reynolr Posted September 16, 2011 Share Posted September 16, 2011 Anyone heard the new emotiva xref 12? I finally start my job next week so I'm gonna be ready to buy soon. Let me know what you thinly compared to its competition. Thanks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StephenM Posted September 16, 2011 Share Posted September 16, 2011 I'd expect it to be a solid contender in its size/price class based on the positive press of the Ultra 12. Of course, how suitable the XRef12 is for you depends on your room size, listening material, volume requirements, and expectations of extension. Pound a 4000 cubic foot room with 20Hz bass it will not. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reynolr Posted September 17, 2011 Author Share Posted September 17, 2011 how about a 2500 cubic ft room? Also I was heart set on the Epik Legend, the runner up was the Emotiva Ultra 12, then this xref came out and through me for a loop. So it is now between the Epik Legend and the Emotiva X-Ref 12. After shipping Epik the prices aren't to much different, so which would be best? I watch alot of movies (blu ray) and also listen to bass filled music. I would prefer something that got pretty low, and want it to fill the room with bass. I plan to put my Klipsch Sub 12 in the back by the listening area. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StephenM Posted September 17, 2011 Share Posted September 17, 2011 so which would be best? Between them, I'd probably go with the Emotiva, although for reasons other than raw performance; I was less than impressed by Epik's customer/sales support, and that left a bad taste in my mouth. how about a 2500 cubic ft room? Hard to say; depends on how much room gain it's subject to, which depends on the exact dimensions, how well sealed it is, and the construction of the room itself. However, you can get a good idea of the Emotiva Ultra 12's output capabilities here. The X-Ref12 may add a few more dB on top of that, but I wouldn't expect miracles. http://www.audioholics.com/reviews/speakers/subwoofers/ultra-12/ultra-12-measurements As you can see, by the time you're reaching 40-30Hz, the Ultra 12's max clean output ability is decreasing rather rapidly. If the gain of your room makes up for this, and the output meets your requirements, you could be set. If you've got a room with a 30 foot wall thats open to other parts of the house, and you like to listen at 115dB at the listening position, you'll be disappointed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reynolr Posted September 18, 2011 Author Share Posted September 18, 2011 That is odd about your dissatisfaction with Epik's support team, normally I hear nothing but good about them. I will propuse my question one last time: Epik Legend: $560 to my door Emotiva X-Ref: 630 to my door. It is approx 2500 cu ft room (20x15x8) with 2 openings, one in the front of the room with a door and one in the back that is open. Carpet on floors. Thank you all for your help, any input is appreciated. $70 difference between the 2. Price goes to Epik, amp goes to Emotiva. Please help! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StephenM Posted September 18, 2011 Share Posted September 18, 2011 That is odd about your dissatisfaction with Epik's support team, normally I hear nothing but good about them. Suffice it to say, I've found them to have an aversion to responding to e-mails, and if you search AVS, you'll find similar commentary. I will propuse my question one last time Between the two, I'd go for the Emotiva. However, with your room size/layout, I'd also consider a larger ported subwoofer ala a Hsu VTF 3.3 or a SVS PB12-NSD, as they are going to offer vastly superior performance in the 20-30Hz band. http://www.hometheatershack.com/forums/subwoofer-tests-archived/5748-cea-2010-standard-compilation.html Just going by the numbers Ilkka measured (at 2 meters) and Audioholics measured (at 1 meter) CEA 2010 ground plane testing, RMS, normalized to one meter, you get the following Emo Ultra 12 SVS PB12-NSD Hsu VTF 3.3 20Hz 91dB 108dB 107.3dB 25Hz 98dB 110.1dB 111.7dB 30/32Hz 103dB 112.8dB 112.7dB 40Hz 108dB 115.8dB 115.1dB Food for thought. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reynolr Posted September 18, 2011 Author Share Posted September 18, 2011 Taking your suggestions into consideration (StephenM) and the SVS is a little out of my range, the Emotiva is pushing it. However after visiting HSU Research website the HSU VTF 3.3 does not seem to be for sale any longer. Is it discoutinued due to the 3.4? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StephenM Posted September 18, 2011 Share Posted September 18, 2011 However after visiting HSU Research website the HSU VTF 3.3 does not seem to be for sale any longer. Is it discoutinued due to the 3.4? Yes, although the differences are minimal. If the SVS and VTF 3.4 are beyond your reach, you might consider the VTF 2.3. It has a bit less output than it's bigger brother due to a smaller cabinet and to a lesser extent, a less powerful amplifier. Here's a link to the VTF 3.2 performance which actually utilizes the same driver and cabinet, but a 300 watt amplifier versus a 250 watt amp that's in the 2.3 (and accounts for very little difference in output). http://www.hometheatershack.com/forums/subwoofer-tests-archived/987-hsu-vtf-3-mk2-maximum-output.html compared to the 3.3 http://www.hometheatershack.com/forums/subwoofer-tests-archived/5761-hsu-vtf-3-mk3-maximum-extension.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reynolr Posted September 18, 2011 Author Share Posted September 18, 2011 So your saying that the HSU 2.3 is better than both the X-Ref 12 and Legend? Even if it has the weakest amp. The X-Ref 12 has the most powerful amp, and weighs the least. The Legend weighs alot and has a decent amp. The HSU has the weakest amp but weighs much more than the Emotiva. I'm confused! