m00n Posted March 22, 2004 Author Share Posted March 22, 2004 ---------------- On 3/22/2004 12:06:32 PM BBB wrote: And don't forget, what doesn't kill you, makes you stronger. Or in other words..stay off the ladders! He he he he he ---------------- You know... I have NEVER used that ladder again. Well, that aint entirely true, I think I used it as a shelf once. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
markmaple Posted March 22, 2004 Share Posted March 22, 2004 I think Ed was referring to 2 left RC-7s, 2 right RC-7s and 1 rear RC-7. With your room size, I would think one rear would be plenty. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
m00n Posted March 22, 2004 Author Share Posted March 22, 2004 Mark, you could be right on that... If so, I wonder how it would actually sound. One of the biggest reasons I was toying with the idea of downsizing my surrounds was all the suggestions I'd gotten up in my converstaion with Artto in the architectural area. People had been suggesting that frequencies were being cancled out due to having too many speakers in a small area. Not to mention that it would be muddy. It could be that it was the type of speaker... Having RC7s rather than RS7s may not have the same audio issues. If I was to get 2 new RC7s, I have to take on a second job or something... Wife would... Well... we will just leave it at the wife would not approve otherwise. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
markmaple Posted March 22, 2004 Share Posted March 22, 2004 Moon, If you were to go with a single RC-7 on each side and a single RC-7 on the back you could come out ahead! You already have two RC-7. A pair of RS-7s go on ebay for between $550-$650. That's about what you would have to pay for the other new RC-7. That still leaves you the other pair of RS-7s to sell or to use as a "B" set of surrounds. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nicholtl Posted March 22, 2004 Share Posted March 22, 2004 Very interesting story Moon! You've kind of inspired me to get a pair of RS-7's now to complete my 9.1 setup. But that also means getting another amp, so that sucks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
m00n Posted March 22, 2004 Author Share Posted March 22, 2004 Nic... You want to add aditional RS7's or RC7's. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
m00n Posted March 22, 2004 Author Share Posted March 22, 2004 ---------------- On 3/22/2004 12:52:07 PM markmaple wrote: Moon, If you were to go with a single RC-7 on each side and a single RC-7 on the back you could come out ahead! You already have two RC-7. A pair of RS-7s go on ebay for between $550-$650. That's about what you would have to pay for the other new RC-7. That still leaves you the other pair of RS-7s to sell or to use as a "B" set of surrounds. ---------------- Yeah, if I do this I'm hoping to stay away from eBay. Just have no interest in dealing with eBay. I am thinking about a straight across trade with someone though. My 2 RS7s for 1 RC7 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nicholtl Posted March 22, 2004 Share Posted March 22, 2004 ---------------- On 3/22/2004 3:21:52 PM m00n wrote: Nic... You want to add aditional RS7's or RC7's. ---------------- I wanna add RS7's, since my center surrounds are RF-35's, and my rear surrounds are RF-7's. based on your discovery, since I already have monopole surrounds, adding dipole surrounds might fill in the gaps. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
m00n Posted March 22, 2004 Author Share Posted March 22, 2004 Send me a perfect or near perfect condition RC7 and I will send you a set of 99.5% perfect condition RS7's. I still have the box, and packing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HornEd Posted March 22, 2004 Share Posted March 22, 2004 m00n, sorry for not being more specific. As I recall, your room is just over ten feet wide... and twenty something feet long. One RC-7 on the shelf in the middle of the back wall will handle all the sixth channel feed you need. I would put two RC-7's on each long wall (four RC-7's all together). Place the RC-7's so that the a line extending the angle of the woofer cones intersect at the edge of the seating area. Then set up the 5 RC-7 speakers with an SPL meter so they all sound the same from the middle of your sweet spot. What I am suggesting is what commercial theaters do with long and narrow seating. They place horizontally oriented speakers along the wall facing the opposite side. Think of the cone speakers as if they were flashlights. The light they would shine would spread out (just as sound does from the speakers). Imagine where the light would combine with he light from the next speaker. The ideal height for your theater will probably be about 5'. This should provide a sweet spot pattern that gets the most of programmed ambience in modern DVD's. I have set up Home Theaters in just this way and had great success every time. I've got to run now, but I will try to check in later. -HornEd Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nicholtl Posted March 22, 2004 Share Posted March 22, 2004 ---------------- On 3/22/2004 5:31:46 PM m00n wrote: Send me a perfect or near perfect condition RC7 and I will send you a set of 99.5% perfect condition RS7's. I still have the box, and packing. ---------------- Damn, that's a tempting offer...only I don't have a 2nd RC-7, just my center. Plus, what makes things worse is that even if I did wanna grab the RS-7's, I still gotta pay another 2G's for another Halo A21 amp to match. