Raider

I've had my Klipsch RF-7/B&K based setup for the past 4 years (see my system profile (click "system profile" tab on that page) for my complete setup specs), and I still cannot stop smiling everytime I hear that thing. I still have friends coming over prefering to watch movies at my place instead of going to the movie theater (which is literally less than a mile from my house, and they are planning on building another one at the mall across the street from here - hopefully it'll have Klipsch speakers in it!). Yes, I honostly think the Klipsch speakers are that good! Yes, you could get better speakers, but at how much? First and foremost - the reason by I got Klipsch is because I really did like the sound of them. I've auditioned some pretty nice speakers, including Martin-Logans, Paradigms, Polk, Focal, Mirage, and a few others, and I found I still much prefered Klipsch. It may be part due to the type of music that I primarily listen to (power/progressive metal), and it seems these RF-7s where made for it! Agressive enough to really get into the metal, but refined enough to render the orchestral parts beautifully. For movies, I've had a few really good "Holy $#!+" moments with these! Just queue up Master and Commander and play that opening battle/cannon barrage scene for a really good example. Also, I think Klipsch is an excellent, and probably one of the best, performance to value ratios out there. Like I mentioned above, you could get better speakers than Klipsch, but for how much more? Klipsch is hard to beat for the price/performance ratio. And you can certainly do worst, much worst, such as that certain B-word manufacturer that I often recommend people to Buy Other Sound Equipment. As to what to actually get, folks on here will certainly say to go for the Heritage, even if they have to obtained on the second-hand market. If you have the budget, patience, and room to do so, I'd have to agree with them. However, if you are dead set on getting brand-new (and yes the second hand market can be a real pain, especially if trying to find enough speakers to fill out a full surround-sound setup), then the Reference is certainly no slouch. I've heard some of these Heritage setups, and they are very good, but, I am certainly not complaining about my own Reference setup, and it certainly seems to be able to hang with the best of them! I've heard the new RF-83's just this past June, and I am very impressed with them. Granted, I am not going to run and trade my RF-7s in for them, but if I had to do do it over all again, I'd get those RF-83s in a New York minute! Regardless of what you end up getting, Heritage or Reference, you certainly will not go wrong in my opinion, unless you find you just don't like the sound of the Klipsch in general (and lets be honost, not everybody does, but then again, that is why there is a Paradigm, B&W, Martin-Logan, Polk, Mirage, and so forth). But, hey, if you do buy Mirage, and/or Jamo, you'd still be buying a "Klipsch" brand, though! [H] Thanks for the detailed and informative feedback.

I will be using a Yamaha RX-V657. How well sonically does Yamaha generally do with Klipsch?

I have audtioned them at two dealers so far. I have an appointment in the morning with a third. Another appointment with a company with competitor's speakers next week. Both the showings before allowed me to audition in stereo. I am hoping the dealer tomorrow is set up for surround. I haven't seen any of the older line around so far, except for one pair of the bookshelf 8" ( sorry don't know the model number.) I am also trying to decide whether for my application it makes more sense to optimize the mains (RF83 or RF63) for critical listening with less than optimal tibre match for the surrounds (RS52). Or whether tibre matches all around are better (RF62/RC62/RS62) I live in Franklin, TN near Nashville.

We stopped going out to movies and concerts because they couldn't compare to what I experience in my Home Theater listed below. [H] That's my best argument.[] Thats what I figured. Plus we can eat dinner, be together as family (or not), stop for intermission anytime. also I find people incredibly inconsiderate and rude these days at theatres. Cell phones, talking, late arrival, etc.

Budget about $2-3000 Room is 17.5 by 16'. 8 foot ceiling at side wall. Ridged peake at 10'. (Bonus Room above garage) Refernce line will be pushing it as far as space. Of course SAF is at play; reference is about as much as I can get by with and retain general use of the room. Actually considered in walls, but haveen't heard anythng that sounds as good as standalone speakers yet.

