mikebse2a3

Thanks for sharing NieceeAR @dwilawyer Might be something interesting for the Klipsch museum and Klipsch

In an ideal world yes I agree but in the real world room modes plague most all of our systems and destroys imaging, tonal balance, mask clarity and detail and cause listener fatigue. Many problems people attribute to the loudspeaker is actually a result of poor modal response of the room below approximately 300Hz in many typical home listening rooms. Unfortunately judging from lack of attention to this problem (which PWK alerted users of his loudspeakers to many decades ago) in most listeners listening rooms many will never know just how good their loudspeakers/systems really are. Yes the reality is if one applies EQ properly using quality equipment to deal with the room modes that someone is unable or unwilling to treat acoustically it will make some listening positions dramatically better and other areas worse and the challenge is to improve as many listening positions as possible with the least compromise to the priority positions one chooses. If done correctly just dealing with one or two of the worst offending room modes can bring about an often dramatic improvement in reproduction and reduce listener fatigue resulting from them when uncontrolled. I have used the DSpeaker Anti Mode Dual Core 2.0 unit in my system but did upgrade to the higher output version due to the First Watt F-3 lower input sensitivity than most amplifiers. The unit is currently placed in the tape monitor loop of my system so that I can easily bypass as well as demonstrate the improvements this unit has brought to my system. My current system/room is still a work in progress and has some changes since this picture. miketn

No worries my friend.... life is to short to waste time dwelling on such things. Yes the basic X and Y type ac line capacitor is a start and if one wants to increase the noise suppression as well as emission back to the AC Line from todays electronic equipment more elaborate filters are available and beneficial. miketn

I'm thinking about 1/2 the volume of the 2 driver design. Maybe look at the single 15" design in the cinema line like the .. KPT-335-B/M as an example. https://www.klipsch.com/pro/cinema/behind-the-screen miketn

You could use one woofer and reduce the box size and number of ports by approximately 1/2. miketn

This thread is all over the place now so I'm going to throw some more crap in here because I went to a lot of trouble gathering it Rooms, Recordings and Loudspeakers are the 3 largest obstacles to good sound because they are so interdependent on each other and for the most part the weakest links in the Sound Production and Sound Reproduction chain that we all have to deal with. We live in "Audio's Circle of Confusion" and if you haven't read these articles (Especially Part 2 and Part 3 of the articles) by Floyd E. Toole then I encourage you to especially if you fall into the camp that recordings shouldn't be touched with a properly designed and implemented EQ for tonal compensation or that a room/systems performance can't be raised to higher performance level with proper equalization applied. Especially Part 2 and Part 3 of the article. Floyde E. Toole - LoudspeakersandRoomsPt1_0.pdf Floyde E. Toole - LoudspeakersandRoomsPt2_0.pdf Floyde E. Toole - LoudspeakersandRoomsPt3_0.pdf

Our homes can be a very electrically noisy environment in themselves with all the local electronics as well as noise coming in through the power line itself and could be part of the explanation of why some power cords could sound different on some equipment/systems because of how they might reject or suppress the electrical interference. This is often why their are benefits to using good AC power conditioners that have good electrical noise suppression design. miketn

Sorry for the loss of your mom Christy miketn

wdecho we have been very respectful to you and we are only trying to get you to understand your not looking at the complete picture and some of your assumptions like how optimized crossovers are designed are just not correct. That was a very good post rjp ...! I have no desire to continue this especially with wdecho attitude . miketn

Exactly and most importantly is the need to understand the driver has a frequency variable complex impedance and if the original crossover design and parts values chosen was done with the frequency variable complex impedance of the driver and you have now installed an L-pad presenting a constant 8 ohm load to the crossover you have possibly compromised the optimized performance that Klipsch provided. Again I want to say I have no idea how the crossover is designed in the Heresy lll but if it was designed with a fixed type L-pad attenuator on it's midrange or tweeter then altering the resistor values might be a reasonable option for tweaking to taste. My concern is recommending adding an L-pad attenuator to a network that was designed to take into account the complex impedance load of the driver which you have now altered by the L-pad's impedance. I believe I'm going to let this rest now but wdecho please know that I fully understand what an L-pad is and the compromises one has to accept when using one. miketn

