HornEd Posted January 20, 2003 Share Posted January 20, 2003 Ah, yes, kjohnsonhp, I too know the joys of Cornwalls since checking into this Forum. PWK designed Cornwalls that stood up vertically and layed down horizontally... the idea was for the upright ones to be the left and right mains and the horizontal one (the one with the so-called "vertical" horn) was meant to lay on its "side" as the center for a three-channel stereo system... a Bell Labs invention that became PWK's favored format until the day he died. My hero, Q-Man, would probably tell you that there is no such thing as a perfect speaker... but he sure tries to make the perfect HT with a blend of Klipschorns, LaScalas and (Klipsch licensed) Imperials. I was going to refer you to Jim Cornell as a stark raving avid Cornwall booster... but he has lately switched to shoehorning a pair of Klipschorns where the Cornwalls used to grow on him. Heritage speakers are voiced differently than the Reference line... and which is the "better" speaker is a highly subjective call... and one that subject to more review than a quarterback's mugging in the Super Bowl. Take your time... get an ears on experience with as many different systems as you can before plunking your money down on the next bump on your upgrade path. Like best intentions, that path can take some pretty wicked swings. Hang in there and keep posting. =HornEd Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kjohnsonhp Posted January 20, 2003 Share Posted January 20, 2003 Thanks HornEd! I have spoken with Jim...in fact I purchased my Outlaw 1050 from him as well as a C7. I sold the C7 and now use a Heresy for timbre matching w/my Corns. The Outlaw seems to be a very satifying AVR for HT at the price although I'm moving off in the tube direction for 2-channel music. After selling my C7 I moved from a 5.1 system to 6.1 with Heresy center front & rear. I"m using my old BA60's for sides until I get another pair of Heresys. For HT I'll will be settling into an Outlaw 6.1 system with 4 Heresys and 2 Cornwalls. I'll be upgrading my CSW PSW1 sub (500w/15") to an SVS (Ultra probably) someday. I also want a new DVD w/SACD & DVD-A and great picture. After that I'm not sure where to go if at all. I was originally planning to buy Belles but ended up with Corns. KHorns would be great but they would take some wall work or fake corners to squeeze in my room with pitched walls above 32". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HornEd Posted January 20, 2003 Share Posted January 20, 2003 I'm impressed kjohnsonhp! You seem to be headed in the right direction for that big, full, Heritage enjoyment. False corners work very well, in fact that's what PWK used in his Hope home until the day he died. Plans for building them the way PWK did are archived on this Forum and will probably come up by searching on "False Corners." The sheet they are on is called "Dope from Hope" which was an infrequent newsletter that used to spring from Hope in days gone by. =HornEd Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordon Groff Posted January 20, 2003 Author Share Posted January 20, 2003 Sob, whimper.... I mocked up an RF-7 in cardboard and took it down to the room that will someday be our HT. Ugh. There is NO WAY I can use them as surrounds! They'll be fine floor-standing as front mains, but NO WAY can I put these monsters on my walls! In my semi-delusional state, gripped by sonic lust, I held it up in the various surround locations to see if there was any chance for a positive WAF. Sweet Nancy just laughed at me. Sorry to say, but she' right. Sorrier than I can say! (Sob, sniffle). It's just not that big a room. Only 11' wide w/7' ceilings (20' long). The RB-5II bookshelves are the biggest I can go, so I guess that's what's got to be. Goodbye dreams of the KILLINGEST KILLER audio system west of the Mississippi!! Hello reality. The good news is that 2 pair of RB-5II's will cost me less than 1 RF-7 (approx). I hope they work ok as surrounds and rears. Any comments about these? I'm still holding out for a HornEd modded RF-7 center! Or- Maybe I should buy a bigger house?? Gordon Checked by reality. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bruinsrme Posted January 20, 2003 Share Posted January 20, 2003 Ah yes the RF-7 all around. I moved my furniture around to make the mock up set up fit in my tiny room. While I went to get a cold one my wife sat in MY chair in the center of the room. When got back down stairs she said "I love it but where are you going to sit". Today I still have what's listed. humbly, Scott Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HornEd Posted January 20, 2003 Share Posted January 20, 2003 Once again reality howls its female dog rap! Sorry Gordon! Had I known your room dimensions I probably would have made an earlier comment. Timbre matching is catching... just try it once and the hook is in... I mean, like, even sweet Nancy will enjoy the differnce it makes. From the sound of things, this won't be your last house... and as Abe Lincoln recalled the story of the middle eastern potentate who asked his advisors for a phrase that covered all situations bad and good... and the answer was, "This, too, shall pass!" Enjoyed your comments about the piano CD... care to share the name or any comments. Piano's are great, especially on tube fired Klipschorns. I picked up the DVD "Piano Grande" which was a thorough delight and well mastered. It was done by the Smithsonian in honor of the 300th anniversary of the invention of the piano. It includes a wealth of different ivory ticklers in the pop, jazz and classical area... with a great kids deal. If you like piano, it's worth catching... even as a rental. Oh, BBB, just caught your post that I somehow missed... now, that was a BBB classic... so I know now it's the reall BBB! =HornEd Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordon Groff Posted January 20, 2003 Author Share Posted January 20, 2003 Thanks for the commiseration, Bruinsrme and HornEd. Bruin, you're still able to fit RB3's? That's cool. As far as the piano music, HornEd, It's Sweet Nancy's original piano music. We've got 8 CD's out and they sell well as it is very original and evocative. Marketing is tough as an independent musician, though. Once people give it a listen, we get a LOT of repeat orders w/fans all over. It is truly unique and wonderful music. If you like, email us your address and I'll send you a free sampler CD for all your help here. The full story and our contact information is at www.sweetnancy.com. Gordon PS: I have yet to find a system that can approach the live sound of our grand piano in our wood-floored living room! Talk about eveloping! I tried to capture it, but you can be the judge of the recording yourself. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JasN00b Posted January 20, 2003 Share Posted January 20, 2003 yes... i have yet to hear something that can approach the quality if the grandpiano in my woodfloored living room as well >=) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HornEd Posted January 21, 2003 Share Posted January 21, 2003 Gordon, I can't resist a good piano CD... and I prefer to play them on my audio system which is a pair of '98 Klipschorns with the improved crossover with a Klipsch Belle in he middle for three-channel stereo. For 5.1 (or above) recordings I turn on the Cornwall side surrounds and an Academy rear effects speaker... as you may know, those 167 lb. K-Horns are sealed to the walls in the corner to complete the fully horn-loaded bass bin. The three-channel stereo serves up a very "live" grand piano... and shows every production flaw that tend to be covered up on most "audiophile" speakers. If you will send the sampler to my mountain retreat, I will guarantee that "Sweet Nancy" will be reviewed by a fair number of piano enthusiasts. We have a grand piano in the clubhouse restaurant (which has a hardwood floor)... so great piano music is a staple around here. In the warmer weather, we have various groups play live on our outdoor stage under a giant oak. Now, Gordon, you can understand why I have such a concern for the "live" music sound rather than the predigested pap that comes out of some allegedly high end speakers. It seems some folks think I still have some photographic skills... well, at least I have the equipment, and last year four groups asked me to take photos for album covers. Many are the groups that preform here are independent musicians... so we understand their situation and how much they appreciate members buying their CD's at their performances. We also have two or more dances a month with live bands. I am building a free standing theater building here for an extra Home Theater system (the 8 Legend system with the dual Ultra tower) for the enjoyment of the members and their guests. I'll most likely play "Sweet Nancy" there from time-to-time so be sure to send info on how to order her CD's. My retreat address is: Ed Dennis 20600 Aldercroft Heights Rd. Los Gatos, CA 95033 So, with two dozen horn loaded speakers and Ed for a first name, you can see I come by the HornEd moniker honestly. I am headed out on a business trip in the morning and look forward to hearing of your progress upon my return. =HornEd Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordon Groff Posted January 21, 2003 Author Share Posted January 21, 2003 "yes... i have yet to hear something that can approach the quality if the grandpiano in my