Deang
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Posts posted by Deang
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NOZ
that seems totally backwards to me
I would think the Scalas would be awesome for HT and the RF7's better for music
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Deanf>s>
Cary AE-25f>s>SuperAmpf>s> - Sonic Frontiers Line 1 - Sony DVP-S9000ES - Klipsch RF7's
SVS 20-39 CS Plus - Samson S1000 - HSU Research elec. crossover - MIT/Monsters
f>s>
Inside every small problem is a large problem struggling to get outf>c>s>-- 2nd Law of Blissful Ignorancef>s>c>
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Oh my gawd -- what the hell is it?
Geez man, you're actually touching it ~
Awesome catch.
So, you gonna eat it or mount it
This reminds me:
http://users3.ev1.net/~jtclay/fishin.htm
Don't forget to turn the sound up -- there is audio with this one.
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Deanf>s>
Cary AE-25f>s>SuperAmpf>s> - Sonic Frontiers Line 1 - Sony DVP-S9000ES - Klipsch RF7's
SVS 20-39 CS Plus - Samson S1000 - HSU Research elec. crossover - MIT/Monsters
f>s>
Inside every small problem is a large problem struggling to get outf>c>s>-- 2nd Law of Blissful Ignorancef>s>c>
This message has been edited by deang on 06-01-2002 at 09:46 PM
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Ahh yes...the dented woofer syndrome.
Power plugs swinging, thumbs being jammed into them, cats jumping with claws clinging.
Amazing the abuse those Klipschcones withstand for being less than paper thin, and as light as a feather.
Good thing it wasn't a Heresy -- your thumb would have gone right through the paper driver.
Worse yet -- imagine if you were trying to position a LaScala on that shelf, and it fell over forcing you into the bass bin. Man, wouldn't that suck.
f>s>------------------
Deanf>s>
Cary AE-25f>s>SuperAmpf>s> - Sonic Frontiers Line 1 - Sony DVP-S9000ES - Klipsch RF7's
SVS 20-39 CS Plus - Samson S1000 - HSU Research elec. crossover - MIT/Monsters
f>s>
Inside every small problem is a large problem struggling to get outf>c>s>-- 2nd Law of Blissful Ignorancef>s>c>
This message has been edited by deang on 06-01-2002 at 09:37 PM
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Tom, I can't find the 301 -- is it the predecessor to the current 302?
The 302 crosses over at 1.2Khz -- doesn't really seem like your kind of animal.
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Deanf>s>
Cary AE-25f>s>SuperAmpf>s> - Sonic Frontiers Line 1 - Sony DVP-S9000ES - Klipsch RF7's
SVS 20-39 CS Plus - Samson S1000 - HSU Research elec. crossover - MIT/Monsters
f>s>
Inside every small problem is a large problem struggling to get outf>c>s>-- 2nd Law of Blissful Ignorancef>s>c>
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helluva thread
i'm bookmarking this baby
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Deanf>s>
Cary AE-25f>s>SuperAmpf>s> - Sonic Frontiers Line 1 - Sony DVP-S9000ES - Klipsch RF7's
SVS 20-39 CS Plus - Samson S1000 - HSU Research elec. crossover - MIT/Monsters
f>s>
Inside every small problem is a large problem struggling to get outf>c>s>-- 2nd Law of Blissful Ignorancef>s>c>
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Would some please define "low quality" LP playback.
What are we talking here?
And what constitutes a "...a high-quality, properly set-up LP playback system."
Can I get this with $200, or $10,000?
No one ever seems to say for sure.
It was one of the reasons I went digital.
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Deanf>s>
Cary AE-25f>s>SuperAmpf>s> - Sonic Frontiers Line 1 - Sony DVP-S9000ES - Klipsch RF7's
SVS 20-39 CS Plus - Samson S1000 - HSU Research elec. crossover - MIT/Monsters
f>s>
Inside every small problem is a large problem struggling to get outf>c>s>-- 2nd Law of Blissful Ignorancef>s>c>
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Oh man, could this get dicey.
