DrWho

our local brunswick zone has klipsch speakers...but now i got an excuse to go check out our chuckee cheese and play in the ball pen i mean check out their speakers

well 7.1 is the same as 6.1, but the sixth channel powers two amps that power 2 speakers (this helps fill the soundstage when there is a lot of space between the normal surrounds of a 5.1 system). i've never heard 6.1 or 7.1 so can't provide helpful insight there. just keep in mind that sometimes less is more...at higher volumes, more speakers = more noise. but at lower volumes, more speakers helps balance things out. it all depends on your room and how loud you listen. there's compromises to everything first, think of how the sound could be improved...where do things sound empty, muffled, wierd, distorted, mushy, etc etc...and then decide on how to "solve" those problems. if you feel the rear sounds empty, then perhaps a rear center might help fill things in (6.1)...if it's still not enough, then maybe 7.1 is needed i don't think it'd hurt to go with 7.1 (if you end up getting a new reciever), and then you can see for yourself what adding more speakers does...you just recently purchased the R3 series, do you still have your old speakers? they'd be a cheap way to run tests for yourself (you might even be able to test a fake 7.1 or 6.1, if you wanted to see how it sounds with more speakers) sorry i couldn't provide any personal experience...but there's lots of other people on this forum that have 7.1 and love it...im sure you'll be hearing from them i've never heard or read that the upgrade wasn't worth it.

sounds like you're modding just to be modding... that said, what are you trying to improve?

a difference of 3dB is equivalent to sounding half as loud. however, the sound coming from a speaker loses 3db every meter it travels. so as long as the rear speakers are at least 1 meter closer than the mains, then the sensitivity shouldn't be a big concern. now as far as speaker placement...it does make a difference, but i don't think the magnitude of this difference will satisfy the proportions you are describing. but hey, it's worth a try. it's hard to give helpful input into this area because we don't know your room, and where your stuff currently is...like if your rears are farther away than your mains, then we might run into problems. right now, im assuming you've got everything placed "correctly" since both of your rears are quiet, it leads me to believe you have an amp issue...either some hidden setting is not set right, or mechanical failure. there is a simple way however to test the speakers take your RS-3's and plug them into the cables running to your mains...(thus making the RS-3's the "main" speakers instead of the RF-3's). play some music and see how loud they can get. (no need to worry, they should be able to handle 110 watts). if you feel they can get about as loud as the RF-3's then there shouldn't be anything wrong with the speakers themeselves...if you feel however that something is not right with them, turn the volume down and stick your ear close to each of the 3 speakers. here's a link in case you want a picture: RS-3 II and if you want to take this test a bit further, you could try connecting your RF-3's as the surround speakers and see if it's still quiet. if this is the case, then it is something to do with your amp...perhaps you could try turning the surrounds "down" and see if maybe they labeled things backwards or something. also, what do you have playing that leads you to believe the surrounds are too quiet? well that's all i got for now...

did you adjust it the right way? i've always found the level controls for amps to be rather confusing...sometimes they adjust by units of dB and sometimes by feet. perhaps u ended up cranking the front? i don't think placement will provide the magnitude of results needed.

"customer proof" hehe ya, we're running crowns they're beasts, we even dropped our amp rack outta the van once...(long story) ya, im not big into the tube thing...but i think solid state should be fine. i'm trying to think of the physics of it; no current flow means no heat, right? does stuff move around even without the circuit completed? to me that just makes no sense, but hey im willing to learn!

all i gotta say is i've been mixing for 10 years for a band that tours throughout the year...i am frequently in the practice of unplugging the speaker cables from the outputs on the amps with a loaded input. nothing has broke because it's an "infinite" load (or watever the resistance of air is), not a zero load like you're talking about. a load of "zero" would be like connecting the positive terminal directly to the negative terminal and of course the amp would go poof.

