out a ways from the corner. Is this the way a folded horn works ? Air shoots into the tailboard and fans out into the corners which form the horn ? So what you are saying is any air leaks between tailboard and corners is not good ? The question is HOW bad is it ? Hate to go hacking up my home, but I will

Thank you Marvel. Now it makes sense.

Yeah, I gotta get some decent screws that are easier to remove. The stuffing does seem to smooth the response,and too much really overdamps it. No stuffing at all gives a fat, full, boomy bass. My moldings stop my tailboard from contacting the wall corners. how important is this ?

Good idea for the access door HornZak ! Forgive me for calling you that, but it would be a good moniker ? I am aware of your aversion to stuffing the rear chamber from advice you gave me in another thread. I did remove the stuffing, but it seems like I lost a little low bass. This could be due to air leaks, or different amps. I am still experimenting. Is it NOT possible that Speakerlab wants stuffing, and designed for it ?

Yes, it is a very real thing, and once you have heard it, you will know. BTW, what does VRD and BBX stand for ?

Might want to experiment some day ?

As long as there are SpeakerLab owners, this thread will continue I guess. My limited experience with stuffing is this, it seems to needs some. I removed all my stuffing, and real low bass went bye bye. Such a PTA to remove and re install the access door though. Still want to find a happy meduim.

Running the woofer w/o any inductor, do you want it in or out of phase with mids ?

Nice! Did your Speakerlab folded horn plans call for any stuffing in the rear woofer chamber, or did you use any ?

I have a Rane 24 db electronic crossover I could try on the woofers, or on the mids too. Where would you set the crossover Freddy ?

Nice Horns! WTH are those mid and tweeter horns and drivers ? Crossover ? On your plans, did you use the speakerlab driver for bass ? Did your plans call for any dacron stuffing in the rear chamber of the woofer ?

Tried two amps, does it on both

I would like to see that article. I have noticed this myself, in an unscientific sort of way. Not all hear alike, that is for sure. Personally, I hate a thin, bright sound. But some are detail freaks. I am gonna put the horns back in the system, and try one of my recievers I guess ? coukld you post a link to that article ?

The KHorns did it, and so do their clones, the SpeakerLa SK's. No speaker is perfect, but it bugs me sometimes. It made me so mad I unhooked em, went back to some cones and domes. Miss the big horns already, gonna hook em back up. Unlike the KHorns, the SpeakerLab SK's are not really amp critical. Maybe one of my receivers can work with them ? I have a big JVC RX DP 9 with built in 3 band digital parametric eq, and a Pioneer with remote control bass and treble controls. Actually, the extra warmth of the folded horns is sometimes a good thing. It is just like you said Freddy, sometimes it thuds. Maybe just backing off the bass control on certain recordings will make it more tolerable ? I just love the power and majesty of the big horns, and how the whole room comes alive with sound. Someone mentioned measuring equipment, that would be nice to have!

I know this is an old thread, but some SpeakerLab SK's still survive, and are being used and liked by their owners. I have owned 3 pairs of Klipschorns over the years, as well as Corns, Belle's, Forte;s, and CF 3's and CF 4's. I think the Klipschorn is better constructed, but that is about all. To my ears, the SpeakerLab SK's sound better. The Klipschorn, the SpeakerLab SK's, and even the Bell's have that "folded horn warmth" or coloration. I think it is part of the folded horn breed. The mid and tweeter are adjustable via L Pads on the SK's. Once I cleaned em, they work fine. The tweter is vertically oriented, and seems to image much better in my room then the Klipschorns. Bass is almost overwhelming at times, and I am still playing with stuffing in the rear chamber. I think there are improvements to be made in the crossover, but the SK's I find to be very enjoyable. For stuff like Black Sabbath, STYX, B 52's and Metallica and Judas Priest, they are almost untouchable by anything I have had. They have a warm, full, almost thick tonal balance that lends itself well to Rock.

I have a Parametric EQ, but I had better luck with a cheap Kenwood Graphic. In my room I have a tubby sound on a few male voices. I also have a JVC Reciever with a built in digital EQ you can operate by remote control. It does it in digital domain, might be better ? I unhooked the Corner horns, back to my dynamic speakers, miss em already! Also have an older Pioneer receiver with remote control bass and treble. Plus, it has tone bypass. Maybe simply backing the bass off a bit will help on those few recordinngs ? Most of the time the SpeakerLab SK's are awesome, nothing can touch them on most Rock.

I can really hear it on recording of "Ballad of the Green Berets". When he sings "Fighting Soldiers from the sky" It is not Barry Sadler, but another guy with an even deeper voice The F in fighting and the o in soldiers are emphasised, it sounds tubby. It is not just these SpeakerLab SK's that do this, the last pair of Khorns did it too. This coloration is not there on other speakers.

You guys must hear it, don't you ? It can really color up low end of some voices, and almost sounds like a thud on some bass lines All three pairs of Khorns I owned had it, and so did the Belles. The SpeakerLab SK's have it too, and it drives me nuts. What is it, where is it coming from, and IS it possible to get rid of it w/o EQ ?

Thanks Tom for a well thought out post! Audio contiunues to be a learning experience for me. I guess I will have to learn how to EQ ? Mark Levinson literally shocked the bowels out of me when he recommended Eq'd Khorns. Of course, at that time he still owned Levinson, but he told me of a prototype EQ he wanted to make. That EQ later was introduced as the Cello Audio Pallette! I guess it is the Great Mother Of All Equalizers ? better be for 20 grand ? So, you think I ned some measuring tools ? Maybe a RTA ? I know the "audiophile" arguments against EQ, but I spoke to Floyd Toole once before he retitred from Infinity. He told me in a perfect world we would not need what he called "Tone correction". Julian Hirsch, a fellow ham, told me the same thing when he was alive. Both felt that frequency response was the most important thing. I have tried the straight wire with gain approach, now I just want to keep an open mind, and try another way.