Now Builder, since when did you start worrying about WAF
Cost? A pair of KPT325's would run less than $3000 a pair, right around what a set of LaScalas would cost, and they are two-ways to boot -- with a HF driver that plays down to 600Hz.
Low end extension? Well, they play at least as low as the Scalas and Heresy's right? Who needs low end finesse when you got all that ACCURACY?
Kidding aside. I think Tom would argue for the driver that plays everything from 600Hz on up. I gotta admit -- that's appealing.
One thing you bring up of notable interest is the bit about being designed for being able to take massive amounts of power. That makes me think about Heritage and how PWK designed Heritage to be used with very low power.
Pro Line configurations might play hell with SET or Triode PP amps. I get this idea from a review I read for the RB5 about a year ago. Here are the comments I am referring too with the related graph.
The impedance curve shows woofer and port peaks, the latter at 50 ohms, a low point between them of 5 ohms, with a high of 29 ohms in the midrange. Maybe this speaker isn't quite the answer for single-ended fans after all, since frequency response will tend to track the impedance curve with these amps in such circumstances. The midrange phase angle is fairly steep at +/- 45o, but we must remember that this is electrical phase, and that the horn loading of the tweeter, which puts it well behind the woofer, may well tend to bring it into better acoustic phase with it. The RB-5 should be fairly easy to drive, but a single-ended amp might not like the phase angle, either.f>s>
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Deanf>s>
Cary AE-25f>s>SuperAmpf>s> - Sonic Frontiers Line 1 - Sony DVP-S9000ES - Klipsch RF7's
SVS 20-39 CS Plus - Samson S1000 - HSU Research elec. crossover - MIT/Monsters
f>s>
Inside every small problem is a large problem struggling to get outf>c>s>-- 2nd Law of Blissful Ignorancef>s>c>
This message has been edited by deang on 06-01-2002 at 08:17 PM
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oohhhweee -- lynn and hump goin at it -- ROTFLOL
hey trespasser -- on your budget you gotta go used market
most bang for the buck will be 5 Heresy's
you can find them for around $300 to $400 a pair
you will need 3 pair, so that's around $1000
start shopping ebay and www.audiogon.com
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Deanf>s>
Cary AE-25f>s>SuperAmpf>s> - Sonic Frontiers Line 1 - Sony DVP-S9000ES - Klipsch RF7's
SVS 20-39 CS Plus - Samson S1000 - HSU Research elec. crossover - MIT/Monsters
f>s>
Inside every small problem is a large problem struggling to get outf>c>s>-- 2nd Law of Blissful Ignorancef>s>c>
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Week 1 - "What's with the black water heater?"
Week 2 - "It doesn't give me a headache."
Week 3 - "It doesn't look so bad."
Week 4 - "You really like that thing don't you?"
Week 5 - I take off early from work to go home and watch FROM HELL. Debbie gets home around 5:30 and comes upstairs, stands next to my chair, looks over my shoulder, and asks:
"Isn't that distracting"
"What?" I ask
"The whole house shaking."
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Deanf>s>
Cary AE-25f>s>SuperAmpf>s> - Sonic Frontiers Line 1 - Sony DVP-S9000ES - Klipsch RF7's
SVS 20-39 CS Plus - Samson S1000 - HSU Research elec. crossover - MIT/Monsters
f>s>
Inside every small problem is a large problem struggling to get outf>c>s>-- 2nd Law of Blissful Ignorancef>s>c>
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Zeke said: >>> There is like so many posts about SVS, and I can read anything there is to know about SVS, but not so many posts about HSU. <<<f>s>
Gee, I wonder why that is?
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Deanf>s>
Cary AE-25f>s>SuperAmpf>s> - Sonic Frontiers Line 1 - Sony DVP-S9000ES - Klipsch RF7's
SVS 20-39 CS Plus - Samson S1000 - HSU Research elec. crossover - MIT/Monsters
f>s>
Inside every small problem is a large problem struggling to get outf>c>s>-- 2nd Law of Blissful Ignorancef>s>c>
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firejim is my hero
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Deanf>s>
Cary AE-25f>s>SuperAmpf>s> - Sonic Frontiers Line 1 - Sony DVP-S9000ES - Klipsch RF7's
SVS 20-39 CS Plus - Samson S1000 - HSU Research elec. crossover - MIT/Monsters
f>s>
Inside every small problem is a large problem struggling to get outf>c>s>-- 2nd Law of Blissful Ignorancef>s>c>
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They actually look pretty nice -- real good shape except for that crushed dustcap.
