ka7niq
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Posts posted by ka7niq
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15 minutes ago, the real Duke Spinner said:
You are not alone there
may be some mid range detail missing
Butt how would you know ?? 😀
I own several pairs of speakers Duke, including Eminent Technology LFT VIII, Apogee Duetta Signatures, Magnepan 1.6, Altec Malibu 's, and some huge Kindel Audio PLS 1 Speakers, some Tannoy's and my current darlings, these monster horns. I will post some pics of them. The big Kindel PLS 1 are not especially revealing, except for their imaging, that can be Holographic. However, most of my other speakers are quite revealing, allowing me to hear differences in equipment. The big Horns I have hooked up currently are the first ones from left, next are the white vintage pair of Altec Malibu's, Next are the Black Kindel PLS Line Sources, and finally my Eminent Technology LFT VIII on the right. The Apogee Duetta Signatures are the very last picture.
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On 5/23/2022 at 11:53 AM, EpicKlipschFan said:
in the case of one pair of the many chorusii i have owned, it wasnt the change to poly caps that made the difference, the speakers sounded like a towel was covering them, no crisp mid or highs & muddy bass. the other 2 pairs i owned at the same time with stock caps sounded great. so something caused the mylar caps in that set to fail, i didnt measure them nor was i capable of measuring ESR, im sure just replacing with the same stock mylar caps would have had the same results. the original mylar caps were bad either from age or use/abuse from the previous owner but he said he never listened overly loud & he was an older guy that listened to classical or softer type music so i dont think their history caused it.
i trust what mr crites has said about caps & many other things in general about audio, like caps dont "break in" nor do tweeters & smaller drivers etc. to claim mylar caps dont ever go bad is false based on my experience & many others who have reported improvements in sound when replacing 25-30 year old caps in these era of speakers, even when using the same type of mylar caps, so that shows that mylar caps can & do fall out of spec. the difference in sound or quality of poly vs mylar caps is a touchy subject around here, some claim mylar are the best caps ever made & you absolutely must use "authorized" caps or else your speakers arent klipsch anymore & that poly caps are cheap snake oil... LOL.
I do have the ability to measure ESR, either in or out of circuit, and Bob Crites is correct. Mylar Caps can develop higher then when they were stock ESR values. But I have yet to measure any Mylar Cap that did not have it's value, as far as capacitance goes. In fact, the people who rebuild old radios seldom if ever replace any Mylar Caps, But ESR is seldom a problem for them as long as the cap has kept the other value. I am re doing the crossover in these horns, and they have 30 year old Mylar caps in them. I measure them, and they have kept their values, but ESR is higher then I would like. They take a 17UF Cap, kind of an odd value. So I found some AC Fan Poly Caps for them! These are sort of like the motor run caps, but smaller and are 450 VAC at 5% Tolerance!
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I have had literally every kind and type of high end 2 channel preamps in my 45 year audiophile career. Now, I use a receiver with pre amp outputs!
I have actually A/B this receiver with several high end 2 ch preamps with XLR's. I fail to hear ANY differences between RCA Cables and XLR.
I hear absolutely little if any difference between this receiver, and high end solid state preamps. Yes, there is a difference between the solid state receiver and my Tube Preamp, but that is because Tubes in general have a different sound than solid state!
I also have some stand alone DAC's, and also fail to hear any difference with the Burr Brown Dac's in this receiver.
The preamp outs on this receiver will easily drive ANY of my 11 different amplifiers, so much so that I had to actually go into the level settings of my little Ayima Class D Amp, and turn the level down because this receiver was actually overdriving it!
There is a reason WHY this receiver, is my favorite, want to know what it is ?
And, I am sure many of you will want to know WHAT receiver it is too ?
I will give you a clue! Most of this company's receiver has this feature, and never again will I be w/o it!
In fact, I would not even CONSIDER buying a receiver, or any component w/o it!
LOL, and no, it sure as hell is not Audyssey
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1 hour ago, EpicKlipschFan said:
mylar caps can degrade with age/use too. i have replaced original caps in chorus2 & forte 2 as well as other brands of speakers with budget poly caps that made a very noticeable improvement.
electrolytic caps in most 2 & 3 way klipsch speakers are in the woofer circuit, they dont keep low freq out of the midrange as far as im aware but i could be wrong. the mylar caps filter the LF from the midrange & tweeter.