Agreed I just received one to place in my headphone system and for those concerned it has a true bypass switch (ie: a relay connects the input and output directly) if i's not needed. I actually hope they expand on this design in the future with an 8 band version similar to some McIntosh designs and Cello Palette. miketn

Thanks wdecho My 2A3 amplifiers are the Cary Cad-2A3i push/pull amplifier and Cary Cad-2A3-SE single ended amplifiers all of which I have done some modifications. The Cary CAD-2A3i was modified with independent 2A3 bias controls and a choke in the pwr supply for improved performance on High Efficiency Horns and in the case of the CAD-2A3-SE I've modified the bias point of the 2A3 and pwr supply modification to enable any 2A3 tubes to be used since it was orginally used the higher output KR 2A3 tube.) Sorry to the OP for the thread drift..!!! miketn

OK after reading your response I have to wonder if you think I have a problem in general with using L-pads which I don't and if that is the case let me clarify my point by saying that L-pads as part of the original crossover design consideration is fine assuming as in the Nelson Pass article you posted or as Klipsch might design in their networks because both electrical, acoustical and listening test are performed to optimize the performance of the system. In the OP case to recommend altering a network optimized by Klipsch by adding an L-pad without any knowledge of the network's design (which I assume since I haven't seen anyone posting the design of the original network or testing of said recommended alterations using an L-pad) isn't something I would choose to do but that's just my honest opinion and of course others are free to use their own opinions and have fun I hope along the way. First you are twisting what I have said and taking it out of context as well. I will again state that if you alter the frequency dependent impedance of the network from the original design (with the understanding it's component values were optimized with that impedance in mind also) then you very likely compromised the performance of the system. To be very clear it's not about L-pads themselves but thinking you can simply throw an L-pad into an existing network without understanding how the network is designed and how it will affect the network is were my recommendation becomes be aware and cautious with this approach if your intent is to "improve" the loudspeaker system. Agreed... I have no time for a pissing contest and what I am saying obeys ohms law I assure you.. miketn

Following your logic so have Horn loaded loudspeakers.... By the way what exactly is and what qualifies one to be an "audiophile"...? miketn

Any quality crossovers are designed with the variable impedances of the driver factored in as well as phase and polar response of the drivers and their physical locations relative to each other and the loudspeaker enclosure they are housed in and thus would rarely follow any text book calculated designs otherwise why would anechoic chambers and test equipment be necessary to optimize any given design. When you replace the drivers variable impedance with an L-pad it is very likely that you will not only change the attenuation of the driver's output but also alter the output shape of the frequency spectrum of the driver's output and possibly shift the crossover point itself. Now you may like what you hear as a result but at least understand you very likely didn't just reduce the level of the drivers output. I was fortunate to observe Roy working on the design of the new Klipschorn crossover as he was working on integrating the new tweeter's output with the output of the midrange horn/driver of the system and the ability that the anechoic chamber and measurement system gave him to work at optimizing the crossover also demonstrated how easily that optimization could be lost with very slight changes to the crossover. I currently own SET 2A3 amplifiers as well as a Push/Pull 2A3 amplifier. I also use First Watt F3 amplifiers and have McIntosh and other amplifiers as well and I can assure you I have no regrets or doubts about using a quality DSP unit in my system and after experiencing what "intelligent" use of such a unit brings to my system and it's ability to compensate for the large variation in recording and less than ideal recordings we all suffer with I can't imagine not having this ability to increase the enjoyment of these recordings. As you have said to each his own path to enjoy this hobby but I have to say based on your choice of words in describing an equalizer and how it's use to "with an equalizer twisting and contorting the sound" indicates to me that you and I have a very different understanding and experience with Equalization. And before you dismiss my experiences I used the very minimalist type systems you describe for well over a decade and while I understand the qualities and appeal of such a system I also understand it's weaknesses. miketn