Dolby TrueHD vs. Dolby Digital EX - Some advice please

[sthebody]

I have an opportunity to purchase a used Rotel RSP-1068 surround processor for a song. No HDMI inputs on that model, so as I understand it no chance for Dolby TrueHD. Can I get some input from those of you who have had a chance to hear TrueHD. In your opinion is there much of a difference in audio quality between TrueHD and say Dolby Digital EX. Just wondering if I should hold off and save my pennies for the new RSP-1069 processor? I noticed Rotel had info for the RSP-1069 on their website now, and it has HDMI 1.1 inputs.

As with almost all advice given in this forum I realize "how much of a difference" is subjective, some people probably wouldn't hear a difference at all. I notice a difference between 392kb encoded mp3 and WMA Lossless audio files, many cannot. I can't imagine there will be that much of a difference between the compressed DD EX and lossless TrueHD, but I would like to get some input if anyone has a moment.

Thanks in advance.

[el jopez]

My understanding though limited is this: All players decode all audio formats at the player now and transmit the decoded audio files as lossless PCM to the receiver/pre/pro of choice. So if your pre/pro can accept analog MPCM you should be fine.

As far as difference, everything should sound great as these new codecs are higher resolution than DTS, which was a big improvement over DD in many films. [Y]

[sthebody]

Thanks el jopez. I am sure they will sound great as well. I kind of thought the difference between DD and TrueHD would be more like the difference between DTS and DD, and am hoping it isn't as big of a difference as going from a lossy music file to a lossless music file. But I base that thought on no personal experience whatsoever.

In the past I have been rather happy with the sound quality of DVD's but always kind of felt they could sound a lot better. I don't want to lock myslef into older formats if the newer ones are considerably better. If I purchase the non-HDMI 1068 I think the problem I am going to run into is not having a cable that can handle that type of bitrate. I am pretty sure Toslink/SPIDF can't handle it, but HDMI is designed so it can. So even if the signal is decoded, I don't think I will be able to get it to the 1068. If I am wrong in this regard then I have nothing to worry about.

Thanks again for the reply.

PS: GOOOOO DeanG!!!! Worthy upgrade indeed.

[damonrpayne]

I have not yet been able to test this in my room, but it is supposed to be a night and day difference. I don't have my spec sheets open, but DD Ex is only something like 640kb/s shared among all the channels, DD TrueHD is up to 18mb/s shared among all the channels variable bit rate, this is lossless and hypothetically identical to the studio master.

[Professor.Ham.Slap]

It really is a night and day difference between the two. My speakers really shine with the TrueHD tracks. Get yourself the Toshiba HD-XA2 as it has the analog outputs which your Rotel can use.

[sthebody]

Thanks Ham.

Didn't even think about using analog outputs. I have been looking at the HD-A20 and didn't even know it was an option.

[UFObuster]

For some info on the Rotel RSP-1068 vs the newer 1069, check the "club Rotel" forum at http://www.htguide.com/forum/forumdisplay.php4?f=20

As I've read and understood the products: the players decode; you can get audio in thru the HDMI cable OR thru analog just like you would for DVD-A or SACD. The processor in the 1068 will do fine for this. Problems come up if you have an HD or Blu-ray player and a DVD-A/SACD player both needing the analog inputs...thus requiring some kind of switching. The leading edge is in the receivers of large-scale manufacturers at this point. Small producers such as Rotel and more high-end companies will lag...BUT, this is not much of a problem because the "content" is a long way off.

Keeping in mind that Rotel and higher end producers are aimed at a sophisticated audio market, the current "hi-def" sound products (DTS 96/24, DVD-A analog, and SACD) are really going to sound as good as anything on the horizon. The movie industry is promoting the current hi-def video products but the sound tracks are still a little lacking. Let's be honest about your intent. Do you want to hear good music reproduction or is bus crashing, sword clashing, bullet tracing, bomb detonation, etc. your bag? It will be a long time before you will hear the best of the classics (and I include pop classics) available in any better sound formats than what are available. And IMHO, the music industry will continue to include a panoply of formats to enlarge their market share. And we haven't even mentioned that 2-channel music in CD and vinyl is still impressive if you're looking for "true" reproduction using some high quality equipment.

The "hi-def" sound of the HD formats is still a bit of a marketing buzz because we've actually already got it. I own the Rotel RSP-1068 and still find it hard to find content that measures up to its potential....and that means the same for higher-end audio products. Most of the hard-ware schemes focus on an impressive list of "bells-and-whistles" that don't improve sound quality. Wait and see. Video improvement is a pretty good thing...but even there, the market is showing up with stuff like the Oppo products that are beginning to even marginalize HD video unless you've got a HUGH screen where you can actually see a difference. Be careful and don't just buy bragging rights.

Bottom line. Determine if you are a hardware lover or a content lover. I know people who own $$thousands in camera equipment and can't take a picture. They love it. Do you like music? Then buy hardware that complements content and enjoy it.