woodfloored living room as well >=)" Hey jasNOOB, I guess you're not too nuts after all Hi HornEd! A sampler should go out in today's mail for you. It's got 2 to 4 selections from each of the 8 CD's we have out with a voiceover that introduces each album over the first part. It is one of our marketing tools. Order forms and brochure will be enclosed. Sounds like you know your piano recordings! I eagerly (with some trepedition) await your comments!! With your system, I know you will hear some of the distortion flaws introduced at the mastering stage (sounds almost like clipping, but I can guarantee it wasn't!), but I don't think they are often enough or serious enough to flaw your listening experience. They make me cringe 'cause I know they're there! Just so you know, it is not jazz. Actually, it is the opposite. More like smooth classical, with LIFE! Like Jim Brickman with EMOTION!! Like Yanni with SOMETHING to SAY!!! Okay, enough shameless self-promotion. Sorry for the spam, guys. Not my intent, but the man asked. Gordon Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BBB Posted January 21, 2003 Share Posted January 21, 2003 Wow. Sorry to hear about your square footage problem Gordon. Bummer. And just when we were all starting to get so excited about spending your money. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordon Groff Posted January 21, 2003 Author Share Posted January 21, 2003 BBB wrote: "Wow. Sorry to hear about your square footage problem Gordon. Bummer. And just when we were all starting to get so excited about spending your money." Me too, B, Me too. The good news is that we can go back to looking at private colleges for my daughter. Gordon Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HornEd Posted January 21, 2003 Share Posted January 21, 2003 Gordon, I went to see Sweet Nancy's (check it out, Forum friends, http://www.sweetnancy.com/ ) and was excited about everything... Sweet Nancy (and would that be Sour Claude?) at the keyboard... and all those income generating studio "friends" in action... and then I found your greater avatar... Sweet Nancy with Earphoned Gordon taking a break from pumping up the bass... (Sorry, actually, that's a bassless charge!). There are a lot of us on the Forum who thrill to the eighty-eights being played for all their worth... a "musical hammock" you say... now that sounds like something I could get into in the summer... but what should we do after Christmas Dreams have faded into New Year's bills? I put an ear to "Ain't Life (piano?) Grand"... and got some more insights into (deeper than a flash) Gordon... but on my laptop WiFi'd on the patio... my appetite whetted, my spirit undampened... the sampler cannot arrive fast enough. So after weaving Christmas Dreams and before the Summer (hammock) Tapestries arrive... is there a chance for an uplifting Spring (eggs & bunny) Afghan? =HornEd PS: Anyone with the determination to expand his home for a fresh off the boat grand piano has an edge on the space race for "live" music a la PWK. Although, I think it will take tubes and K-horns (with a Belle in the middle) to really float your family Klipsch boat. Time, an inspired speaker implementation plan... and a few jillion "Sweet Nancy" CD sales... seems to fit right in... just think of what your studio "friends" would say hearing themselves up close and three-channel stereo personal! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JasN00b Posted January 21, 2003 Share Posted January 21, 2003 ---------------- Hey jasNOOB, I guess you're not too nuts after all ---------------- hehe yes i am. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bruinsrme Posted January 21, 2003 Share Posted January 21, 2003 I have put all HT upgradeson hold until the roof and windows are replaced. Earlier this winter we had a tree come through the roof so in the spring that section of the house is going to be fixed. Plus I slurged for the pioneer 49txi and 47ai. I will looking at the RB3 or 5 sometime this spring. scott Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordon Groff Posted January 21, 2003 Author Share Posted January 21, 2003 Hey HornEd, Thanks for your kind words re: our site and our passion. I could tell you took the time to check it out and you picked up quickly on who we are and what we're about! You're a very insightfull dude, dude! The sampler left today via pony express, so should make it to The Cats sometime next week. Here's Nancy's response to me (we email back and forth when I'm at "work") about your post: (LOL) "I read and enjoyed most of what your friend Ed wrote, but much of it left me in the dark. I don't understand you high techies - you all seem to have your own language. What is a laptop WiFi'd on the