NOSValves Posted October 25, 2002 Share Posted October 25, 2002 I figure we should have a thread the search engine might find for future reference and I'll keep everyone posted as I tweak my new table. Here's the first 2 post from kelly and I from another thread I copied. "mobile homeless" Craig, what protractor did they send? Great they actually sent that - the DB Systems protractor costs about $50 now and all it includes is two pieces of plastic, one clear, one solid, and both with the proper markings (and some serious instructions, which you DO need). I will say that even WITH instructions, it is hard to get the cartridge perfect. You need to have some practice. I would practice with your other table and be VERY careful with the new beast. One thing is for sure, they got you started with it mounted at least. To mount a cartridge on a tonearm without a headshell requires a bit more work as you will find out sooner or later. Next thing you really want to pay attention to is the VTA and the Azimuth of the cartridge. the VTA is VERY important to how balanced it will sound. I find that you usually end up setting the tonearm almost parallel to the table with the stylus on the record... I then usually move the rear down just a hair but this depends on the table, arm , and cartridge. This has to be done totally by ear and it takes awhile to get used to how you are affecting the changes. The azimuth needs to be correct or you will wear records as well as bring distortion and mistracking. I wrote in another thread how important cartridge setup is. With the rear of the arm higher than the front, you will often get sound that is too forced in the treble and strident. This table and cartridge will start to sound BETTER and BETTER as the time wears on. You will notice an improvement within a week. The table and arm have a LARGE part to do with the sound. As is the setup. Most people that dont like vinyl have: 1. Never had their analog setup correctly 2. Never heard a GOOD table and cartridge 3. Never had the analog part of their playback chain up to snuff 4. Had the whole shabang on a terrible stand/shelf, which can ruin the sound kh NOS440 Mobile, Thanks for the insight. The Protractor they sent is just a premade cardboard type that has 2 test points one say 250 and the other 130. Then you set the needle on the test point and check the allignment with the provided lines on the cardboard pretty simple but they had it WAY off !! I also printed one off the web and it confirmed the same thing. I had my other table closer than they had this one !! I'm a carpenter by trade so this stuff is pretty straight forward for me. I understand angles and square relative to whatever it needs to be. Please define what VTA and the Azimuth are I understand Azimuth I believe (means the angle of the tone arm compared to the table) what is VTA ?? How do you set it ?? I played with more dampening and already achieved silence when tapping the shelf with the volume 100% so I would say I'm all set there !! On another note are you leaning toward Kiwame resistors for Chris's pono section ?? I just put in a request for a quote on 150 of various values required for Scott and EICO's to try to get us all a deal on them. Craig Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NOSValves Posted October 25, 2002 Author Share Posted October 25, 2002 Kelly, also I think I may invest in the protractor you mentioned and also a stylus force gage I here the Shure one works fine is this true ?? Craig Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mobile homeless Posted October 25, 2002 Share Posted October 25, 2002 As for damping, this is VERY critical and not only to keep vibrations out. You dont want to have too much damping fluid and TOO much will make it so you can POUND around the beast but will LOSE A LOT OF LOW LEVEL DETAIL AND INFO on the recording! This is a VERY serious aspect. IT is very easy to put too much in there. It will make the player sound less free sounding and reduce detail. You have to really be careful here. I always say better to have a bit too little than WAY too much, thereby taking life from presentation. Again, it's critical. (note: most tonearms do NOT have dampening per say so dont go looking for it on your arm and wonder what happened. heh... Those that do offer it, it is very critical to the sound and performance) As for the cartridge arriving to you WAY off, I would REALLY be careful here. I would have Checked, re-checked, re-read, and re-checked the alignment readings BEFORE moving it at all since there is a better chance it arrived correct as it is supposed to be. I realize there might have been a mistake and have read those comments from others you mentioned, but it is SO EASY to measure this wrong if new and not careful. I would first assume it is correct and see if there is any way possible to arrive at their position. REMEMBER, you have to get OVERHANG right as well... this is a tough deal; placing the cartridge too far forward or back in the slots will not yield the right postion no matter how much angling. It's an art to get this right. Also, I was wondering if you were detecting the lack of movement with your arm AFTER you put all the damping fluid in? This might have some affect here. AGain, there are a lot of variables. Here are a few articles that should be READ IN FULL. Then, read them again! heh.... The Vinyl Asylum has a decent FAQ. Turntable and Cartridge Setup - GREAT REFERENCE ARTICLES All interested getting the most from their own turntables need to check these out in full. Follow the manufactures specifics first and use these as guidelines. There are a HOST of articles on the NET about this stuff and it's good to get a cross reference as to which ideas seem to come up the most and cross reference with more accuracy. - A Beginner's Guide to Cartridge Setup - Turntable System Setup - Understanding the Issues/Terms with cartridge alignment - Thorsten's post on first time cartridge setup tips Here is actually a complete listing of many of the turntable points via the Vinyl Asylum. Each of the articles and posts have merit and will contribute to understanding, some more clear than others. Those above will give you a good overview and understanding. IT is good to find references for your table's differences, although most will be focused on the BETTER tables (or in some cases, the popular ones). - The Vinyl Asylum FAQ list of links and posts Do some careful close-reading here. Like almost everything, it's all in the detail(s). kh ps- The Shure Gauge is the most popular and least expensive and works ok. There are better ones around but they cost SERIOUS ducats. Some are outlined in the first article above. It also mentiones the DB Systems protractor. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NOSValves Posted October 25, 2002 Author Share Posted October 25, 2002 The non free floating tone arm was noticed before I ever played the unit while setting it up right out of the box. I haven't added any liquid dampening just added some felt under the 3 legs to dampen it from the platform it worked real well ! I will read the links later and get back to you and trust me the cartridge was indeed way off. The way the supplied protractor works it would be impossible to get it wrong. If the overhang is indeed wrong they did it from the factory because I only loosen one screw and corrected the angle of the cartridge. That's another problem they give you absolutely no specs to know what the overhang should be !! The documentation on this table isn't just horrible its non existent completely. Oh and one more thing the bubble level is way off if its intention is to end up with the platter level its redicules !! I hate to gripe and moan here I'm just reporting what I have found ! Craig Craig Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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