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Klipschfoot Posted March 22, 2004 Share Posted March 22, 2004 I fully realize your room is not my room and it's obvious my budget is not your budget either! Regarding your rear surrounds, have you tried putting two on sides about ear level and two on the back wall run from a splitter? I don't see this setup anywhere else, but I think my cheap little 5(+2).1 HT sounds good. Perhaps that's because it's mine(!). For sides I am using a couple of old Bose 301 (like I said, I don't have your budget) and a pair of Minimus 7 on the back wall about 1.5 ft. down from the ceiling. While watching U-571, the depth charges exploding left and right gave the impression they were just above my head L&R. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
m00n Posted March 22, 2004 Author Share Posted March 22, 2004 ---------------- On 3/22/2004 9:33:23 PM Klipschfoot wrote: I fully realize your room is not my room and it's obvious my budget is not your budget either! Regarding your rear surrounds, have you tried putting two on sides about ear level and two on the back wall run from a splitter? I don't see this setup anywhere else, but I think my cheap little 5(+2).1 HT sounds good. Perhaps that's because it's mine(!). For sides I am using a couple of old Bose 301 (like I said, I don't have your budget) and a pair of Minimus 7 on the back wall about 1.5 ft. down from the ceiling. ---------------- My HK has 7 powered channels. LCR, LS, RS, RR, LR. Now as I understand it, the rear channels in DTS-ES and Dolby Digital-EX is mono... Yeah? What I had until saturday was 4 side surrounds. For them I was using both the powered surrounds as well as the pre-amp outs for the surrounds. Pre-amp into external powered amp. I don't have my budge either. . Which is why I'm thinking of trading 4 RS7s for 2 RC7s. I hope I answered what you were aluding too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Klipschfoot Posted March 22, 2004 Share Posted March 22, 2004 take a look at http://www.liquidtheater.com/editorials/50 for an explanation of formats. It seems two of your side surrounds could have been two rear surrounds. Yes the rear surrounds would be mono from what I am reading. When watching U-571 the depth charges were exploding left and right of me. That was "cool." I could have sprayed myself with a hose for more special effects. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HornEd Posted March 23, 2004 Share Posted March 23, 2004 Good morning m00n! Just dropped in this thread to see how "surrounded" you have become. While it is true that your HK can knock out 7.1... two of those channels, left rear effects and right rear effects are actually one discrete source or exactly the same as the sixth channel of a 6.1 system. Most DVD's are 5.1 (as detailed below). For 6.1 generated from a receiver, the Rear Array channels are blended in a special way that creates a discrete Rear Effects channel. In 6.1 DVDs all six full-range channels plus low bass are available as mixed by the movies audio engineer. SIDE NOTE: Just to confuse things, in my theater rigs, I use a pair of Front Effects speakers that create two extra channels placed higher up the wall and to either side of the standard front array. IMHO, this creates a wider sound stage and an ethereal quality to sci-fi and wide-open spaces scenes. These effects speakers can be turned on or off depending on the fare... generally I leave them on. Their discrete content is derived from the respective Left and Right Mains. But I digress... and while I might but though I may be sticking a Klipschfoot in a m00n mouth, here goes: In a two-channel 2.0 DVD, there are two discrete, full-range MONAURAL channels, Left Main and Right Main, which when broadcast from two separate speakers create a STEREO effect as if you were listening to something actually taking place in FRONT of you.. In a multi-channel 5.1 DVD, there are five discrete, full-range MONAURAL channels, Front Array: Left Main, Center Main, Right Main; Rear Array: Left Surround and Right Surround Subwoofer Array: Low Bass (the .1 channel only very expensive subwoofers can recreate the entire Dolby Digital DVD low bass which requires a subwoofer array hit 121.5 dB @ 20 Hz ). When broadcast from five separate speakers and a subwoofer, creates a circle of sound as if you were listening to something that was taking place ALL AROUND you. As indicated, a sixth channel fills in the gap between the Side/Surround speakers in the area where hearing is least sensitive directly behind you. 7.1 just puts two speakers in this hard-to-hear area playing from the same sixth channel source. The extra speaker helps when the listening area is extra wide say 18 or more. In my experience, filling an 18 wide room with one quality monopole speaker is quite