I am trying to assemble an HT room to be used for the next few years by my family. We have gradually stopped going to the movies for a variety of reasons, and I woould like a room for cinema. The room will include sound treatment, and the resource here in Architecture is very valuable. I am also an audiophile, so the room will be used also for critical music listening. This represents the most substantial investment I have ever made, and I'm trying to make the best decsion possible. I have researched DIY for several years off and on, and am attracted by the possibility of very good drivers for the money, and there are many good proven designs. However, with the influx of asian parts, and the decilne of the dollar against the euro, the quality to $ ratio of DIY has diminished somewhat, so I am also considering commercial offerings. Which has brought me to Klipsch. I have always aspired to Klipsch since college in the 70's, having heard the horns and heard PWK speak at an AES meeting. But having been away from the product for many years, during which Klipsch has gone more mass market, I am not as sure of the product as I was. The Heritage line is still out of reach for me financially, and practically given my room, so my search has brought me to the Reference line. The nagging question for me is this: Will I get as much quality for my money, and absolute sound quality as I would if I pursued DIY desihns using premium driver offerings, often found in some of the best/most expensivespeakers. Are the Klipsch really that good. Are they a speaker you will enjoy more and more, or only till the new wears off. Put more simple, why did you buy Klipsch? Are they really competitive in both sonic quality and value, or more marketing sizzle. Real deal or not? Have you had long term happiness or not? What products do you feel Klipsch is competitive with; what do you consider their peer products (Reference line) Thanks for an input, objective or subjective.

Parts of this white paper on line arrays by Jim Griffin would suggest that it can be perceived in both vertical and horizontal orientations.... http://www.audiodiycentral.com/awpapers.shtml

Wow. I forgot that I had a Klipsch belt buckle in college, until I saw the picture.

I have seen tapered array crossovers referenced in some of the Reference line literature. Crossovers in this configuration minimize lobing at frequencies shorter than the spacing between multiple drivers, and allow a better defined midrange while maintaining the advantage of the cumulative bass response of multiple lighter-coned drivers . Such a configuration is apparently used in the RC64. Do the RF83, RF63, RF82, RF62, RF52 also use this configuration? I surmise from the limited language in the literature that this is probably the case. I find it interesting that the sales info pretty much glosses over this aspect of the design, or at least fails to develop enough detail to make the significance of this design technology evident. For instance, multiple drivers with lighter cones operating in unison allow the bass drivers to better match the exceptional efficiency of the horns, while simultaneously allowing exceptional transient response over that of a single, heavier cone. By using this crossover design, the mid range interference between drivers that would result normally is eliminated or mitigated. Drivers in this configuration also limit vertical dispersion, which allows the dispersion pattern to better match that of the horns. This results in a dispersion pattern that is inherently applicable to many room environments and HT applications. So i think the work that Klipsch engineers have done to optimize the overall design and emphasize the inherent strengths of their heritage go unfortunately unnoticed at worst, or minimized at best. It's really remarkably ingenous work.

Has anyone purchased or auditioned these subs? ow do they compare to similar priced offerings from Velodyne or SVS.

I am working on an HT room. The room is is 17.5 feet by 16 feet. One side of the 16' dimension is adjacent to an open stairwell which effectively means it is 19 feet to the wall for the most part. The ceiling is a-shaped with the ridge of the ceiling running along the 17' axis. The peak is 10' high , the ceiling is 8' high at the side walls. I can orient the room either with the line of sight parallel to the peak of the ceiling facing the 10' peaked wall, or perpendicular to the peak facing an eight foot wall. To the rear of the eight foot wall is a walk in attic, whic would afford a lot of flexibility for running wiring, placing inwall subwoofer enclosures, building in racks, etc. Which orientation would likely be the best acoustically? I am planning to place acoustic treatment as necessary. Dimensionally wich orientation would be best? What are the most likely trouble spots? Thanks

After auditioning several speakers from the Klipsch line last week I came away liking the RF62 for its balanced spectral presentation and accuracy. I liked the RF83 for its more holographic imaging and staging, and dynamic presence. I have compared the two in the literature from Klipsch I have some questions regarding the difference between the two. First is there any substantial difference in the construction of the enclosures? I know that the 83's are wood venner vs the 62's vinyl. Any diffence in the bracing, acoustic damping, etc? Second I know the 83's have a larger tweeter driver than the 62's; what is the difference between the bass drivers of the two (other than obviously the size). As far as the crossover, is the RF83 crossover a tapered array configuration? Is the RF62's taper array as well? In summary, what makes the RF83/63 command such a premium over the rest of the line?