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StephenM Posted September 18, 2011 Share Posted September 18, 2011 So your saying that the HSU 2.3 is better than both the X-Ref 12 and Legend? Down low, this is likely to be the case. Even if it has the weakest amp...I'm confused! The Hsu is a relatively large ported box subwoofer, whereas the other two are smallish sealed designs. This translates into a huge efficiency advantage down low for the Hsu. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StephenM Posted September 18, 2011 Share Posted September 18, 2011 One other bit of data from the above measurements from Ilkka and one set from Ricci over at AVS on the Epik Empire (the Legend's much larger and more powerful brother); 2 meters RMS CEA 2010 max output http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1351494 VTF 3.3 Empire 20Hz 101.3dB 102.2dB 25Hz 105.7dB 105.8dB 32Hz 106.7dB 109.7dB The Empire does possess significantly more output than the Hsu over 32Hz. However, this should give you some idea of what it would take for a sealed sub to equal a ported model in the lower frequencies: the Epik has nearly double the amplifier power, a similar sized cabinet, and dual 15" drivers versus the single 12" of the Hsu. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nezff Posted September 19, 2011 Share Posted September 19, 2011 is there a reason you want sealed subs? I prefer ported much more. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reynolr Posted September 19, 2011 Author Share Posted September 19, 2011 No reason, I was just thinking that the Legend and X-Ref were the best in my price range. Apparently I was mistaken lol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StephenM Posted September 19, 2011 Share Posted September 19, 2011 The problem is, there is no "best"; it's entirely dependent upon what you want in terms of output and appearance, combined with the realities of your room. A VTF 2.3 should give you greater low end grunt over the Xref or the Legend, but the Hsu is a very large sub by most people's standards. The Xref on the other hand offers much more flexibility in placement due to its size, and is more likely to pass muster with your wife/interior decorator. However, since you're looking for a sub to go low and fill the room with bass, a large ported subwoofer is the most cost effective way to reach that goal. MDF is cheap. High powered amplifiers and more robust woofers designed to handle the extra power, needed to overcome the efficiency advantage of a ported design, not so much. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reynolr Posted September 19, 2011 Author Share Posted September 19, 2011 I have my own room to do as I please, she has the rest of the place lol. So size and apperance is not a big deal to me. I am going based on pure performance. If the HSU is the way to go then thats what I will do. I do not think I will be disappointed with any of them, I am just trying to make the best decsion based on bass. I would actually enjoy a big sub it will catch everyone eye when they enter the room and they will want to hear it! Is the HSU going to be good for movie, music and games? In that order of use. If so I think you have me sold on a ported. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StephenM Posted September 19, 2011 Share Posted September 19, 2011 I do not think I will be disappointed with any of them I would expect not. All of them are good subwoofers. Is the HSU going to be good for movie, music and games? In that order of use. IMO, Hsu makes very good all round performing subwoofers (this coming from an SVS guy!). I think you'll be impressed with the quality of the bass from the VTF-2.3 as well as the raw depth and punch. You would need to spend a fair bit more or go DIY to seriously outperform it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reynolr Posted September 19, 2011 Author Share Posted September 19, 2011 I just pulled the trigger on the HSU. I'm pretty excited to try it out. I'll post a review of it after I get it. As long as it comes this week (I leave Monday morning for job training for 2 weeks). Thanks for all Ur help. And my review won't have much to compare it to. Just the sub 12 really. Post ill post my impressions anyways. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StephenM Posted September 19, 2011 Share Posted September 19, 2011 Congrats and enjoy! I'm definitely interested to hear what you think of it. I suspect you'll be impressed with the quality jump between the Sub12 and the Hsu. I owned a Sub 12 myself once upon a time; not bad for HT explosions, but it never impressed for music. The Hsu will. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reynolr Posted September 19, 2011 Author Share Posted September 19, 2011 That is what I think of it. I plan to put the Hsu up front and the sub 12 next to the seating area. Hopefully I can get wk to sound good together. Worth a try b4 I try and sell tho I think. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StephenM Posted September 19, 2011 Share Posted September 19, 2011 FWIW, I wouldn't hesitate to talk to Hsu's very knowledgable customer support for getting help with the setup, especially if you're going to try and keep the Sub 12 given that setting up multiple subs optimally can be rather complicated. IMO, the big reason to buy from Hsu or SVS is that you've got some of the best in the industry selling you their wares, but they're also very interested in giving you advice on how to get the most out of your investment. You'll get the most bang for your buck by taking advantage of their knowledge. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.