RB5M

yet by spending an hour searching the internet I can find unbiased reviews from major magazines, and thousands of postings on forums such as this to find the best product. ,,,,,,,,,,,,,end of quote............ I think that the "new buying model" has also produced a "new advertising model" which has been dubbed "e-marketing"...if you think that what you read from "posters" is all non-biased and un-compensated then you must also know that all 18 year old cheerleaders that people talk to in chat rooms are really girls ,18, pretty, and cheerleaders! I also know how much "unbiased" reviews I can get from the mags that get tens of thousands of dollars in advertising from those very same companies.... Forum sites are SET-UP TO INTICE E-MARKETING AND ON-LINE ONLY SALES COMPANIES AND MANUFACTURING..... Does this mean I think that they don't have a place in the market?..NO, just that THIS IS AUDIO and as such it is a very personal choice that one makes and AUDITIONING, PROPER A/B COMPARISONS, and A GOOD DEMO FROM A TRAINED ,EXPERIANCED INDIVIDUAL are essential to a proper choice... As for Big Box retailers, "bring 'em on", I have no problem competing with anyone who offfers at least the possibility of an audition for those who feel that LISTENING to equipment is important...as for those who don't , you will be the TARGET of the internets BIGGEST INDUSTRY ...ADVERTISING!

I heard that Sound advice would NOT be carrying ANY Klipsch products...ANYONE hear details yet?

Thanks Phil, that was well stated.....

Yeah, still no answer to this one...but sound advice has renegotiated and will continue ..ref or all lines?

I for example wonder how much of this goes on with respect to SVS on every sub forum on the internet

Yeah, there goin' like hotcakes

Moon, I agree with your comments and have still not read what I believe to be the real reasons why magnolia and tweeters had to go or why none of the other dealers could keep synergy...I can understand the move (financially) into bb, but why move out of retailers with better sales staff?

main complaint that I'm seeing on this forum is that some of you current Klipsch owners will now somehow feel as if their speakers are not as good anymore just because a portion of their brand of speaker is sold in a more mass marketed chain store. Do your Ref's sound any different today than they did 3 months ago? .................end quote No, the thing that scares most of us is the thoughts of what the new line-up in ,say, about 3 years will be like.....I WILL grant the notion that it would be possible that Klipsch could take all the profits from the new musac/bb venture and roll them into a large increased plant with new highly trained personnel so that they could focus on what gave them such a good name; QUALITY OF SOUND.However, call me a cynic ,but I haven't seen many of the companies who have gone this route actually maintain much less improve their product quality...I am passionate about Klipsch and am sad because now the average customer won't be able to do a direct side-by-side with synergy and ref....Why does Klipsch need to take synergy out of dealers? I have seen many of these dealers compete on price with bb and step customers up to better gear because they have both to play...I'm sure that all the specialty retailers didn't want to loose that line...so , was this a decision by Klipsch to cr@* on the retailers that have made them what they are?...did Klipsch think that they couldn't supply enough to cover both bb and all the rest (if so they lack a dedication to invest in their own infrastructure)...was it bb who insisted on an EXCLUSIVE line? If it is the latter then the idea that bb is already dictating terms does not bode well for the company...we in the industry have seen once well regarded brands become bb "house brands" with unpleasant results.....so as I see it either we will begin to see MASSIVE hiring and plant expansion in Hope or we will begin to see oem components used more and more and the "made in mexico" sticker showing up on more and more of their products...I have already heard dealers and customers complaining about how long it takes to get Heritage products shipped, and am curious as to how much attention the ref dealers will be getting in the future....call me pessimistic, but does anyone want to wager on how this is gonna turn out?.....fine for the principals/investors in klipsch and bb, but maybe not so well for the audio enthusiast.... oh, Gadfly Hurtz, were you still with us!

THAT'S WHY I TRADED MY DENON IN FOR B&K.....NEED TO BE ABLE TO SWITCH ...OTHERWISE DO BOTH...

make them available only on-line or in bb so I can not properly A/B THEM AGAINST ANYTHING ELSE

make them available only on-line or in bb so I can not properly A/B THEM AGAINST ANYTHING ELSE

These forums are a great source of e-marketing for on-line-only companies...start buzz, feed with your own posters ,watch "monkey-see-monkey-do JOE6pk" convince himself he got a $3,000 product for $600 and a brand is born...great marketing....bose doesn't put that little radio on the shelves next to others easier, they can save you sooo much money buy selling direct to you!

