CEDIA thoughts....

[IndyKlipschFan]

I was lucky in my job to gain access to the CEDIA show on friday before I left for New Orleans for the weekend on business/ pleasure, only to have to come home early to avoid the Hurricane.. I am fine..

This is my 3rd CEDIA show, I have also been to many conventions like this as well, CES in the summer in Chicago since 1980 off and on, and CES in Las Vegas 1984 up till say 2001. Most conventions are pretty much the same. CEDIA has a cooler "feel" in some ways than others though. I think it is because people at this level are really "into" what they do too.

Below are just my thoughts and opinions...

We have crossed a line in Home Theater that we got through the first generation of products dumped on consumers that were too high, and too complicated. We now have very bad HT in a box units for 199.00. The industry overall is way down, although some custom installers are certainly doing well too. Griff chime in here too.

I think the trend is to make a better descision by using better products in a family room or dedicated room to really show off your ht sysetm too. One guy after I said how well..or better said is this Projector ok to use for a lot of regular TV too? He scoffed... like "Well it has 2000 hrs of bulb life and 200 dollars to replace it when you do.." He said, "I certainly would not spend money on a bulbs life to just say watch football this should be used for MOVIES..." I just laughed on the inside and said to him "What shallow thinking... You spend all this money on the perfect room and speakers... and refuse to say watch the NBA, NFL finals..why even bother having a room then??? geeze?????"

The internet has also informed people of good deals and bad ones as well. The movie makers have basically settled in on 5.1 sound (Add more if you like.) And some great movies are stretching the DD, DTS, formats to the nth degree. While I feel very lucky to have the Aragon gear, I am pretty sure at least for the short to mid runs... Nothing new is coming out to change any gear I "must have" kinda thing in 6 months to the next few years. This is good in a way, our equipment doesn't go out of style/ usefullness too quickly too.

THX approved speakers by themselves mean diddly squat, unless your room is "calibrated" by an THX Installer to be an "approved" THX theater I was informed at the show. BTW, While I may or may not want to always play them at loud THX levels... The older heritage in this case 3 accross the front Cornwalls or La Scalas (I am going back n forth) with the new THX Subs (yes 2 of them) and the Klipsch THX sub amp..is just an amazing combination. I am still drawing plans, ColterPhoto1 and a few others have heard it so far in an unfineshed basement to date.. I can report also I saw his jaw hit the floor a few times in a quick Demo too.

The big names had some impressive gear at the show. JBL, McIntosh, Klipsch, for speakers... Draper, stewart, others for screens, infocus, sony, runco, you name it DLP projectors it gets all fuzzy after a while doesn't it? Lots of HDTVs on the wall coming out and prices dropping too.

What did I really like? Sony had a 70 inch HDTV with a blue laser DVD player that was simply amazing. The Klipsch demo room with all the Aragon gear and the THX flagship speaker products even trying NOT to be biased...was simply fantastic... in what? 9.2 sound! Klipsch had a inwall product called the ZONE... I will let them talk about it on the BB soon I am sure. The also talked about doing a lot of business with Yamaha, too, in some joint ventures TBA.

Home theater seating is cheap to simply silly high end price wise. I am sorry, but 4k for a seat that is a leather chair with a cup holder is too much! I am still amazed at all the "stuff" you can get for your HT too.

I think the money is in the designing of rooms and building them too. Then you can dictate to the consumer...if he has any money left over, what to buy too. In my own personal goal I am shocked...ok maybe not shocked but amazed at how much contractors think YOU should spend on a HT room that is 17- 30 too.

I grabbed a lot of magazines, talked with a lot of people, got great ideas too, and hope to start this dream theater/ karaoke room in the comming months. Even if I have to do some of it myself too. I am sure I will have questions for some of you on thr BB, and if you have any questions about what I saw, ask me.

[picky]

Indy: Thanks for your CEDIA Show overview and your thoughts on where you believe the industry is headed.