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Deanf>s>
Cary AE-25f>s>SuperAmpf>s> - Sonic Frontiers Line 1 - Sony DVP-S9000ES - Klipsch RF7's
SVS 20-39 CS Plus - Samson S1000 - HSU Research elec. crossover - MIT/Monsters
f>s>
Inside every small problem is a large problem struggling to get outf>c>s>-- 2nd Law of Blissful Ignorancef>s>c>
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Christos -- I was completely making a joke! As a matter of fact I visit your quite often, as the reference systems are simply gorgeous to look at. I actually would have stayed with vinyl if I had not sold every single record I used to own. It would simply be impossible to replace them now. I have neither the time, nor the resources to start over.
Boa -- all you need now is 8-track!
builder -- A vet. I repent in dust in ashes. You deserve the highest respect. I mean that.
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Deanf>s>
Cary AE-25f>s>SuperAmpf>s> - Sonic Frontiers Line 1 - Sony DVP-S9000ES - Klipsch RF7's
SVS 20-39 CS Plus - Samson S1000 - HSU Research elec. crossover - MIT/Monsters
f>s>
Inside every small problem is a large problem struggling to get outf>c>s>-- 2nd Law of Blissful Ignorancef>s>c>
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Dave
>>What Diamond noticed was that the oldsters did not react the same to the CD's, even though it was the same music, that they had to analog. They did not quiet down and listen, and seemed bored.<<
Considering just how bad PCM sounded during that time frame -- this should not surprise us. It wasnt just our imaginations, it sounded very bad. PCM is not a loss-less technology like vinyl, and it has taken PCM 20 years to become listenable.f>s>
>>sound-card in refurbished 200mhz or better computer (less than 200) will provide CD playback equal to or better than a dedicated CD player at twice the price. Further, ripping CD's to WAV files (without transcoding!) is far more convenient than handling CD's.<<
To rip CDs to WAV files still entails handling CDs. Also, WAV files are still just 0s and 1s and I fail to see how this process gives you more than what you started with. That is, you start with a certain amount of binary information and you end with the same amount of binary information. I guess I dont fully understand. On another note, how does this process compare to a player at 2 times the price? I would be really interested in more detail regarding the equipment, software, and exact process you undertake to achieve the results you describe (Im not always the brightest light in the chandelier). What do you mean by "transcoding".f>s>
mdeneen
>>I have no doubt the reports above are true. Which is to say, most LPs sound better than most CDs on most systemsthe most common proposition is that "digital is just ones and zeros which lack a certain soul, and LPs are the REAL music represented in an analog wave and this more soulful<<
The reasoning is that PCM doesnt really translate or utilize ALL of the information available from the source. Evidently, it would take more binary information than CD can store in order to accurately represent all of the analog information. There is considerable compression. At least, this is my understanding.f>s>
>>LPs of the Golden Era - say the 50s and 60s - were generally made from much simpler micing techniques than CDs made today. So, for instance, a nice jazz ensemble recorded in '56 might have used 5 or 6 mics simply placed and recorded direct to the master tape. Mixing would then be a rather simple task. Today, that same recording would use 25 mics, a digital console, massive over dubbing, and very complicated mixing including having musicians play the parts at different times, in different studios and on different media, which get assembled later.<<
I think this would also apply to recordings made through most of the 70s. I think your latter statement regarding the complexity of more recent recording methods along with the inherent limitations of the PCM process, worked together to account for the shear awfulness of most CDs over the last 20 years. The learning curve for Recording Engineers must have also been immense. Simply to many changes in the process at one time. What I believe however, is that advancements in the technology utilized by the studios coupled with more extensive experience has led to some very good current PCM recordings. I have purchased many of the new 20 bit (and more) remasters of discs originally released in the early 80s and they are a substantial improvement. A few are inferior remixes but they have almost no discernible grain.f>s>
>>The LP technology, compared to CD technology has
a) less dynamic range
narrower frequency responsec) higher noise level
d) less channel separation
and
e) an inability to remain stable in some of the modern playback environments. I cant imagine a table trying to track accurately in my listening room with my playback habits. Higher than normal SPLs and the powerful pressure waves from my sub would present a virtual nightmare to any table and arm combination. You can only isolate so much.