I have recently auditioned the Klipsch reference line, and my favorites are the RF83, RF62, RB81 and RB61. My concern is that while the RF83 is clearly my favorite, it represents nearly 3 times the cost of the RF62, and I found the voicing between the two speakers quite different. Unfortunately the music and modes selected did not allow to form any opinion of the surround speakers. My choices seem to be one of these two alternatives: either an RF83 based system which for budgetary reasons would dictate more affordable surrounds. A second alternative would be an RF62 based system with surrounds using the same 6" drivers. The timbre matching of the second system would be very close. But since the RF83 uses different drivers, the tibre matching would be more difficult with surrounds. Given the speakers listed, what combination would you recommend. Woulda been a no brainer if had had stopped with the RF62 and not gone into the other room to hear the RF83 Thanks for any suggestions

Just how good are the Klipsch surrounds? I have read that THX specs call for a wide dispersion side and rear speakers such as the dipole RS Klipsches. However, I have also read that more music CD's and DVD's are being mixed to utilize a full range speaker in the rear channels. Since the surrounds would likely be on stands in my application, the footprint is the same as that of a floorstanding speaker, whose bass response I'm sure would be better. I just thought I would get some feedback to see what choices you have made in your system and why. What do you find to be optimal layout of front, sides and rear? Thanks

Given an up-to $1k budget, what would you get? Klipsch? Which model(s)? Some other alternative? I find Klipsch's sub line to be rather confusing. The strategy seems to be to offer a sub at a number of price points. If there is some clear delineation between the models technically, it escapes me from reading the site. My priority is musicality first, output second. The other priority is solid output in the 20-40 z range, as the bass is very good in the Klipsch speaker line, enough so that the lowest octave is the primary concern. Thanks for any input.

Hmmm...interesting discussion on their website. I don't disagree with anything they said, but they did seem a bit narrow minded talking about the same 3 distortions over and over. I would very much be interested in what they think is their biggest limitation/tradeoff. Though it definetly sounded like it was written by an engineer that absolutely believed in what he was talking about. Does their system only work with their driver, or does it have the flexibility to work with other drivers too? The main tradeoff is sheer output, as far as I can tell. Additional cost too. The concept Thecan be used with any dual coil sub; however the designer says that you give up about 3db efficiency. His driver is built by TC Sounds, and uses a much smaller guage wire for the feedback coil winding, which helps reduce voice coil weight. For accuracy this seems a good alternative for music; for HT apps maybe less so were sheer output is needed for effects. But if you have free attic space for building large enclosures then I would definitely recommend going that route. All the fancy tricks aside, the bigger the box the better it will perform.Something like a few Dayton IB15's powered with a Crown XTi (built in DSP) sounds like an awesome setup. Put a 16x16 manifold just above each corner with the drivers firing at each other on opposite sides (so that the mechanical vibrations cancel themselves out). 10 cubic feet per driver. You can expect a peak around 130dB with good extension down to 10Hz. By the backwave firing into the attic, which by venting is open to the neighborhood, would this not potentially lead to problems? Or does te loose insulation serve as enough of a bass trap?

Thanks for the tip. I'll check this out. Any concise place for info on this product ( I take it it is no longer in production).

Wow Sunburn. That has to be a great sounding system. That's some TV stand! Not too far off of oldbuckters recommendation. I'm glad there are those like you who have the room and re$ource$ to take this route.

I am limited to the Reference line for these reasons. The Synergy line does not meet my preferences for refinement in sound quality. My room is not quite large enough for the Heritage line, and they are out of reach for my budget in an HT application. As far as cost no object, I meant within the Reference line; I'm trying to nail down if there standouts within the line independent of price. Thanks.