A Poly Capacitor is the very lowest loss capacitor. Inherently, they have lower ESR than a Mylar, so I think that is what you heard. Usually, Mylar Capacitors keep their VALUE forever. But, according to Bob Crites, they can develop high ESR as they get old.
Those electrolytic capacitors are on the woofer roll off circuit, and if they lose value, the woofer will not roll off as soon. In a 2 way speaker like the Academy Center Channel, those dual 8 inch woofers are crossed over at 2.2 k. This means they are the midranges!
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2 hours ago, Frzninvt said:
Here is the schematic for the Academy crossover network. You also have to take into consideration that many, many movie soundtracks are just mixed horribly there are some that I struggle to hear the dialogue on and I have a La Scala center with the best components and network. Updating the network components will make a difference if you use high quality parts not the mediocre crap from JEM or Crites. Here is a comparison between Popbumpers K-Stack and the stock network for comparison. Guess which one sounds better.
Thanks for the picture of the Academy stock network! Because of the 2 old electrolytic caps, it needs a cap replacement. As these old electrolytic capacitors age, they change value by losing capacitance. This causes the woofers to play too far up in the midrange, causing that muddy sound.
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9 minutes ago, tigerwoodKhorns said:
Four year old thread. I had an academy and when I sen tot buy it the owner and I were both really impressed at how clear the sound was when we switched to the Academy.
Maybe the OP was driving it really hard.
My Academy is left over from my Forte/Cornwall days.; I have not played it in nearly 12 years!
It will do center channel duties for my newest pair of speakers. The KLF C7 is 3db more efficient than the 96db Academy, and has a larger horn. I will use the Academy right now, but will keep an eye out for a KLF C7 to keep up with these monsters
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2 minutes ago, Crankysoldermeister said:
From 2005, lol.
LOL, every old thread is new again. When I reply to a post, I am not necessarily replying to the poster, but adding to the knowledge base
The Klipsch Academy Center Speaker was only made from 1992 to 1994 https://www.klipsch.com/products/academy-center-speaker
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Does anyone have an Academy Center Channel Schematic, or better yet a picture of the crossover ?
I wonder IF they used electrolytic capacitors in it, or Mylar ?
Old electrolytic capacitors would explain the muddy sound someone on this thread remarked about.
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Just now, billybob said:
Well, sounds to me you are going to put the Academy through it's paces then.
Wring out the last fwiw.
Good idea imo.
Thanks!
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5 minutes ago, billybob said:
Dang, I guess so, lol !
Appreciate the work you have done. Thinking you called it a refresh for a reason. Agree with that term.
Always figured there must have been a good reason for the Academy being created.
Let know how the center works out for your what, HT?
Thanks!
Thanks! Yes, the center channel will be for HT, and a have a digital parametric equalizer in case it is not a close match to the left and right speakers.
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On 1/3/2005 at 2:53 AM, Crankysoldermeister said:
It'll be interesting to see if any benefit is derived from replacing the electrolytic(s) in the LF section of these networks with an inexpensive Solen or Dayton. I've convinced myself that it's a waste of time and money. Has anyone done it yet, because I sure haven't.
I'm getting ready to do an Academy. Not much to it really. If you leave the electrolytics in place (and I will), there should be plenty of real estate. I might replace them with some axial types and bypass them -- and see what the customer says.
If there are electrolytics in there, they should be replaced. Think about it ? If a speaker was made in 1990 the caps are 32 years old! 32 years in no problem for a Mylar Film Cap, but not so with an electrolytic Cap! They lose value, and as a result no longer have enough capacitance to keep the LF out of the midrange!
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On 4/27/2022 at 10:10 PM, billybob said:
Think alot of Academy speakers out there could stand having a cap refresh.
LOL, a whole LOT of older speakers, could stand a capacitor refresh. I have been playing with, and refreshing speakers for many years.