"If so, that is usually considered a No No" disconnecting an output terminal from a reciever shouldn't necesarily be a bad thing because as far as the reciever is concerned, there is an infinite Ohm resistance when that happens...and we all know that driving higher ohms than rated is just fine on any amp. if however, somehow the hot terminals were able to transmit a signal to each other, then it would become a big No No based on the experiments you have done, it is definetly the speaker that's giving you problems. btw, congrats on your denon purchase!

let's see if i can draw a pic with text... (the vertical lines are the wall from the side) will the final result look something like this? ] ] ] ] ] ]____ ] ] ] ] ] ] ] ] ] ] ]------- ] ] ] ] or will it be something more like this? ] ] ] ] ]____ ] ] ] ] ] ] ]------- ] ] ] ] on the first design, you could maintain the infinite baffel by creating a hole in the wall and speaker cabinet, like this: ] ] ] ] ] ]____ ] ] ] ] ] ] ] ]------- ] ] ] ] on the second design, you could try something like this: ] ] ] ] ] ]__ ] ] ] ] ] ] ] ]---- ] ] ] ] I hope this helps...I think your best option is to try and maintain the infinite baffel that these speakers were designed for. But if cutting into the wall and all that is not an option, I would then suggest trying to find the specs of the woofer so you could build the cabinet with good dimensions...granted, it probably won't make that huge of a difference, but it would be taking a risk by just slapping together any size box and all that...the cabinet plays a large role in the sound the speaker makes. recently, i carelessly built a sealed cabinet for speakers designed for an infinite baffel, and they sound much worse than they did without a cabinet. no need to worry though, you've got a great idea going!

so basically, the ported speaker should show less movement?

how do you plan on mounting these cabinets once they're made? you might be better off purchasing RB-5's or something like that, instead of trying to make your own cabinet.

well i know for certain that the RF3's put out a ton of bass...perhaps when you unplugged your reciever and messed with the ohm button, the reciever's settings got messed up. I would go through all the speaker settings and make sure your mains are set to large and all that good stuff. another thing you might wanna check is the binding posts on the back of your speaker. if one of those cool little wires that goes between the top and bottom has been disconnected, then that would make sense as to why you feel they have no bass. While you're at it, you might as well check the wiring everywhere and see if you can't find anything that might seem weird.

my 1990 Dodge Grand Caravan came with a very nice Infinity sound system. Doesn't the Ford Focus also come out with a good sound system? I remember seeing it at the Chicago Auto Show a while back and that was supposed to be one of it's huge strengths.

ROFL

they're dipoles

ya, there's SAE and Full Sail and many other technical schools like that. I'm more interested in a liberal arts type school that provides degrees in audio related fields such as equipment design (speakers/amps/mixing consoles) while also providing a broad education (or is broad not what I need?). This Georgia Tech thing sounds interesting though, cuz there's bound to be lots of EE involved with building stuff. At the same time though, I would like to be able to take classes in live mixing or producing recordings. I'm yet to find a school that does it all, but perhaps I'm looking for too much. Hartford offers something close to what I'm looking for... Audio Engineering Technology (BS) This program is ideal for those wishing to combine an interest in music with a technical career working with sound systems. You will take courses spanning three distinct yet complementary disciplines electronics, acoustics, and music. You will also explore the fundamentals of music theory and harmony. For those who know how to test, install, operate, and repair sound systems, the career possibilities are endless. Thanks for the tips so far though...I'd really like to get a degree in something related without having to get a degree in music (because that means I gotta perform an instrument, learn piano, and do all sorts of stuff I'd rather not do) as a sidenote, isn't justin pursuing an audio related career? perhaps you'd be willing to share your plans...or would that be bad if we ended up as competitors?

I'm currently pursuing a degree in something along the lines of audio engineering and was wondering if anyone in this community had any tips or experiences in regards to a good school.