As HT "Freaks", "Geeks" or whatever we wish to call ourselves, the one thing I have observed is that, compared to the general public out there, we seem to be a bunch of oddballs. I am not saying that is a bad thing. Simply put, we seem to be eccentric in our likes and dislikes (at varying levels) and we are willing to put more thought, effort and obviously money forth to obtain the things we need to enjoy our hobby to its fullest. Again, that's a simple observation, not a criticism

I would not be so presumptuous as to speak for others here, so please understand that I am going to convey to you MY experience with our hobby thus far:

When I first began to research our HT hobby in depth 3 years ago because my wife and I had decided to build a dedicated theater, one of the things we did first was to consult with a local CEDIA-certified representative. We spent about 3 hours at this gentleman's place and he demonstrated his setups showing us alternative rooms and such. He gave us lots of brochures and advice. However, every single one of his suggestions was at the "pie-in-the-sky" level. We explained to him what our projected budget was for the entire project and then he proceeded to try and sell us things such a Meridian speakers. Geez, if we'd bought those, we would not have any money left to buy anything else! We attempted to discuss DLP projectors with him and he would not have anything to do with it. Plus, he didn't seem to know much about DLPs in the first place. He wanted to sell us only a CRT or LCD projector (I don't wish to engage in a CRT versus DLP discussion here, please). It was like he was more interested in imposing his point-of-view on us, rather than trying to understand what we were interested in. It was not a good experience and I am certain this was not emblematic of how the majority of CEDIA representatives handle their clients. We nearly choked when the man told us what his consulting fees would be as we left his place. Needless to say, we never went back.

Our own hands-on research and asking questions of fellow hobbyists on forums such as this is how we were able to arrive at the best combination of equipment and building materials from which to assemble our theater.

As I see it, there are two schools of thought within our hobby: There are those of us whom are eccentric and then there is the rest of the general public.

First, we must recognize that we hobbyists are few and far between. In my experience, there really are not a lot of people out there with whom we can hold a conversation with on the topic of HT, especially not at the level of our individual expertise. The majority of my friends are what I would consider "low-tech". And, although there is nothing wrong with that, I see their eyes glaze-over if I begin to ramble on about anything technical. They are the very people to which we can sell a complete "home-theater-on-the-shelf" for $199.99. And the amazing thing is that they are tickled to dead to own one! Yet, when they come to our place, they are fully able to tell the difference and marvel at the sound and picture quality. It's all about priorities. Having a high-level of quality entertainment system in their own home is not a priority of theirs. They love simplicity, which is one reason why systems such as Bose are so popular. This seems to drive some of us crazy. It used to drive me crazy, too. I used to think, "How could you not care?" But, I have come to realize that people really are different. And, that's okay.

I have discovered that I enjoy being the one our friends brag about to others for possessing advanced knowledge in the areas of my interests. I have also overheard them brag about our theater to others at parties and gatherings. It is a very uplifting thing to hear your friends say unprovoked, nice things about you and your room. Have any of you had the same experience? To me, it makes all of the hard work and research worth my while. It was our idea in the first place to build the theater so we could share it with others and that is exactly how it's worked out thus far. I'm okay with being the HT Geek in my circle of friends. However, if it wasn't for this forum, I would have no one to talk to about my hobby.

CEDIA is very important to this industry. I may be wrong, but I think the majority of the customers who utilize their services are those who want the quality as we do, without having to invest in an education in video and sound and the time to understand everything. That sort of leaves me out, as a do-it-yourselfer.

Sorry for the long post.

[IndyKlipschFan]

First off Picky your my hero too, doing it yourself. I loved your site and your picks and what you did too.

I agree with you on several levels too. I hope my room looks as cool as yours when finished too.

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As HT "Freaks", "Geeks" or whatever we wish to call ourselves, the one thing I have observed is that, compared to the general public out there, we seem to be a bunch of oddballs.