This is my experience. A Bipolar Electrolytic Capacitor is always the most mellow sounding. A Mylar is in the middle sonically, and a Polyproplyne is the brightest of the 3 Capacitors. It all has to do with ESR. The Bipolar Electrolytic Caps almost always have the highest ESR, so they are the most mellow, unless you go to a Paper In Oil Capacitor. Some of them have very very high ESR values, so they are even more mellow than a Bipolar Electrolytic Cap.
I have compared very very expensive Capacitors with the same type of inexpensive Caps, and guess what ? I found no difference. None. However, I can hear a difference between different TYPE of Capacitors.
I happen to have an old Academy Center Channel Speaker that I have not used in over 12 years, since I sold my Cornwalls. I plan to use it with my newest speakers that are not quite up and running yet. It is the most efficient center channel I own at this moment, and it will need all it's efficiency to keep up with these Monsters
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I agree with mikebse2a3 about the imaging of Horns. I have corner mounted Horns, firing across the room. I do have plenty of room treatment installed as suggested for corner firing Horns. I get an image that stretches from corner to corner with decent depth, and sometimes images seeming to come from outside the room boundaries!
Placement is precise, and the entire sound field is large enough to imagine a band being right in the room with you.
I have a TON of other speakers, including Magnepan 1.6, Apogee Duetta Signatures, Tannoy Concentric Monitors, Altec Malibu, and several others as well. I always wind up going back to my corner mounted Horns, and no, they are not Klipschorns or Jubilee's.
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32 minutes ago, Schu said:
Did you ever get a chance to see Sixto Rodriguez perform?
searching for Sugarman was such a great film.
Never, but I have seen many other Detroit area music acts, including Ted Nugent, Alice Cooper, Bob Seeger, Suzy Quattro, The Romantics, Kid Rock and Eminem, and of couse most Motown Acts. Ted Nugent said he does not do Drugs, and never has, but that is total Bullshit.
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3 hours ago, Dave A said:
Oh yeah and Randy Savage and BoBo VS the Sheik, Pampero Firpo, Dick the Bruiser and many others. Injury list posted on Monday on the more serious grudge matches. State Fairgrounds too and those were the days. And yes Alice Cooper and the Stones
Randy "The Macho Man" Savage was from right here in Bradenton Florida. He is dead now, but back in my going to the Gym Days, several of us would try to mimic The Macho Man, LOL
I left the Detroit area in 1971, but remember some great times in the Metro Detroit Area!
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1 minute ago, Shiva said:
Did someone say Cobo Hall? Been there as a kid. It wasn't audio related, it was much more important. Big Time Wrestling. 😀 Saw Haystacks Calhoun, Bobo Brazil and The Sheik. Many more besides, but those were the only names that popped up in my mind this a.m.
PS audio equipment over at ASR doesn't test very well.
LOL, BoBo Brazil, born and raised in Benton Harlem, Michigan! Of course, I meant Benton Harbor. I have many fond memories of Cobo Hall, especially all the concerts.
Here is another video from this butthole saying it is "Generally Accepted" that Horn Speakers just don't sound as good as other speakers, and that is why we do not see more of them.
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34 minutes ago, Darkscience said:
PS Audio is 100% GARBAGE.
I agree! I am not at all interested in anything they sell.
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I thought I would post one of his videos, in case anyone hasn't seen them.
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On 2/2/2019 at 4:01 PM, ClaudeJ1 said:
I spent a total of 10 hours with him in his museum, his house, his lab, the plant, his Mercedes, and we had lunch and dinner at 2 different establishments, including his local Rotary Club for lunch. A fine gentleman who treated me like his long lost grandson (he was the same age as my grandma). For dinner, he drove my wife and I out of town to the Pioneer Kitchen, where the lady opened up her place just for us and our wives (4 of us in the entire place) and had some home made vittles! Yeah, it was very special for a lifetime memory. I learned a lot that day, including the fact that he found it hard to believe that his company had grown so large, which was only 20 Million/year at the time. Oh, and one more thing............at the pioneer kitchen, I made a really good portrait of him with a porch corner in the background. One of the best in my career as a photographer, if I do say so myself.