I'm familiar with studio monitors; I'm looking for a speaker that offers both the accuracy of a monitor and is also good to listen to for general purposes. I'm looking at Klipsc RB61 or RB81 for this purpose, compared to other monitors out there. Low level sensitivity for late night use is also a concern. The Scan Speak tweeter I'm looking at is the new AirCirc at about $225. A set of Scan Monitors would price out at about the same point as a pair of RF63's. Thanks for the heads up on the B&W efficiency. Glad to see you are a loyal fan, people aren't enthusiasts without good reason. Klipsch was indeed difficult to quantify. Thanks for the input!

First, some context... I am considering Klipsch for two applications. First I am doing an HT room in my bonus room. I will be using a 50-60" DLP and I want a sound system that will leave as little compromise as possible. The room will receive acoustic treatment as necessary. I will be building my own subs, most likely Rhythmik servos or possibly TC or Dayton based designs. I could consider Klipsch subs, but haven't yet found as much performance for the dollar ($500-600) as the DIY route can buy. The second application is a set of monitors for my office/studio, which will be an extension of my Mac G5's capabilities. I want uncompromising reference quality for this application. I have considered studio monitors from JBL, Mackie, Dynaudio, and Blue Sky for this application, and will use a sub. The HT application will also be used for music. I am also considering alternatives from DIY designs using world class drivers from Scan Speak, Seas, Morel, and Fountek. Also considered are commercial designs from Monitor Audio, ERA, Aerial Acoustics, and B&W. I am in the proces of locating and auditioning various choices, including the Klipsch Reference line. So I have some tough choices ahead, since this expenditure is the highest of any audio investment I have made. I have a respect for Klipsch that dates back to the 70's when I worked in studios as an intern and got to hear Paul Klipsch speakat the opening of a studio featuring his Klipschorns. You had to respect the end result, and PWK's no-BS attitude. However, frankly, I stopped following Klipsch for a while having been disillusioned by the earliest mass-market offerings, which I felt were not consistent with the earlier spirit of the company. The return of my interest in Klipsch began with the audition of an RF63 against a B&W tower. I have spent several hours researching Klipsch here and on the 'net. The Heritage line is not compatible with my HT room in size or cost. The Synergy line, while very competitive at its price class, is not as refined as I would prefer. So my questions are confined to the Reference line. While I know by definition I would expect a certain bias here, I have found from reading past posts that there still is a fairly high level of honesty and objectivity here. So my questions: How does the Klipsch Reference line compare to the alternatives listed, in your experience? How happy are Reference owners post purchase? How is brand loyalty as a function of owner satisfaction? Has Klipsch compromised Paul's original vision, philosophy, and work ethic since his passing? Or is the current corporation a logical extension of the way Paul would have continued to develop product, in the context of new technology and manufacturing opportunities? How is the build quality and reliabilty of the Reference line as compared to peer product? Some posts in this regard have given me pause, though they seem to have diminised somewhat in recent past. Is the build quality of the Hope based products (apparently the RF83, RF63, and RC64 at this point, I think) as good as those produced in China, better, or worse? Are any of the current line unequivocably considered best of the bunch? Which speakers in the line if any represent an outstanding value, regardless of price? For each of my applications: Cost no object what would you recommend? Highest value for the dollar, what would be your choice? Unless my auditions yield a speaker that is clearly superior, I am inclined to go with Klipsch by virtue of what the efficiency gets you. It's hard to forget Paul's compelling demonstration years ago on the value of system headroom. Any objective, and positive, input of feedback into my decsion process is appreciated. While some of my questions may be controversial, I know that Paul certainly had no fear of an objective presentation of his product in a competitive environment. Thanks in advance. A fellow music lover.

Is "new Heritage" an oxymoron? One thing I have found out the hard way. I have seldom regretted stepping up to what I really wanted, but I have often regretted settling for an 80% solution. Now if I can just figure out what I want! It used to be easy. When I was in college I couldn't afford any of them.