Guilty.. I get pleasure dreaming, cutting out pictures, asking questions from experts and hobbyists too.. Writing down, comparing, and designing the room as "I" want to have it done too. I will construct a basic room first and hope to add things over time too. (Fancier lights, ticket booth, and "cinema stuff" kinda stuff.) I also plan to have lots of lights too and spots for the Karaoke system too, further complicating my dream room some as well.

-------------------------------------------------------

I have discovered that I enjoy being the one our friends brag about to others for possessing advanced knowledge in the areas of my interests. I have also overheard them brag about our theater to others at parties and gatherings. It is a very uplifting thing to hear your friends say unprovoked, nice things about you and your room.

I definitely hear ya on that one too. A neighbor has about 80k in HT gear, it is a ok system...(heheh My opinion) He has big pockets. Anyhow, he came over to my house.. again in my unfineshed room.. He just about pooped his pants how much better my system sounds even today vs his..LOL.. He said if I decide to re do mine will you help me? I, of course, said yes.

My main love is singing. HT is a close second. they go back n forth though too. Once I say Karaoke people run.. Be assured I have a great system including Klipsch La Scalas (2 pairs) and Klipsch monitors great Shure 58 mics and Mackie amps and a Mackie 16 channel board, DBX 31 band EQ with built in compression and digital effects for vocals etc etc.. It is not your normal set up at a bar or through the stereo either. Not even cranked up way loud it is hands down better than anything in town I have ever sung through. Again, look at peoples faces when you can crank out a tune and make it sound really really good is just anazing! Even more fun when you get THEM to do it too. Add lights and a small stage I want it to be kick a$$.

I hope when it is all said and done other people enjoy it too. But to be honest, I want it to be fantastic for myself and my family first!

CEDIA is a great organization. The courses taught are amazing to help people do what they do too. You get too close to the fire (on the inside) and realise the markups when trying to do it yourself, if you have any skills like you did, you go for it too. Baring a no design is out of the question attitude with major bucks... I guess anything is possible.

The midwest audiofest 2 years ago was the ultimate (but a blast) geek fest IMO. 5k men maybe 10 women.. tube amps and esoteric speakers.. most 30+ in age and trying to find nirvana. The Chicago Horn Guys were the best though!! Wish Indy had a club like this!!

And like you, without the wonderful people on here it would be hard to do anything in our hobby! If your ever in Indy pls come over and offer some advice.

[Joe Bagadonuts]

You both articulately describe what I think is a big problem in this industry. There is too much emphasis on retail product sales, and not enough on truly valuable service. Clients need good service, not necessarily a large product invoice total. If in the first meeting with a "custom" dealer he does not do a lot of listening, establish a foundation for communication with you, then ask a lot of questions, and do a lot more listening, then head for the door.

What should they be asking? They should determine three things: Lifestyle (how you will use the room); Expectations (yours, not his); and Budget (and everybody has one). It is his job to figure out how to find a balance that is technically appropriate and meets the client's three factors. Might there be compromise? Sure. But a well thought out design and installation might only compromise, let's say, the client's ability to play at DD/THX reference level, but otherwise provide a terrific, faithful system. That is typically an easy compromise to live with. This approach is included in much of the CEDIA training, and even specialty training such as the THX training. Good and appropriate service pays.

On another note, as one who has attended THX training and an active member of the motion picture industry, I can tell you that there is no such thing as a "THX approved or certified" home theater room. THX would be the first to tell you that. The exception would be if the room was so large as to be as big as a commercial screening room, and utilized commercial THX certification requirements. Even then, I don't think THX would be interested. The only privately owned room I know of like that is owned by the Zanuck family.