I met PWK at Cobo Hall, at a Detroit Audio Show! Him and his employees had these buttons on that said "Bullshit" on them. I think it was either 1969 or 1970, and a bunch of us Kids were bored, so we decided to take the Woodward Ave Bus downtown. We did not plan on going to the Detroit Audio Show, we just kind of wound up there at Cobo Hall. I remember PWK as a nice man that was very pleased when I told him that My Grandpa owned Klipschorns. Bob Carver was also at that show with his Phase Linear Andromeda Speakers, and Phase Linear 700 Amplifier.
I greatly dislike this Paul McGowan guy, and find I generally disagree with him on a lot of things.
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3 hours ago, garyrc said:
The curved 1/2 round cylinders may be Dr. Bonner's solution which were advocated by PWK. Artto had or has a room full of them in Artto's Klipschorn room, on the forum. He has different speakers now. He and Chris A are two of the most knowledgeable people on the forum (IMO).
I used absorption near the speakers, and diffusers farther away from both the listeners and the speakers. After a little careful EQ, the room sounds great!
To see Artto's room, try: https://community.klipsch.com/index.php?/topic/19799-arttos-klipschorn-room/Looks Great! Back in the early 80's, I lived out in Seattle. My best friend Mark was a part owned in Definitive Audio. They were Levinson dealers. Mark Levinson came to town, and we all went to eat at the Space Needle. I asked Mark Levinson what was the ultimate speaker. To my very great surprise, he said "Klipschorns"! This shocked me, and he added that you need to turn the tweeters vertical, and get them out of the cabinets, and you needed to give them some EQ with his Cello Audio Pallett Equalizer. I very much believe in Equalization, if it is done correctly.
The 2 curved diffusors I have came as part of a deal, and I have not really gotten around to using them, but I intend to, eventually.
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On 4/5/2022 at 1:38 AM, garyrc said:
Another approach is to place diffuser panels along the same areas, but note that the use of diffusers in the "Hass effect areas" will likely not achieve the same level of corner-horn imaging as the use of absorbers. More on the reasons why later.
If your listening position is more than 11 to 22 feet (3.4-6.8 meters) away, you probably have little work to do. If you are like me, and sit within 10 feet (3 meters) of your corner horns, you will find that the effect of using absorbent panels along the walls is spectacular in increasing your stereo imaging performance."
I (Gary) like to scatter a few diffusers on more distant walls, but in the path of the speakers. Plain
or fancy
I have a couple Diffusors, they are a curved 1/2 round cylinder, I guess I can try them
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This is the amp I am using, and it is absolutely amazing. It beats my 2 tube amplifiers, and 8 of my Solid State ones too, seriously!
It is dead nuts quiet, important to me since my speakers are very efficient. These things are dirt cheap too, well under 100 dollars!
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7 hours ago, garyrc said:
LOL, after I posted this, I saw that article, and have read it several times now. That article calls for sound absorbers on the sides of the corner mounted speakers, instead of the first reflection points. His comments in the article about ceiling reflections were read by me with great interest. My Ceiling where the speakers are is a low suspended ceiling, only 6.5 inches high! My Room is a converted carport, so it is lower then the rest of the house. So, they had to slope the ceiling, so it would attach to the rest of the house. My Horn sits on top of it's woofer enclosure. I jacked the back of it up a little, to point the horn more at me, and away from the ceiling. I need to jack it up more, but I could hear the difference just jacking it up a little made!
7 hours ago, garyrc said: -
I sold my Klipschorns, but I still have very large horn speakers in the corners "Klipschorn Style". Of course, the speakers fire across the room. I know with a conventional pair of speakers NOT in the room corners, we try to hang the acoustic panels at the first reflection points. But, with speakers firing from the corners, where shall I hang the panels ?
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My Favorite Receivers And Why
in 2-Channel Home Audio
Posted
Well, since you asked, it is a Yamaha Receiver, and the feature many Yamaha Receivers have is a remotely controlled Parametic Equalizer, that operates in the digital domain, so it is free of a lot of the bullshit inherent in an Analog Equalizer.
The particular Yamaha Receiver I have is an older Yamaha TSR 7810.
I remember sitting next to Mark Levinson at the Space Needle in Seattle back in 1981, we were all at Dinner.
I asked Mark Levinson what was the ultimate speaker you could walk in a dealer and buy, and he shocked the hell out of all of us when he said "Klipschorns, but only if they are equalized".
I know I will never be w/o a Parametric Equalizer again!