Last note: the 1069 may have some actual audio improvements over the 1068 in it that may make it worth looking at...but it's still a lot more expensive. I'll be waiting for "next-gen" to justify the expense.

[sthebody]

Thank you for the link UFO. Great info. I was looking for an article like that earlier today and had no luck.

I am using this system for mostly home theater applications and to play lossless music files off my HTPC. I do like music...a lot. I plan on setting up a 2 (or 3) channel system dedicated solely to enjoying music once my tenant/friend/roomate gets a place and I get my extra room back. I won't be purchasing a high fidelity player until I get ready to put that system together. I know it is an impossible dream, but I just wish they would "standardize" the recording of music somehow. Once you get decent equipment you really start to notice that some albums sound far superior to others. Seems most of the new albums I purchase these days are recorded extra loud and not a lot of time has been spent on production quality.

In the meantime I didn't want to miss out on the new surround formats. I have yet to hear anything but good comments about Dolby TrueHD, most people use the term "night and day" when comparing Dolby Digital/DTS to Dolby True HD. Sounds like I won't have to miss a thing if I get the 1068 and use it's analog inputs. Provided I get a HD-DVD player that has analog out. Great News!!

Thank you for the replies

[UFObuster]

Thank you for the link UFO. Great info. I was looking for an article like that earlier today and had no luck.

I am using this system for mostly home theater applications and to play lossless music files off my HTPC. I do like music...a lot. I plan on setting up a 2 (or 3) channel system dedicated solely to enjoying music once my tenant/friend/roomate gets a place and I get my extra room back. I won't be purchasing a high fidelity player until I get ready to put that system together. I know it is an impossible dream, but I just wish they would "standardize" the recording of music somehow. Once you get decent equipment you really start to notice that some albums sound far superior to others. Seems most of the new albums I purchase these days are recorded extra loud and not a lot of time has been spent on production quality.

In the meantime I didn't want to miss out on the new surround formats. I have yet to hear anything but good comments about Dolby TrueHD, most people use the term "night and day" when comparing Dolby Digital/DTS to Dolby True HD. Sounds like I won't have to miss a thing if I get the 1068 and use it's analog inputs. Provided I get a HD-DVD player that has analog out. Great News!!

Thank you for the replies

Agreed, recording quality is all over the map. That's what I was talking about in referring to content.

Looking over your equipment profile, like me, you're set-up already for good 2 channel with the separate RB-1080. I used a Yammie RX-V2600 for a while as a pre-pro before getting the Rotel RSP-1068. When you get a separate pre-pro with good analog 2-channel, you're set great. I use the 1080 exclusively for the RF-7 and power the rest with the RMB-1075. I toyed with the idea of adding a Jolida CD player, but went instead with the Denon 3910 used (at a great price) because it plays CDs very well and gave me back some of the "bells and whistles" that I missed from the Yammie. It up-converts video as well or better than the Oppos. I'm firmly in the "wait and see" catagory regarding "hi-def" players. As I went at length in my previous post about the so-called "hi-def" music scene, I'll just simply say we already have "hi-def audio" in current advanced formats thru analog inputs (and the DTS 96/24 format still remains impressive and under-used by the recording industry). Another reason to wait and see what, if any, music content follows. I won't spend mega-bucks on upgrades just to hear better sound effects in movies.

You have a great set-up now. Get the most of it.

[VT Hokies]

You definately do not need HDMI to enjoy all the new audio codecs found in DVD Audio, SACD, Blu-ray and HD DVD so long as you have multi channel analogue external inputs on your pre/pro/receiver and multi channel analogue outputs on your source player. At this time and maybe forever all the decoding will be handled by the players becuase of advance content. To the best of my knowledge there is only one player out now that has the update that will handle DTS-HD Master Audio and that is the Samsung 1400. I am not 100% sure if it handles DD True HD at this time.

I for one, hate HDMI. It is basically a checks and balances system that was implemented by the studios to protect against piracy. It is a poor means for this but I am afraid we are stuck with it at this time.

Unless you have to have the new Rotel go with the cheapest one and get the Toshiba HD XA2 with the analogue outs or the Samsung. If you have to have more than one multi channel analogue inputs on your pre/pro go to www.zektor.com and pick up a MAS 7.1 switcher which adds nothing to the sound quality and will enable you to have up to 3 sources that utilize multi channel analogue inputs.

[rockbobmel]

I wouldn't say night and day. I only have a few TrueHD dvds and compared the DDEX tracks. They are EQd different, but the up is not a Chevy/BMW difference. Plus DDEX is 7.1 matrixed and TrueHD is only 5.1

[Professor.Ham.Slap]

I wouldn't say night and day. I only have a few TrueHD dvds and compared the DDEX tracks. They are EQd different, but the up is not a Chevy/BMW difference. Plus DDEX is 7.1 matrixed and TrueHD is only 5.1

Yes, perhaps night and day is a bit too much. Let me put it this way, I definitely hear a considerable amount more detail in the TrueHD tracks as compared to DD. I just think it is well worth it because any little extra I can squeeze out of my RF-7's, well, I just really enjoy []