"Calibration" by a THX designer/dealer has its benefits, but may not need to be a big deal, and it certainly does not mean that you cannot have a great THX system without his help. But there is something to be said for verification for your own piece of mind. You might be surprised at what he can bring to the party. Even if you have a receiver that does an auto calibration and room EQ process, these technologies are wrought with shortcomings. Your local guy may be able to help you catch those, and make sure that the autocal actually helps your sound rather than just change it. It is tough for the average hobbiest to drop $2K for an high-res RTA. Your local THX guy will have one and probably know how to use it. The same service can help you find the acoustically nominal location for your sub or subs. That is huge! Generating lots of bass is easy these days. Smooth, accurate bass in home theater size rooms is not. Location, location, location.

Talk to your guy and ask him a lot of questions about what he can do. If you don't like what you hear, keep looking. I bet most THX guys will be fairly dedicated to the correct process.

Forgive my soap boxing.

Cheers

[IndyKlipschFan]

Joe

I hate to sound like a know it all. BUT..

http://www.thx.com/news/20040908A.html

As you can read "The THX Certified Home Theater Program" is real, and listed on the THX site.

I spent some time asking questions and getting info on this and have brochures right in front of me.

I will errr that it is new and you did not know yet.

I also agree with the listening approach to helping people. The equipment lists can be incredible both in scope as well as detail. Most successful people busy in their lives just want, after all is said and done, a very simple to opperate system too.

The engineers and designers are supposed to bring the tricks of the trade to make rooms better. In my 3 meetings with CEDIA different businesses in Indy here locally, I have not found one I "gel" with to date. It will happen, I am sure.

When I was a kid Hi Fi Buys and other stores like it, had nice salesmen that educated and informed you as a consumer. They listened well, and helped you to get your audio dreams without pushing you to this sale product or that one. These guys were my friends a few of them still in town too.

One of the key factors of my dream of getting a Klipschorn was to get a heresey first and later when it was more practicle get the K horn. (I did, and other Klipsch too.)

My situation is different in that it is a dual purpose room too. We shall see how it all comes togther in the end I guess. I assure you it will be nice.. maybe not a certified THX room or that xyz plus!! room..LOL But I have a hunch people will still go OMG THAT is a incredible HT room!! Even better, be it an action movie, sci fi, romance, the big sports game with a lot of people and great food and drink... or cuddled up with my kids and wife watching "It's a wonderful life".. I will still cry in the end and enjoy it too. That's what it is all about.

[Joe Bagadonuts]

A tenant of Murphy's Law is that there will always be 10% who do not get the word and it will the the 10% that need it most. THX is not very good at communicating such info to dealers. Too bad, given what the training costs.

Hmm...another interesting change now that Lucasfilm has given up control.

So, what do you guys think of this "program?" (Or is that in the catagory of "Don't ask the question if you can't stand the answer?")

[Joe Bagadonuts]

I dutifully jumped on research on this subject with comrades and sources. Here's what I learned that I can tell without being killed.

It is not clear how far in development this program is. It is difficult to tell yet if it came from Marin County or the Far East. When the change occured at THX, the transition was what some might regard as a bit chaotic. They are certainly in a time of evolution. The core of good guys at Lucasfilm THX remained when the change occured, but they are in a very different situation since that change. Despite what many of us may have thought about THX, while under Lucasfilm, they were never required to make a profit. That is no longer the case. No one knows for sure what will shake out at any given time.

I learned enough about the program to agree that some things sound pretty good, but they also raise many other questions. The biggest questions are "Where will they get the specs for this? On what will they base them?" Wow, if THX wasn't controversial enough in the past, it most certainly will be now. I have a strong feeling that the announcement on the THX website is only the teaser. Clearly, the implication is that there are some "new" products in the plan. Some of this sounds very cool, but even more questions arise. When any of this will appear, I have no idea...yet.

In the end, I have to say thanks to Indy for giving me the heads up. I'll try to return the favor here.

[IndyKlipschFan]

I learned enough about the program to agree that some things sound pretty good, but they also raise many other questions. The biggest questions are "Where will they get the specs for this? On what will they base them?" Wow, if THX wasn't controversial enough in the past, it most certainly will be now.