>>and LP is very comparable in this regard to today's "FM Stereo Broadcast" specificationsYesterday, C&S reports to me how "wonderful" his McIntosh MR65 tuner has been sounding compared to his various other sources of LP, 78 and so on. And I start thinking, "Hmmmm, yes, my MR-71 sounds very nice too."
He goes on to ask, "Why is that?"<<
Dont forget about all the strange things FM stations do to those signals. We know they boost the lows and highs considerably.f>s>
>>what might account for our LP preference is this: Just the right FR balance, not too much "stereo effect" (closer to mono), This would make it similar to today's FM. Also, since the sessions were generally miced in a more natural way, and since there was a distinct lack of processing on the boards, a more inherently "natural" sound on the master tape. A better recording to start with.<<
I think the emphasis should be on the word "balanced". Not in how it relates to imaging, sound-staging, or separation but simply in the sense of how the top and bottom of the frequency spectrum relate to each other.f>s>
>>Many CDs are gimmicked up. Why? Because they can.<<
I think for the longest time they sounded the way they did was because they were mixed to sound good on boom-boxes, and not high-end, accurate stereo systems.f>s>
>>What really happens when you try to record up to 20KHz - and you end up with a lot of "sizzle" on the recording that is generally TOTALLY missing from LPs?<<
I dont anything happens when you try to record up to 20KHz. Ive been playing around with a test disc and SPL meter recently, I found out that I cannot hear anything above 15KHz. The 15KHz test tone is non-existent to my ears. So the fact that CDs can really go to 20KHz is inconsequential as far as my hearing is concerned. However, the older CD releases still sound quite hot on top. I think they were boosting the levels between 8 and 12KHz to enhance playback on systems not capable of accurate reproduction.f>s>
>>And, in real performances filtered out of the air by the woman's flowered hat in front of you..<<
Yes, this woman is everywhere. I hate that women in the hat.f>s>
>>if you have tone controls on your preamp, try playing a CD, and shaping it more like an FM broadcast. Cut the bass a bit starting at 50Hz. Cut the highs starting at 10 or 12KHz. Blend the two channels back together a bit to get less "stereo separation." Does it sound closer to the LP?<<
I would be simply amazed if an FM broadcast even goes to 12KHz. I say if one likes the older music - just stick with vinyl. If one likes much of the newer stuff (early 90's and forward), just go ahead and stay with CD because it has gotten so much better that it has pretty much closed the gap, and then of course there is SACD. Between the new PCM releases, reissues of slightly older material redone with 20 bit and more, SACD, and the quality of sound I'm hearing from the new DACs -- the temptation to go back to vinyl just isn't there for me anymore.f>s>
This message has been edited by deang on 05-31-2002 at 02:13 PM
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HSU can be seen and purchased online at www.hsuresearch.com
I recently bought the HSU electronic crossover which is an excellent piece of gear for the money -- so I know these folks can engineer. My main problem with the subs is that the driver is at the top, making the units kind of top heavy (bad if you have kids or pets), there is no grill (protection) for the driver, and they are also engineered to be placed as close to your sitting position as possible -- versus corner loaded (placement).
The most performance for the money is SVS. This is not even open to debate.
For $800 you can get the big one in the powered version with the built in crossover. It will roughly give you the output of two 1000 watt cubes. I am not kidding.
It may have a low WAF, and my wife said it looked like an "ugly water heater" -- but after she heard it she actually preferred it to both the Boston Acoustics PV1000 and Klipsch LF10 I used to have (both high powered cubes with passive radiators).
Don't play around and do what I did -- which was buy three different subs and lose over $1000 before I finally did what I should have done in the first place.