adequate. The same can be said for a 30 circular room! Since WDST speakers are designed to bounce sound above 2,000 Hz off of adjacent walls with only sounds below 2,000 Hz being broadcast toward the sweet spot the effect of putting an RS-7 on the rear wall is to spray the sidewalls with high mid and high frequencies while instead of a full-range sound from the rear wall, only low mid and high bass frequencies will appear to come from there. So sound would be bouncing off the same side walls competing with your Side/Surrounds! If your Side/Surround is an RC-7, its sound is going to be far superior than the reflected high range from a rear mounted RS-7. It follows, therefore, that an RC-7 mounted on the rear wall would provide a full-range, more accurately detailed sound from the direction of the back wall just like an audio engineer would anticipate in a quality movie theater. The Wayne Lucas experimental standard, THX, advocated the use of dipoles (bipole speakers wired out-of-phase and aimed to bounce front wall and rear wall deliberately confusing the ear as to the timbre and directionality of the sound. The effect is to immerse the audience in a diffuse sound. Obviously, if that is what is needed for a given storyline, the audio engineer mixing a DVD can mix in the proper amount of ambience in any or all of the five (or six in 6.1 or 7.1) discrete channels. Having dipoles as surrounds forces EVERY sound broadcast from them to flood your ears even if that destroys the effect intended by the DVDs audio mix! Well, Forum Friends, its 1 a.m. in the Santa Cruz Mountains and I have a legal brief to write before the sun comes up. I am in my mountain den listening to 6.1 jazz in a fully-loaded horn environment thanks to PWK and the good fortune to understand the joy of monopole multi-channel DVDs and music. HornEd PS: For those who care about such things... like the Bar Assn., I am not an attorney, but I do write legal briefs from my perspective for the attorneys that represent my holdings or my views on broader social issues. For about ten years, my full time occupation has been that of a philanthropist spreading joy, education and understanding to those who can best use it. But, hold your cards and letters, my philanthropic pursuits for the next decade are already committed and not being licensed to practice law, I dont give legal advice to others. But I will give this advice to the Klipsch minions on this Forum, Thanks for returning the use of the Two Channel Forum back to us. May we all use it more wisely than we have. Except as it applies to you (expletive deleted)! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
avman Posted March 23, 2004 Share Posted March 23, 2004 mOOn, would it be practical/possible to position a rS-7 to the rear on the SIDE walls close(about 1 1/2 to 2ft)to the back wall so the front horn faces your sweet spot(like a toed-in speaker would)? at the same time use ONE rC-7 as a single center rear. i'm not so sure about the rs-7's, but my ksp-s6's(which have the woofer on the front and back with the horn as well)sound kinda like a monopole(because it faces my sweet spot as a monopole)and the rear array sends sound off the back wall. dunno-just thought since you were moving stuff around i'd try to keep you busy avman. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrWho Posted March 23, 2004 Share Posted March 23, 2004 i was thinking... if you did the 2 sets of RC-7 as the side surrounds and 1 RC-7 as the rear surround, you could throw in some time delay between the rear side surround and the front side surround...but that costs a lot of money, lol. but if you got around $2,000 to spend, let me know...there's some way cool toys out there! oh btw, you'd need a laptop too Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
m00n Posted March 23, 2004 Author Share Posted March 23, 2004 avman... You question, what issue are you trying to resolve with that arrangmeent? DrWho.. I love toys, a delay would be very nice, however, I don't have 2000 to spend... However, working where I do, I may be able to find someone to make me a hardware delay circuit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HornEd Posted March 23, 2004 Share Posted March 23, 2004 m00n, I think what the Avman is saying that using a WDST speaker like it was a two-faced monopole is possible if you can have two of its speaker faces facing the audience. BTW, it's quite possible that you could make a 6.1 system with three RF-7's in the front array and three RC-7's in the rear array. Hey, I have to take a break... I worked all night on legal stuff... and won another major battle in court today. A little fuzzy... so I'm gonna take a power nap... and catch you on the flip side. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
m00n Posted March 23, 2004 Author Share Posted March 23, 2004 Ah... Gotcha... Because of that back shelf, not sure how easy it would be to do that with the RS7s. I have a *POSSIBLE* chance at trading one set of my RS7s with a RC7 from a local dealer.. Just got of the phone with the dealer... He is contemplating it and told me to call back tomorrow. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.