Kek Posted February 15, 2004 Share Posted February 15, 2004 I knew that this preamp would be a step in the right direction, replacing a AES AE-3 and a Rogue Magnum 99, but having the Cary in the system for a few weeks I was feeling that its sound was not quite right. It sounded thick, foggy, almost lethargic. I was not going to let this happen. The preamp as you are aware came with a cap that is labeled "Audio 1", which is one of Carys upgraded oil caps, and to who makes this cap is a mystery. These caps (Audio 1) seem to be the root of the problem, and many Cary owners have stated the same. I bought a pair a Hovland Musicaps and installed them, and what a huge difference they make--lowend is powerful and dynamic without being soupy, midrange is true to life, and the the top end has a great highend extension thats not constricted as before. These new caps have tranformed the Cary into a totaly new sounding preamp. I do remember Mobile making the comment that you might want to try a different cap such as the Jensen when you had this. Glad you didnt--you might have kept it. I have talked to Kirk at Cary a few times and he has told me that he uses the Hovlands in his reference SLP98-- a cap that they do not offer. They must have bought a truck load of "Audio 1's" at a deal and trying to promote them. The Cary is a work of art with the right caps; its to bad you didnt have the time to hear it with such because you might not have sold it. thanks again, kris Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mobile homeless Posted February 15, 2004 Share Posted February 15, 2004 I tried to convince ole Deano and any other with the Audio 1 caps to ditch them and go for the Jensen Copper Oils, an oil that is significantly better. It's a cap that has natural detail while not exhibiting that extra zing of some of the plastic caps that some equate with quality detail but is really on the hotter side of neutral in my view. Those Audio 1 are offered as the "oil upgrade" on many of the Cary products, especially the AES units. They were actually in my Moondogs at one time and were ditched in favor of the Jensens. I didnt understand why ole Dean didnt try some of his THETA caps just to see (though do realize he ran into a big deal and the Cary helped in the purchase). Just as in everything, all oil caps do not sound the same. A move to a more transparent and open cap will bring your AES or Cary to higher ground. Personally, I like the Jensen Copper (a better option by all accounts than the Aluminum version) over even Hovland. But the Hovlands are very nice and better than many. Other options that work well in Cary are the MIT RTX Multicap which is very, very extended though perhaps not as harmonically rich as the Jensens. And I am not so sure about the other Cary standard, the Kimber Kap. Still, these subs can become $$$. To be sure, caps can make a big difference. But be careful of what you desire. I lately have been thinking that some detail highlighted with certain cap options, especially in vintage amps, can lead one to think that the answer is in the "details" but one must be careful when said details are of the kind that attract attention. There is a fine line between natural detail and detail that is more of the nature of a treble pot being pushed foward. Back on subject, any of you AES or Cary owners that have the Audio 1 caps, give some thought to making an upgrade, and if sticking with oils, try the Jensen, Angela, or Audio Note Coppers. kh Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kek Posted February 15, 2004 Author Share Posted February 15, 2004 Mobile, I agree with you when saying that anyone who has the Audio 1 cap in their CARY- AES equipment should look to other caps. The Cary was a diamond in the rough with the Audio 1's. I had a hard time trying to decide which caps to try. I spent alot of money a few months ago on NOS tubes for the previous preamp, and I could see my wifes frustration building with the 3rd,4th, 5th parcel packages arriving with tubes at my door. To preserve my marriage, my cap quest was limited. The first time I talked to Kirk at Cary, he suggested using their standard caps....mmmmm....without saying it, I felt he really didnt like the Audio 1's sound quality. This hobby is so subjective to indivigual tastes ,that suggestions are only oppinions, and getting it right is trial and error--hit or miss. kek Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kudret Posted February 15, 2004 Share Posted February 15, 2004 I would like to change the caps in my Cary SLP70 and I was wondering if anyone would have have any suggestions. Here is a picture of them: http://132.205.20.170/audio/slp70/DSC01408.jpg The ones I am interested in are the two Nichicon 680mF 200V (brown caps) and Solen 15uF 630V (the horizontal black one). Any other suggestions are welcome as well. Kudret Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NOSValves Posted February 15, 2004 Share Posted February 15, 2004 Kudret, Those are power supply caps. I bet you would get a much bigger bang for your buck replacing coupling caps. Craig Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mobile homeless Posted February 15, 2004 Share Posted February 15, 2004 Kudret, not quite sure why you are going to the trouble of changing these power supply filtering caps? While you might get a small improvement here going to something else, based on your complaints in the past, I dont think this is your problem. I have heard the totally stock (as has Jeff) SLP-70 with 1/4 the filtration and no bypass at all. I thought it very light and nimble and an excellent pre with Moondogs and the many PP. AGain, tube choice is CRITICAL here. The stock unit had coupling caps that are surely not of the film/foil MIT level but at least they appeared to err on the warm instead of harsh side. Some of the lower MIT caps are metalized. Have you done more than one 6SL7/6SN7 tube switch here? What are you looking to achieve? As you have the MIT caps in the coupling position, I think you have a wire or TUBE problem. The tube choice really changes the character of this preamp. And the higher end MIT should be fine here. On the modified Cary, I have over 6000uF of ELNA caps with a heavy duty large 15uF SOLEN METAL CAN cap and a .22uF MIT RTX film foil bypass in the place where YOUR SOLEN is. kh Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deang Posted February 15, 2004 Share Posted February 15, 2004 I'm glad you ended up with an even better preamp. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kudret Posted February 15, 2004 Share Posted February 15, 2004 Craig, All the coupling caps are MIT. Here is a close-up of the whole unit: http://ie.me.concordia.ca/audio/slp70/DSC01724.jpg Kelly, I've tried Tung-Sol, RCA, Sylvania, Westinghouse, etc. 6SL7 and 6SN7s. All black base though. I would like to try some red base RCAs, but they cost an arm and a leg, and I am not sure if that will solve the problem. Since you have a Scott 299B, try this. Turn the treble to -3 and bass to -1.5. Cary+DRDs sound almost the same as 299B, still 299B having slight edge in detail. Without treble there is no air around the instruments. I know 299B is probably on the bright side, but Cary and DRD's are too dark for my taste. Kudret Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NOSValves Posted February 15, 2004 Share Posted February 15, 2004 Kudret, For obvious reasons I will refrain from saying to much here. But I will say the 299B is not on the bright side I don't care who says it is...I say its accurate !! While the electrolytics your talking about replacing may do some good I seriously don't think they are going to solve your problem unless the caps in there now are bad or under valued for the application which is highly unlikely. What really freaks me out is the lack of detail statement. I have no clue because most of what I have heard about SET would be the absolute opposite. But the SET I have heard to date has not proven you to be wrong but so far hardly in a Ideal setting in one case or great amps in the other. I hope to cure that this coming weekend Craig Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kudret Posted February 15, 2004 Share Posted February 15, 2004 Craig, I A/Bed 299B and 299C by using a speaker switch. 299B has more treble than 299C, both in neutral position. Caps used in rebuild were not exactly the same and this might be a factor, I don't know. Scott 299B is my favourite and lately I prefer to turn the treble to -1 on it. Kudret Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NOSValves Posted February 15, 2004 Share Posted February 15, 2004 Kudret, Just because you may find that the 299B has more top end does it make it bright ? or does it make the 299C dull or rolled off ? Who is to say which is accurate ? Everyone's ears have a preference. Craig Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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