Thats how I felt too. Now what will they (THX) require? They have an opportunity here... Say spec a A,B,C,D, sized rooms.. with equipment A,B,C,D to create a wonderful thing for a confused public if they want the THX experience?

Do you shut out speaker makers and equipment manufacturers yes, in a way, if your trying to protect your name. But also, IMO you should invite them too to be a part of it all too. Like you said a tightrope for now. We all shall see.

[colterphoto1]

Indy, congrats on a 'Great Escape'. I heard the news about nawleans that morning and was worring bout ya. Seems lots of people were going to be stranded due to lack of mass transit. Glad you got a plane, even though it was a major headache. So I called and stopped by the house- MAN YOU LOOKED TIRED! What a day! Welcome home.

yer bud, Michael

[picky]

< From our theater's "Driver's Seat"

First of all, I wish to thank you INDY for your very kind words. Knowing how involved you have become in the hobby, not only from your description in this thread, but from "knowing" you on-line as I have this past year or so, and from the photos taken in June at your place by the other members of this forum, I am completely flattered by your comments regarding my choices and expertise. Coming from you, they really mean a lot to me. Thanks.

Thanks also for the warm invitation. I hope to attend next years' Klipsch get-together if we have one and I will look forward to meeting you and to seeing your unique setup.

I also wish to extend an invitation to you to visit our place the next time you are in the Detroit area, more specifically, Allen Park (South of Detroit). We're right next door to I-94!

I completely understand where you are coming from when you speak of the live sound aspects of your home setup and its ability to reproduce live sound for vocals. You may already know that I have a professional music (I played the sax) and commercial sound reinforcement background and worked in the music business for a number of years, doing live shows in clubs, bars and small-to-medium venues.

I owned a sound company called "Sound Ideas" back in the late 1970's early 1980's. I was not affiliated with the "Sound Ideas" that produces and markets sound effect loop tracks for the industry. Esccentially, the company was myself, a 5-ton truck filled with gear and 2 roadies that worked for me part-time. I ran a Kelsey 24-channel board with 4 submaster feed for program, I ran a 12-channel Yamaha stereo board on the stage as a drum sub-mix and I had lots of Shure SM-57's, SM-58's and ElectroVoice Electret Condensor mics. In all I ran two main stacks of speakers, one on each side of the stage, and I was one of the few setups running stereo (most were mono back then). I had about 4,800 Watts per side (mostly Crown) in stereo, and quad-amped (Highs, mids, bass, sub-bass)with active crossovers. Cabinets were from EV, JBL, Community & Eastern Acoustic Works. Effects were Tapco 16-band EQ, Crown RTSA Scope, DBX-3BX, Roland Chorus Echo (I still own the thing!), Shure compressor/limiters, Eventide Clockworks Harmonizer, Lexicon Digital Reverb & Effects, and I had some parametric and 1/3-Octave equalizers which I can't remember the makes/models.

At any rate, I was pretty serious about the sound quality I was able to reproduce for the bands who hired me back then. It was always an exciting challenge to do live sound. I really enjoyed it for the most part. I made sure they always got their money's-worth.

Trouble is, have you any idea how difficult it is to set up all of that equipment and get it tweaked just right and then have an absolutley awful band take the stage and play while you struggle to sit there through their sets and continously tweak the knobs in vein trying to get one ounce of good sound out of them...only to have them blame YOU for their rotten sound at the end of the night??? That's like the worst thing ever!

------

Joe: One of the things I suspect might happen is now that Lucas is out of the picture with THX, from a consumer aspect, I see THX focusing most of its' revenue-making on fee collection from component endorsement with THX certication being a selling-point to consumers. Trouble is, as Indy suggests, with home theaters being smaller venues, from where will THX derive its "Consumer-THX benchmark"? Will they be forced to lower-the-bar in order to arrive a an obtainable/repeatable consumer-level standard? If this happens, I forsee a delusion of the importance of the THX certification in consumer-certified goods. Mainly because the gear would not live up to the THX commercial standard benchmarks and if everyone has the certifcation, it's no longer a big deal. Naturally, I pray that I am wrong and none of this actually happens.

