HiTech Center Pros & Cons

[HornEd]

Although a great speaker in its own right, the C-7 doesn't quite match KLF 30's in tone & timbre. Probably the new RC-7 is a better choice... but that is still down the road a piece. I have before me, a freight damaged KLF 30 that I am tempted to rebuild into a KLF 30 Center built to stand horizontally.

I am trying to locate and evaluate the significant variables of such a conversion.

1. To balance the sound with the 65" 16:9 screen, I expect to chisel out the motor board and build a new one with the horns mounted one above the other but rotated for horizontal use. The 12" woofers would then be mounted on either side.

2. The modern trend for center speakers is to have a Tapered Array (as Klipsch calls their TM approach) which rolls off one woofer before another to increase clarity in the vocal frequencies. Of course, that may create a problem with directionality, given the large size of the woofers when compared with traditional centers with their 8" or smaller ones.

3. If one did want a tapered array, what configuration and values should be used to have a fair chance of having one of the woofers roll off appropriately?

4. Then there is the potential problem of the ports located at one end of the speaker creating a disparity between the output of the woofers. It would seem that the ports should be moved into the center to provide a similar dynamic for each woofer.

5. Relax, enjoy the C-7 I have, and rebuild the damaged speaker into a standard KLF 30 and make it a 7.1 HT system... and consider turning my extra KLF 10 into a center speaker for a nine Legend system.

Any thoughts, pro or con, or even a little inspiration would be most appreciated. HornEd

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HornEd Legendary HT Herd

KLF 30 L&R Mains

KLF C-7 Center

KLF 30 L&R Surrounds

KLF 30 L&R Rear Surround

KLF 10 L&R Front Effects

Subs: KSW-15 + 3 KSW-12's

Speaker Support Systems:

Mitsubishi RPHD1080i 65"

Yamaha RX-V3000 Receiver

and more... Tweak On!

This message has been edited by HornEd on 06-06-2001 at 09:02 PM

[4977]

From my limited experience with this sort of thing I wouldn't reccomend messing around with the crossover. I thought about that breifly with my speaker and decided that the factory crossover was probably far superior than anything I could make. If you are already experienced at this sort of thing go for it, if not I think you would be better off using the factory setup. I was also concerened about the port being at one end of the speaker. My 5.5 originally had the port on the front. I placed the port in the center of the rear of the cabinet. I think that you would be best served by replacing the back panel and moving the ports to the center on yours also. If I were in your situation I beleive that I would try making it into center channel. If you decide that you like your C7 better you could always build a new cabinet for a standard KLF30. Probably the most important thing to consider is how you feel about the actual labor involved. I enjoyed the time I spent working on mine, but not everyone likes this sort of thing. I kinda hope you do it, if it works well for you I may be buying a new mid and tweeter and going at it again. Good luck with whichever route you take.

Q.

[HornEd]

Hi-Q! Unless AlK comes up with something grand for KLF 30 owners around the world, my "playing" would be limited to using the stock crossover and then, just maybe, contriving an early roll off for one woofer lead.

Just out of curiosity, how does your KLF 10 center conversion work in terms of dialogue clarity in HT. Supposedly, the Klipsch Tapered Array® (Like the new RC-7... unlike that on the old C-7) uses a 2.5 way system by phasing out one woofer in the dialogue frequency range to prevent competition from two woofers.

A concern, which I tried to express above, is that the size of the KLF 30 woofers and exponential horn may make apparent sound direction off even on a 65" screen... and that is my greatest concern with "horozontalizing" a KLF 30. How does your conversion fair in that department?

Nothing like a little tinkering to really gain respect for Klipsch engineers! HornEd

This message has been edited by HornEd on 06-18-2001 at 03:43 PM

[rgdawsonco]

HornEd,

Guess what? From what I have read and discovered for myself is that perfect timbre matching is nearly impossible to achieve in the practical world. Why? because the speaker location for the center is different and it react to the room differently. (Heck, in my room, the left and right speakers don't event sound identical due to the room.) And very few people can mount a center channel such that its tweeter is at the same height as the tweeters in the L&R speakers. So its going to sound different. Did you know, sonically, the C-7 should be mounted vertically? Nobody does it but that's the way it would sound best.

But hey this is a hobby and your idea of making a center out of a damaged KLF-30 sounds like a cool idea. Here's my advice for what its worth. Rotating the horns is a good idea. (I wish Klipsch would have rotated the horn in the C-7). That way you'll get 90 degrees dispersion in the horizontal and 60 dgrees vertical like you want. The way the C-7 is usually mounted, you get more floor and ceiling reflection and inadequate horizontal dispersion. I also think putting the woofers on opposite ends is a good idea. If anything, at least the bohemoth will be better balanced relative to weight. Theoretically, the spreading of the woofers will narrow the combined radiation pattern of the woofers in the horizontal, but at 750Hz and below I don't think it will be appreciable and might even me beneficial. You can work out the math with a little geometry and see. As for the ports, I do not see the need to split the two ports and mount them on opposite ends. This will just waste space. I guarantee you that, sonically, it makes no difference, because you cannot localize 34Hz. So I'd keep the ports configured as they are. Finally, don't screw around with the crossovers.

Go for it!

This message has been edited by rgdawsonco on 06-17-2001 at 09:33 PM

[HornEd]

Greg, good to hear from you. Sure, some shift in tone & timbre occurs due to the acoustic characteristics of the room... but the changes reflected in a sound moving from side surrounds, to mains, to center deserve a bit more continuity than some configurations allow. I can easily detect a difference in my six KLF 30's as the pink noise is generated to each speaker... but it is more like an honest sound with a slightly different character.

I had just about decided to buy a new RC-7 from my local authorized dealer... but the manager has not allowed their demos out of the box in their storeroom. So that encouraged me to slice up the damaged KLF 30 which I have since fully restored. I also have an extra KLF 10 that I could use as a center... and that may have some advantages given what has been previously posted on this board. That would allow me to keep the KLF 30's as three matched pairs (7.1: Fronts, Side Surround, & Rear Effects).

I have installed matching, 47" tall, equipment cabinets in the left and right front corners of the room and mounted L&R KLF-10 front effects speakers on them in an inverted position. It makes the best front array "sound wall" I have yet tried.

Greg, I appreciate the encouragement and will let you know what happens.

HornEd

This message has been edited by HornEd on 06-19-2001 at 09:13 AM