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Deanf>s>
Cary AE-25f>s>SuperAmpf>s> - Sonic Frontiers Line 1 - Sony DVP-S9000ES - Klipsch RF7's
SVS 20-39 CS Plus - Samson S1000 - HSU Research elec. crossover - MIT/Monsters
f>s>
Inside every small problem is a large problem struggling to get outf>c>s>-- 2nd Law of Blissful Ignorancef>s>c>
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Kelly,
I feel the recent generation DACs are very good.
Until recently, I would have never even remotely considered a Sony machine.
When you get some time I would pleased if you would read the review I wrote for the Sony DVP-S9000ES at the Asylum. I copied the post to this site here
You might also find the following three threads interesting (they are short).
http://www.audioasylum.com/forums/hirez/messages/76576.html
http://www.audioasylum.com/forums/hirez/messages/75315.html
http://www.audioasylum.com/forums/hirez/messages/70968.html
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Deanf>s>
Cary AE-25f>s>SuperAmpf>s> - Sonic Frontiers Line 1 - Sony DVP-S9000ES - Klipsch RF7's
SVS 20-39 CS Plus - Samson S1000 - HSU Research elec. crossover - MIT/Monsters
f>s>
Inside every small problem is a large problem struggling to get outf>c>s>-- 2nd Law of Blissful Ignorancef>s>c>
This message has been edited by deang on 05-31-2002 at 01:36 AM
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Here you go -- we were just discussing the deal with the marker the other day at the Asylum.
Here is the article as posted.
http://www.audioasylum.com/forums/hirez/messages/75153.html
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Deanf>s>
Cary AE-25f>s>SuperAmpf>s> - Sonic Frontiers Line 1 - Sony DVP-S9000ES - Klipsch RF7's
SVS 20-39 CS Plus - Samson S1000 - HSU Research elec. crossover - MIT/Monsters
f>s>
Inside every small problem is a large problem struggling to get outf>c>s>-- 2nd Law of Blissful Ignorancef>s>c>
This message has been edited by deang on 05-30-2002 at 11:24 PM
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Hetmann
I'm very familiar with that table. I had the one two models up with the black lacquer finish.
It's actually a pretty decent rig for the money. Why not fire her up and see what shes got?
Mike
Would you believe that's what I just got done doing with my kids? Sounded pretty darn good on my wimpy 2-channel tube rig
Deanf>s>
Cary AE-25f>s>SuperAmpf>s> - Sonic Frontiers Line 1 - Sony DVP-S9000ES - Klipsch RF7's
SVS 20-39 CS Plus - Samson S1000 - HSU Research elec. crossover - MIT/Monsters
f>s>
Inside every small problem is a large problem struggling to get outf>c>s>-- 2nd Law of Blissful Ignorancef>s>c>
This message has been edited by deang on 05-30-2002 at 11:00 PM
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i can't believe i just read this whole thread
my head hurts
oh gawd -- it's the damn glue -- I gotta get outta here
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Deanf>s>
Cary AE-25f>s>SuperAmpf>s> - Sonic Frontiers Line 1 - Sony DVP-S9000ES - Klipsch RF7's
SVS 20-39 CS Plus - Samson S1000 - HSU Research elec. crossover - MIT/Monsters
f>s>
Inside every small problem is a large problem struggling to get outf>c>s>-- 2nd Law of Blissful Ignorancef>s>c>
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1) Mobile Homeless: First this guy shows up and starts on everybody with this tube crap. Cheap tube amps, expensive tube amps, tube amps that don't work, tube amps that should work, and of course -- tube rectalfiers. We all buy tube amps, and then he vanishes. Gone. Invisible. Leaving us alone with these damn devices. Over the last two months I have spent $1400 on NOS, and have enough tubes for 3 complete retube jobs for my amp and preamp. I am broke, and I am completely happy. Thanks Mobile and welcome back (about damn time too)! BTW - I am NEVER, EVER, buying another turntable. However, could you recommend an affordable one?