[Tom Adams]

What scares me about this recent THX thing is will we ever see a new THX intro/trailer/surround sound thingy? Will the moo cow be the last THX demo?

Picky - back to your comments about CEDIA folks. In my research for ideas, help, etc., I've spoken to three CEDIA guys. Each one tried to talk me into something other than what I have - i.e. spend more money. Even when I told them my budget was X dollars and that all I was interested in was their services in the area of installation and calibration of the projector and possibly identifying acoustic issues with the room, they still tried to get me to purchase either a more expensive projector or additional equipment. The straw that broke the camel's back was when one guy suggested getting rid of my Klipsch's for something more "modern". Such talk is Heresy! (pun intended)

I've come to the conclusion that for many of us here who have a rather good working knowledge of A/V equipment, what we need is just another pair of eyes or a sounding board for our ideas. And if we do hire someone, we expect to be the project manager and have them do our bidding. Unfortunately, most CEDIA folks are use to being in-charge with the customer just sitting back while they run the show. At least that's the way I perceive them to be. The two other CEDIA folks I spoke to acted as if they weren't interested at all in doing a job where I would be in-charge.

Tom

[IndyKlipschFan]

I've come to the conclusion that for many of us here who have a rather good working knowledge of A/V equipment, what we need is just another pair of eyes or a sounding board for our ideas. And if we do hire someone, we expect to be the project manager and have them do our bidding.

Wow those lines spoke VOLUMES to me too.

Take away my dream system of what I want to listen to in my Klipsch Heritage theater with the new THX subs and Amp.... Heresey to me too.

[picky]

Tom: That's a very interesting account and it tends to reflect what I, INDY and Joe have experienced. I got the feeling that the rep was interesting only in open-ended budgets, and satisfying his own requirements. That doesn't mean all CEDIA reps are like that. But, it seems as though our collective experience shows that the reps we have met thus-far are far-less than customer-focused. In short, these particular reps seem rather "snooty" to me. No thanks.

Has anyone else out there had a more-positive experience dealing with CEDIA Representatives? Let's hear from you, please.

[Joe Bagadonuts]

Tom,

Your concerns sound like the first two paragraphs of my first post on this thread. Retail is king...unfortuntely. Your other needs in your room are not easy money-makers for them and require investing in training and tools. I used to have a loose affiliation with a local dealer who would have responded to you in exactly the same way. They were entirely incapable of calibration of any kind or acoustic analysis, but they would gladly sell you $30,000 in gear. I saw the writing on the wall and bailed to start my own biz.

The THX program could go any direction, but I am trying to remain hopeful. The one good bit of intel I have heard is the fielding of some new products with updated technology. One thing I would like to see come along is a reasonably priced digital room calibration/EQ device. I point blank asked a figure high at one manufacturer at CEDIA when we might see something like this. He let a bit slip, before he caught himself. I would not be surprised to see such a THX-badged device. Also, my guess is they are going to try to get the more dedicated THX designer/dealers involved in this program. There may be some criteria established, then installation, calibration, and verification accomplished by a local THX-Certified guy.

JB

[Griffinator]

Indy....

Re: your comments about "crossing the line"

I would argue that raw product sales are not falling, only the pricing (and therefore the perceived value) of the equipment is falling, and with it the average ticket (which reflects the dollar drop in sales) People are buying home theater systems in record numbers - but the systems they're buying are low-grade, inexpensive HTiB's, instead of multi-thousand dollar well-tuned systems.

The sub-$500 HTiB has literally opened a gaping wound in the perceived value of sound equipment. The general public's belief is that these systems are "good enough for me" - and frankly, it's a rather large mountain to move convincing them of otherwise.