LOL! as for the gel...it wouldn't have much use unless you are constantly reconnecting your cables, right?

it's watts (aka the current) that kills you. Know when you get those cool static electric shocks? there's like 12,000 volts in that sucker...a hundred times the volts put out in your wall outlet! however, a wall outlet has a huge amount of current running through it, and that's what kills you. all the voltage does is allow the current to flow through the path, once the path is established, the current flows hardcore. in a static shock, there is very littly current and thus no real damage occurs. with the wall outlet, there is practically an infinite source of current, which means lots of damage. i wish i was more motivated to come up with some cool drawings and diagrams...it's really easy to demonstrate this using waterpipes. i really love the core concepts of electricity, it's amazing how much stuff depends on it and in so little time. as far as the cat5 goes...that sounds interesting. what's the risk of damage to the computer equipment it's hooked up to? kenrat mentioned testing it on his cat, i wonder how my dog would respond

it's called voltage yo...there isn't enough electric potential for the current to travel through your body. however, once the electricity finds a path that the electric potential is strong enough to push it through, then the available current will flow. i believe the voltage coming out of most amps is somewhere between 3 and 15 volts (though i have no idea for sure).

also, if you'd like to test for sure if your speaker is working or not...swap your center channel with one of your mains or any other speaker that would be easy...if the speaker works when you connect it in another spot, then you gotta work the settings of your reciever (i too believe you've got a reciever issue)

just about every klipsch nut understands the basic concept behind horns and their design...i was just wondering if anyone out there knew of any literature that talked about the physics behind it all. i am very much interesting in speaker design, and would love to play around with building my own horns and stuff like that. you know...something like a basshorn that takes up the whole garage. or how bout hornloaded headphones? now there's a cool concept anyways, any help or guidance would be greatly appreciated...i have found a few things online, but they all discuss constructing a pre-designed horn. im more interested in building my own shapes and bending things in every direction (but would like to do so with some sort of mathmatical basis)

i go into my church after hours when no1 is there and put in music from the muppets: my fave is boom shakalaka this song is intense coming through the klipsch cluster we got installed there...the loudest i've gotten it is well over 130db (wearing ear protection of course and measured with a peaking out SPL meter we got in the booth). other songs i bust out there: 2001 space odyssey intro thing, some celtic bagpipe techno, and the lion sleeps tonite (u thought klipsch home stuff rocks? u so gotta hear their professional installations...it's insane! so much so i risk my neck playing with it)

well if you're feeling a bit more ambitious, you could always remove the dust cap and inspect the voice coil for yourself. the only question i might have for you is if you're able to push the woofer (at like an angle) to avoid the scraping...to me, it sounds like you're gonna have to align your diaphragm. it's not that hard of a thing to do, but it involves some cutting and regluing of your speakers (which isn't exactly easy on the nerves) worse case scenario, im sure some audio store in your area (ie, tweeter) would be more than willing to fix them for you (but of course they'll charge you for it) so if u decide to fix em yourself, let us know and some1 might be able to guide you to some sites with pictures and step by step instructions. (i know the first time i attempted something like this, i was a bit worried but in the end i was glad i did it myself...it's really an easy project, and lots of fun)

wats the fun in getting a kit and learning from some1 else!? nah, i would love to get my hands on a kit (provided it wasn't bloody expensive), but have no idea where to find any and i've done quite a bit of research on electronics, or would like to think i have a firm grasp on it...capacitor is that cool thing that builds up charge on a surface (it's kinda like a battery in that it dispels energy quickly but takes a while to charge)...transistor is a cool thing that the line signal kinda like opens and closes the gate that lets a stronger signal through (that like powers the speaker)... anyways, i have a deep passion for this stuff just cause it's so cool...and when you build your own stuff, it's awesome because u can instantly see the effects and tinker with it and all that cool stuff. (and it dont' matter when u break it cause u can just build another one, that will prob be better anyway) so ya, kits...where? u got me hooked already, don't leave me hanging