2) Mdeneen: This guy shows up like Batman. Not your casual poster. Not until half the board is in panic mode does he show up to sort out the messes we've gotten ourselves into. I bought a special dictionary so I can understand some of his posts. I finally learned that Mdeneen stands for Mostly Diodes Ending Near Each Electrical Node. Every couple of days I take my AE-25 out of 'standby' and have to listen to that damn POP. Every couple of days I think to myself, "I should just send this thing to Mdeneen." I for one would like to hear more from you. Thanks Mdeneen.
3)MaxG: What the hell is up with this guy. Posts fabulous reviews of SACD. I think to myself. Well, Max is credible, it must really be good. So I spend a month reading everything I can about SACD. I even go to the dreaded Asylum risking the abuse of Inmates to ask questions. I finally decide to bite the bullet. I sell my $1700 Anthem CD-1 and go buy a freaking Sony DVS9000ES (yes, a Sony of all things), and come back here to find out Max has sold his SACD player and is now using a dinky record player!! I would like to say "see #1" -- but I can't. No, this pollution is the work of the evil entity -- SKALOUMBAKAS. However, I love the 9000ES. What a great machine. Thanks Max! (BTW - you shouldn't have sold your deck. Most SACD releases are reissues and sound mediocre at best. The new releases sound fabulous.)
HDBRbuilder: FNG with an attitude. This guy is destined to win the Klipsch Story Teller Contest. His stories are great. I spend a lot of time trying to come up with an angle for my story. I'm hoping I can pull a monkey out of my butt. Since I have no real Klipsch stories -- I may have to make one up. I have a problem though. My imagination can't conjure up anything better than "Engineer Jim and the Famous Fencepost Incident." Welcome to the forum HDBR!
Forresthump&TheEar(s): Forresthump only shows up when TheEar(s) shows up. I have been watching carefully, and I'm convinced they are in fact the same person.
Colin: He has been watching tubes glowing for so long he has transformed into a Getter, extinguishing all gases, and a creating vacuum wherever he goes. He has become a recluse, and doesn't post as often as he used to. His insight is uncanny, and he always seems to use verbiage which perfectly describes any given situation. We need more of Colin!
Boa12: Boa does not understand two-channel. He just can't figure out how it can even work. In order for a piece of audio to be deemed worthy -- it must have more integrated circuits, switches, and programming options than the space shuttle. Boa explains things to newbies the way engineers explain complex concepts to children. If I ever buy a HT receiver, I will also have to buy Boa a plane ticket to come out and set it up for me. Any piece of gear with more than two switches or buttons is beyond my ability to operate. This largely explains why I am still into two-channel. I enjoy telling people the reason I like two-channel is because it sounds better. There. I have told the truth. Thanks for taking care of the HT board Boa!
Newbies: The board is suddenly populated with all these new people. Where in the hell did they come from? Most of them are quite knowledgeable. Should we expect anything less from new additions to the Klipsch family.
I could go on forever.
I was just feeling grateful for this forum and thought I would post a 'thank you' to all the forum members -- especially to those who have helped make my system the best I have ever had.
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Deanf>s>
Cary AE-25f>s>SuperAmpf>s> - Sonic Frontiers Line 1 - Sony DVP-S9000ES - Klipsch RF7's
SVS 20-39 CS Plus - Samson S1000 - HSU Research elec. crossover - MIT/Monsters
f>s>
Inside every small problem is a large problem struggling to get outf>c>s>-- 2nd Law of Blissful Ignorancef>s>c>
This message has been edited by deang on 05-30-2002 at 09:58 PM
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Even YOU, the "Mr. RF-7" of this thread, admit that if/when you "can afford" it, you desire a Heritage HT set-up....I rest my case on that!!!
That's me. Mr. RF7. And when my 4 kids move out, I will certainly be buying some monster horns for HT in my livingroom. Then I will be an 'old hornie' too!
But I will still always play a lot of music on my Klipschcones.
"Bye the way...for what you have spent for those RF-7's, you could already be well on your way to a Heritage home theater through purchases on eBay...doncha think?