PHIL, NO OFFENSE BUT I WOULDNT SUPPOSE THAT YOU WOULD AGREE WITH ME, BUT WHAT INSIGHT CAN YOU PROVIDE WITH RESPECT TO DENON OR OTHERS , LIKE POLK, WHO HAVE FACED THIS SITUATION?

No sarcasm. It just struck me that Klipsch is not the first company to do this, as evidenced by API. The difference, of course, is that they have different names on the boxes which prevents most folks from making the association that they are the same company. IMHO, the Synergy and Reference lines are different technologies as well, just as the Athena and Mirage are. Additionally, per the Klipsch comments, those 2 lines will be run by different teams. The fact that they share the same badge and the same facility does not necessarily mean they are any less different than Athena and Mirage. +++++++++++++++++++++++++++ in fact synergy and ref are both horn-loaded high efficiancy designs, the synergy just uses less expensive components ....cabinet style and voicing are VERY similiar..just substitute poyl-prop for ceramic-coated alum, butyl rubber vs santoprene, etc....the designs aren't far off..... the mirage speakers are omnipolar,much lower efficincy and totally differant tweeter design than that of the chinese made athenas...the athenas are designed to be able to "upgrade" by docking with subs,etc....very differant products......never ever designed for the same customer/ same retail environment....

No sarcasm. It just struck me that Klipsch is not the first company to do this, as evidenced by API. The difference, of course, is that they have different names on the boxes which prevents most folks from making the association that they are the same company. IMHO, the Synergy and Reference lines are different technologies as well, just as the Athena and Mirage are. Additionally, per the Klipsch comments, those 2 lines will be run by different teams. The fact that they share the same badge and the same facility does not necessarily mean they are any less different than Athena and Mirage. +++++++++++++++++++++++++++ in fact synergy and ref are both horn-loaded high efficiancy designs, the synergy just uses less expensive components ....cabinet style and voicing are VERY similiar..just substitute poyl-prop for ceramic-coated alum, butyl rubber vs santoprene, etc....the designs aren't far off..... the mirage speakers are omnipolar,much lower efficincy and totally differant tweeter design than that of the chinese made athenas...the athenas are designed to be able to "upgrade" by docking with subs,etc....very differant products......never ever designed for the same customer/ same retail environment....

A friend in the industry (a mnfgr's rep) offered an interesting observation regaurding the demise of quality in products and their marketing decisions...he noted that volume and market share will make you richer, quicker in the short term and the way thaT HAPPENS IS TO REDUCE PRICE and churn out loads of quantity (which ussually involves a subsequent drop in quality of components used and easing of qc controls)...he went on to say that companies that are trying to caSH IN ON THEIR NAME AND SUBSEQUENT "PERCEIVED" VALUE will often at first turn a blind eye to wide-spread grey-market sales, because that is getting their production numbers up and they can dissavow any repair considerations that may arise from cheaper parts and poorer qc....this may make the companies bottom line appear more attractive to potential buyers (or stock more attractive to initial investors)...the company knows that a drop in quality is less likely to be noticed by people who buy without hearing a properly done A/B comparison, which e-tailers and even best buy cannot provide. Therefor the decision is based on monetary concerns...this seems to have been the case with many mnfgrs over the last 10 years, more since the internet has come into play. Many mnfgrs now employ e-marketers or e-marketing companies to pose as posters offering "unbiased" opinions to those people who let others ears decide ....;..Denon is a recent example of this ,in so far as their tangible feature set has improved,while the amp quality and reliability has declined....I hope that Klipsch can avoid this trap if ,indeed, they are trying to

Klipsch pulled out of Tweeter to be able to sell to Muzac AND BB, It wasn't Tweeters fault......nor Magnolias

I hear Good Guys and Magnolia are dumping some models like mad....Get 'em while they're hot!Am still interested in where they'll all be manufactured and if the synergy line will change any. How many store fronts does bb have? maybe tweeters and magnolia were dumped for supply reasons? Or was it that bb made it a condition? ...My friend who works for corporate at bb hasn't answered my e-mail yet.....more to come...

Yet no response to my post? bump....

curious about the specifics of the agreement......

Besides the h....something outdoor speakers, and maybe a pair of older synergy bookshelves(?) does anyone know of any current products built outside the U.S.?.....Will there be more of this in the future?...Will real wood veneers continue, if so, on which products? Will bb's synergy's be the same ones out now and will they be made in the same place without any design/parts changes?

Soon 300 more in California...Baja, california, that is ,right next to polk! Gotta crank out those boxes!