patio? What is music a la PWK? And I don't even want to know about tubes and K-horns with Bells in the middle. But he's probably right about your recording clients loving your big fancy new sound system. I did understand the part about him being excited about my music. That's very nice, so I think he'll enjoy the Sampler. His Sampler went out in Tuesday's mail. Bunnies and afghans though...I don't know. He'll have to settle for the sound bites on the website I guess. Love, Your Nancy" I think we'll need a few jillion CD sales to build a HornEd compliant system!! Thanks again for the encouraging comments, Friend! Gordon Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HornEd Posted January 21, 2003 Share Posted January 21, 2003 Obviously a Sweet Nancy translation is overdue... "I read and enjoyed most of what your friend Ed wrote, but much of it left me in the dark. I don't understand you high techies - you all seem to have your own language. What is a laptop WiFi'd on the patio? A laptop computer is a portable computer that opens like a book that can sit on your lap as you type. A WiFi connection to the Internet means a certified wireless connection that allows a laptop to communicate through the air to an antenna that is connected to a cable modem... and allows me to sit on the resort patio answering questions like these. What is music a la PWK? PWK is Paul W. Klipsch, inventor of the Klipschorn and devoted music lover who founded the Klipsch company over 50 years ago... and died in May of 2002. Mr. Paul, as he was affectionately known, preferred three-channel stereo, a system invented by Bell Labs decades ago. He used a pair of his famous fully horn-loaded Klipschorns and a Belle in the middle (explained in the next question). Piano music sounds particularly fine and natural in this configuration. And I don't even want to know about tubes and K-horns with Bells in the middle. Tubes mean amplifier that have "old fashioned" electron tubes to process the sound. Some think they may Sweet Nancy music sweeter! K-Horns are Klipschorns, a 167 lb corner that made it's debut in the late 1940's and has been in continuous production ever since. It still reigns supreme in the Klipsch line. Belles are center channel fully horn-loaded speakers that don't have to be in a corner like the Klipschorns. Mr. Paul had a pair of Klipschorns with a Belle Klipsch in the center right up until the day he died. Actually, Mr. Paul (or PWK) designed the LaScala speaker for the center but his wife, Belle, thought it too ugly for her home... so PWK made it prettier with some fancy cabinetry and named it after her. On the Klipsch Forum we call that compying with the WAF (Wife Approval Factor). Belle died early and Paul married Miss Valerie, a local high school German teacher in Hope, Arkansas. They were a very loving couple. I am fortunate to have two autographed copies of PWK's biography given to me when I was too ill to fly to Hope for the book signing. There's a lot to like about the Klipsch experience. But he's probably right about your recording clients loving your big fancy new sound system. I did understand the part about him being excited about my music. That's very nice, so I think he'll enjoy the Sampler. His Sampler went out in Tuesday's mail. Bunnies and afghans though...I don't know. Well, bunnies were a euphamism for Eastertide and afghans are a handmade art form older than tapistries. I received a handmade afghan bedspread from a person I've never met in New Jersey this Christmas in appreciation for helping a lone female software engineer cope with what is often considered a man's jargon to achieve a superior sound system. Since your CD's highlight Christmas... and the "musical hammock" phrase suggested summer... I was just teasing you to say that you need to make another CD that fits between Christmas and Summer... and Easter just seemed like an occasion that might fit your music. He'll have to settle for the sound bites on the website I guess. Oh, yes, and Gordon, make sure you always... Love, Your Nancy" Thanks again for the sampler, "His Nancy" =HornEd Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordon Groff Posted January 22, 2003 Author Share Posted January 22, 2003 Hey HornEd, Thanks for your detailed translation! I know SN appreciated it! I did too. I would never admit I had no idea what "a laptop WiFi'd on the patio" meant . It's a guy thing. Wireless net access? Sounds very cool! Thanks for the discussion of Belles and PWK too. I learned a lot there. Your "Afghan" (Tapestries) comment went over my head too the first time around. You're one convoluted dude, dude! Gordon Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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