But then I wouldn't have RF7's
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Deanf>s>
Cary AE-25f>s>SuperAmpf>s> - Sonic Frontiers Line 1 - Sony DVP-S9000ES - Klipsch RF7's
SVS 20-39 CS Plus - Samson S1000 - HSU Research elec. crossover - MIT/Monsters
f>s>
Inside every small problem is a large problem struggling to get outf>c>s>-- 2nd Law of Blissful Ignorancef>s>c>
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Yes, I'm sure if those K-horns had been hooked up to a real amplifier they would have sounded much better. I was only trying to say that most other speakers are typically more forgiving in what you drive them with -- and so from that standpoint are easier to sell. I mean, most here will agree that to hear Heritage at its best, you need tubes -- and most people just aren't inclined to go that way.
You made very good points however, but keep in mind I was only speculating. My point was really that I didn't believe they built an RF7 to compete head on with a Klipschorn. I understand the limitations of the RF7 -- as well as it's strengths.
My original point, and still is -- is that no one should be buying a set speakers without first hearing them. I realize because my post was written in the form of a response to your comments, it may have seemed like I was discounting the Cornwall as a valid choice. However, if you go back and read my first two paragraphs without reading into them -- I was just trying to say: "If you buy them without hearing them first, and then don't like them...".
In spite of my bias -- I would certainly enjoy having a set of Cornwalls or Klipschorns sitting in my living room. I would even rent a forklift
BTW - I have enjoyed reading your contributions to the forum and look forward to swinging swords with you again in the future!
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Deanf>s>
Cary AE-25f>s>SuperAmpf>s> - Sonic Frontiers Line 1 - Sony DVP-S9000ES - Klipsch RF7's
SVS 20-39 CS Plus - Samson S1000 - HSU Research elec. crossover - MIT/Monsters
f>s>
Inside every small problem is a large problem struggling to get outf>c>s>-- 2nd Law of Blissful Ignorancef>s>c>
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I'll be doing it all over again later tonight.
I need to do it without the sub and each speaker separately. I'll then balance the speakers, and then measure them together again.
After that, I will add in the sub and adjust it for music.
I'll do it at 75db and see what happens.
thanks Mike
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Deanf>s>
Cary AE-25f>s>SuperAmpf>s> - Sonic Frontiers Line 1 - Sony DVP-S9000ES - Klipsch RF7's
SVS 20-39 CS Plus - Samson S1000 - HSU Research elec. crossover - MIT/Monsters
f>s>
Inside every small problem is a large problem struggling to get outf>c>s>-- 2nd Law of Blissful Ignorancef>s>c>
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Builder
Yeah, right, I am sure PWK established his design parameters for the Jubilee based on your postings!!..LOL!
uhh...I was making a joke. I can't believe you thought I was being serious.
...thus allowing for a wide range horn tweeter and eliminating the need for a midrange horn/driver assembly.
always a good idea
...BUT...are these frequencies being reproduced with a full, rounded at peak and trough soundwave????...OR...is that soundwave distorted by clipping at its peaks and troughs?
Clipping from the amp, or 'clipping' because the transducer is incapable of reproducing the full waveform? I think I know what you are saying. You are telling me that a fully loaded horn system has less compression. I accept that. OTOH, I also believe you can go the middle ground and reduce compression without losing warmth and texture -- which are also attibutes of live music.
Absolutey. The dynamics of a fully loaded horn system are much closer the live music than what the RF7's do. But at what cost? Dynamics is not the end all of music reproduction.
I heard K-horns extensively in the middle 70's. They sat in that shop for over a year before someone bought them. Sure, they could make the material on the bottom of my pants flap -- but I was also yelling for ear plugs. They sure didn't sound very good on that Crown amp. Put that same Crown amp on a set of Dahlquist DQ10's, and in spite of the lack of dynamics as compared to the K-horn -- was a much more musically satisfying experience.
.....In other words....whether it sounds good to you or not.....IS IT ACCURATE REPRODUCTION OF SOUND?...Think about it...and try and think just how large a radiator has to be in order to take that low-end wave in its response curve and make it a FULL, UNDISTORTED WAVE!!!