The worst part is that the sellers of home theater equipment fail to interface with their customers - to really reach into their lifestyles - because the commission jockeys on the floor are under constant pressure to sell, then get them out (the Best Buy tactic, sadly, but I see it in small shops as well) and move on to the next one.

The "coming explosion" of which the author of the wrapup article speaks will only happen if the smaller retailers dare to change their tactics.

The smart installer takes the time with each client to really listen to their needs, listen to their desires, and patiently work them through the process of exploring options that fit those needs and desires, without pushing them, either into the contract or out the door (which, in reality, is one and the same these days - push the close too hard, lose the sale)

When people come to me to discuss options for their HT, I have adopted a simple policy that I lay out to the prospective client right up front. It does turn some people away, but the people that stay are astronomically more likely to close the deal.

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1) I am not Best Buy, or Circuit City, or Sears, or Wal-Mart. I do not sell what they sell, and will not do so just to play pricing games. If you are bent on beating people up for prices, I am not the person you need to talk to. My pricing is fair, and I sell quality equipment, not disposable throwaways.

2) My first and foremost goal is to provide you with the finest sound and vision you can reasonably afford. However, if your budget is $2,000 for a large screen with a surround system, I can not help you, because I refuse to compromise the integrity of my reputation by selling cheap equipment that performs according to its price point. In short, you get exactly what you pay for in audio and video equipment, and as I said before, I sell quality, not disposability.

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Like I said, there are a lot of people that shut down right there and the conversation ends.

Once I get a working showroom up and running, that number will decline, because the number one focus of my showroom will be to demonstrate the difference between the garbage HT being sold in these chain stores and the equipment I sell.

[Joe Bagadonuts]

Well said.

[htxpert]

QUOTE

Indyklipschfan said

"THX approved speakers by themselves mean diddly squat, unless your room is "calibrated" by an THX Installer to be an "approved"

[Joe Bagadonuts]

Ray,

Is your email address that is linked to your home page up to date?

[picky]

I think that Griff is right on in what he said. Especially the mention of the HTiB systems. IMO: All kidding asside, these consumers are convinced that buying a Bose is moving up to the top of the ladder. And, I suppose that is true, given the appliance store they are standing in. They don't stand a chance against those selling "snake oil".

Edit: Although, I don't think I would recite Griff's chapter-and-verse thing to a prospective customer, it does provde a solid basis for Mission Statement.

[skonopa]

----------------

On 9/21/2004 7:47:44 AM picky wrote:

I think that

Griff

is right on in what he said. Especially the mention of the HTiB systems. IMO: All kidding asside, these consumers are convinced that buying a Bose is moving up to the top of the ladder.

----------------

I still throught it was funny when I was talking to this one guy and I mentioned I had a high-end home-theater setup. The first thing out of his mouth was "Oh, you must have Bose!". I'd try to tell him what I had was much, much better than Bose, but he would not believe me, thinking that there is nothing that was better than Bose! I even offered to let him follow me over to my house and give him a listen to my setup, but he refused.

Yeah, I've never had the oppurtunity to consult with a custom installer, as I've always been one of those "If I want to get something done right, I might as well do it myself" types. I've setup my own system and calibrated myself, and I got the results I am happy with. I knew what I basically wanted, and thankfully, I had a decent dealer nearby that let me try things out until I was satisfied with the results. The end result is an excellent sounding system that should last me for many years. Yeah, I still like to upgrade the pre/pro, but for now, what I got does plenty fine. However, when I do get a new TV, I'll most certainly get an ISF technition to come out and calibrate it for me.

Also to add: This is pretty cool. I found a local outfit that will do both ISF video calibration as well as HAA home-theater acoustic analysis and optimizations. When I get my new HDTV, I'll have to give these guys a call. A full calibration (both video and audio) will run about $600.