Sunnysal.......question about your 6sn7 shootout

[Kek]

I recently upgraded from a AES AE-3 preamp to a Rogue Magnum 99. I was using a pair of Sylvania chrome dome 6sn7's in the AES and I thought the sound was fantastic. The Rogue was purchased brand new and out of the box with the stock tubes, I found the sound to be disappointing. The Rogue had a much larger sound stage and greater detail and character than the AES; but the AES sounded better.

I figured the new preamp needed more time (only 25+ hours to date) to settle in and a new set of NOS to bring it to life. I called Mark Obrien at Rogue and told him of my needs and he sent me some quad NOS RCA to try. They sent me one pair of RCA gtb with side getter and a pair of RCA gta with dual side getters. Put them in and wow what a great difference they made, BUT one of the channels sounded as like a FM station tuning in and out....one of the tubes going bad.....just my luck. Called Mark Obrien back and he said he would send out 4 more RCA's.

In the mean time I came across your post on your shoot out of 6sn7's and was intrigued by your comments on the EH6sn7's. I figured that I would give the EH6sn7 Gold Pins a try so I ordered 2 pair. The replacement Rca gtb's came in first so I put them in. These gtb's were different in both looks and sound. The tubes plates(?) were not as long inside the bottle...much shorter, and they did not have the same sound quality of the first order, and their was quite a bit of audible hiss present. Not to my likings.

The EH's came to my door the following day, and again I pulled the cover off and installed different tubes. These sounded much better at first over the 2nd set of RCA's. They semed to have a great sound stage and top end, but the lowend came across as over emphasized and the upper mids choked, harsh, constrained. There was a hiss present but not as bad as the 2nd RCA's. Did you find these EH's to sound better after time? I want to tranfer Magnum 99 into a exceptional piece of equipment and need some help. Suggestions are welcomed.

My systems main components are Bryston 4Bst, Rogue Magnum 99 preamp, Klipsch KLF30's.

kek

[mobile homeless]

I still find it hard to believe these EH 6SN7 can sound as good as reported as every Sovtek 6SN7 I have heard sound horrible to me. In fact, almost every 6SN7 type tube done after the 70s including the Philips JAN samples does not have the best nature of the 6SN7.

BUT, several have said this new EH-6SN7 is much better (as tony states) than the other samples so I imagine one day to hear it. The price is definitely right, I am just having a hard time convincing myself that the sonics will arrive as well. So far, the modern 6SN7 is a major disappointment. I need to sample a pair of Russian 6SN7 again.

What everyone eventually finds out is that at different operating points, certain tubes can come into their own. For this reason, some stellar recs dont always work in all pieces of gear as claimed. Also, if in the preamp, the type and quality of amp will have a handle on how you perceive the preamp tubes.

Ultimately, you have to try the tubes in your own gear to see, but one can use the recs as a guideline. Tony and I have different type systems and my findings were different than his regarding the 6SN7. I was more impressed with US based 6SN7 than the British versions. And in my gear, the 5692, depending on year and issue, was a great option.

On another matter, having a tube as a driver in an amp is another role that differs from the use in a line stage. So if someone is recommending the tube in this role, it must be noted. Ditto when moving from your fav line stage tube to driver role.

Also, some tubes stress different parts of the sonic picture, in other words, have strengths that some prefer more than others. Many love the JAN Philips 6SN7WGT in their Moondogs. I find these tubes rather sterile, a bit harsh, and too coarse on top, although they have a brightness and detail that might bring accolades at first listen. Long term exposure, which is the ultimate in audition, sometimes brings a change in heart. Ditto with more and more experience with tubes as subtleties sometimes are revealed with more exposure, better gear in front and behind, and more experience with different varieties.

Simply put, recs for "the best" 6SN7/5692 just dont work across the board. They should only be used as potential guilelines.

kh

[sunnysal]

the most important thing I learned from the shootout is that tubes perform differently in every single situation. In my amp, in my system, the EH6SN7s sounded great (kelly you really need to buy a pair!) and the really old tungsol roundplates sounded best. I truthfully cannot predict what would sound good in anyone else's rig. I can tell you I just received a pair of the gold pins version of the EH6SN7s I bought them since my first experience was so great with the "plain" EH tube...and well, the tungsols still win out...that is, in my system. Kelly I am going to send you a pair of EHs just so I can hear your opinions about them, mail me to work out the details. re: what will work best with rogues, I would do a search at AA to see if anyone has posted about their experiences tube rolling that nice preamp, I am more convinced than ever that tueb rolling advice needs to be as unit specific as possible. BTW, if the 1947 tungsol black wrapped round plate sounds so good in my system it MAY sound good in yours...but I would not invest in such expensive NOS tubes until hearing from someone with at least the same unit that the tube soudned great in theri system. warm regards, tony

[neo33]

I have been experimenting with a number of different types of tubes on my AE-1 preamp for a while now. Sofar, I found the Sylvania JAN CHS 6SN7WGTA (chrome top, brown base) tubes to sound the most open and natural to my ears; very lush midrange with an extended highend, good bottom end and very low microphonics. The GE 6SN7GTA tubes are more warmer in the midrange with substantial loss in the bottom end and increased microphonics. The Sylvania 6SN7GTA green label (chrome top) tubes sound a little more natural then the GE; good but with a slight forward sound in the highend; the midrange is excellent but the bass is not as forceful as the WGTA version. With the Westinghouse 6SN7GT (chrome top) tubes, the sound was a little more neutral then the GE and Sylvania green label but a little lack in the midrange, some loss in the bottom end and slight increase in microphonics. I found the EH 6SN7 tubes to be quite plain of the bunch, a little harsh in the highend and somewhat constrained in the midrange.

[AnalOg]

I installed a set of EH's in my Rogue, first impression out the box was sterile & strindgent sounding. This could be a breakin issue so I'll hold off untill a few hundred hours to do come A/B ing with the Sylvanias.

Tom

[JBryan]

Kek,

Given your requirements, I'd suggest going with an older Sylvania 6SN7. They're not the best tubes in regard to extension and detail but in my experience, they are usually the quietest as a group. The yellow label GTBs or the green label GTAs would be a good choice. They offer most of the Sylvania sound but can be found for less than $20 a pop. Spend a few $ more and the green label WGTA that Neo suggested would be an excellent choice and I think its the quietest 6SN7 I've ever used. A couple of other good choices are the Raytheon GTB (the VT-231's less expensive twin brother) and the National Union GT (tall bottle). The TungSols are exceptional tubes and are hard to beat if you can find a nice set but they tend to be hit and miss with noise (even when they test fine) and in my book are a pretty expensive roll of the dice. If you really want to spend some $, try the Ken Rad 6SN7GT (dark bottle). Probably the finest sounding tube I've heard. The older RCAs (40's-50's) sound pretty good but they do lean toward noisy and I feel there are better options - especially in a preamp where you can really hear a tube's characteristics. Have fun -Bryan