Tough to battle with you on this point. Really, I know what you are saying here. I pretty much have to concede this point. However, we are for the most part talking Cornwalls here, not K-horns. The Cornwall does not have loaded bass, so as far as I'm concerned -- it's in the same boat with the RF7 in principle.
I can only say that a set of RF7's and single SVS sub in my listening room, reproduces 20Hz at 110db and shakes the entire house. That wave is being propagated. Probably not as clean sounding as a K-horn does at 30Hz -- buy hey, you gotta hear it to believe it. I can't help but think a pair of RF7's and a pair of SVS Ultra's (which would run a little more than 1/2 the price of some K-horns) -- would have no problem in creating an immediate bowel movement.
Isn't that what sound reproduction is all about?...ACCURATE REPRODUCTION? Or is it better to just try and fool our ears into believing that INACCURATE reproduction is actually "close enough" just because we want something slimmer and taller in our living rooms? Think about it!! Nuff Said!
No, that's not what it is all about. It's about creating a musical satisfying experience. Besides, horns only do some things 'accurately'. There are some things related to music that horns don't always do very well. Take controlled directivity for example. Great for projecting what is on the recording -- but not so great in the sense that live sound tends to bounce around quite a bit. There is a speaker that does that pretty good, but I ain't gonna say it.
...ok....show me something you have informed this soul about besides the bias you are spouting in favor of the RF-7!!!
O.K.
Regardless of what is considered to be the most speaker for the money -- what it really comes down to is what sounds the best To YOU. I have heard many speakers, many expensive speakers -- and many of them I did not like. I have heard $1000 monitors that I preferred over $5000 floor standers. The emphasis should always be placed on what sound a person prefers. Period.
At any rate, of course the Cornwalls are not out-of-date, any more than any other speaker design is "out-of-date". I still like the sound of AR11's, Old Advents, and the DQ-10s. As different as each of these speakers are from each other -- they each do different things equally well.
"Quality", such a subjective thing. I have better advice. Listen and compare before you buy, or you could be crying in your beer.
Good enough?
...AND...what the hell difference does it make to point out sonic differences to ANYBODY, if "what it really comes down to is what sounds best to you!"
True.
By the way...I kinda wonder what happens when they build a Reference series prototype and test it??...do they say something like: "How does it stack up against a k-horn?".....or maybe now that they are building k-horns again, they say: "How does that k-horn stack up against an RF-7?"
No. I think they said. "We aren't selling enough Legends, and we aren't selling enough Heritage. We need something that people will buy. Something that sounds better than what everyone else is selling, but also something people can afford. We need to up the ante. We need cutting edge in a package we can sell. We don't want to sacrifice our namesake, but at the same time we have to edge our way into a market accustomed to a sense of politeness in reproduced music. We need something in-between. Dynamic, yet warm. A sense of immediacy yet without a sense of aggressiveness. Large - but not too large. We need something totally different. We need to survive."
It's like Mdeneen said. It's apples and oranges. They can be compared -- but it will ultimately come down to preference. It's totally subjective. Always will be.
You like apples and I like oranges.
If I have $6500, and had to choose between a set of K-horns, and a complete Reference HT setup with two SVS Ultras and dedicated amp -- well...
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Deanf>s>
Cary AE-25f>s>SuperAmpf>s> - Sonic Frontiers Line 1 - Sony DVP-S9000ES - Klipsch RF7's
SVS 20-39 CS Plus - Samson S1000 - HSU Research elec. crossover - MIT/Monsters
f>s>
Inside every small problem is a large problem struggling to get outf>c>s>-- 2nd Law of Blissful Ignorancef>s>c>
narrower frequency response
Memory Lane, hifilit.com
in General Klipsch Info
Posted
this is certainly interesting
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Deanf>s>
Cary AE-25f>s>SuperAmpf>s> - Sonic Frontiers Line 1 - Sony DVP-S9000ES - Klipsch RF7's
SVS 20-39 CS Plus - Samson S1000 - HSU Research elec. crossover - MIT/Monsters
f>s>
Inside every small problem is a large problem struggling to get outf>c>s>-- 2nd Law of Blissful Ignorancef>s>c>