ER's HT (in progress)

[edwardre]

Good day! Finally shot a few pics of my HT to show Chris Robinson how the Belle turned out after 're-grilling' from cane to black cloth.

Submitted for your perusal. Hopefully the 'upload' process worked. Please critique! I welcome any and all suggestions on component placement, equip, etc. A few notes:

1. Yes, yes, I know, the K-horns are not 'cornered'. I have the intention to build false walls for the 'roomward' sides. These are currently sealed however with 3/4" plywood and the result is IMHO...very good.

2. The screen is not quite complete. I need to frame it still. Currently quite high on the to-do list. It is simply a 10'x5' frame of 2"x2"s with canvas painted 'absolute white'. One of these days a Dalite will take it's place, but that's a ways off.

3. The rears are not shown. They are small-ish Tannoy studio monitors. They hold their own to some degree, but the very next upgrade is to replace these with Fortes (1's). I have received a purchase authorization from the CFO and need to stike while the iron is hot before she changes her mind!

Apologies for the less than stellar picture quality.

Ed

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Ed

Fronts: Pre-1955 Klipschorns (slightly modified)

Center: 1984 Klipsch Belle

Sub: Klipsch KSW200

Surrounds: Tannoy PSM6.5's

Receiver: Denon AVR1701

Video: InFocus LP350 DLP front projector

Satellite: DishNetwork 4722 (DD5.1)

DVD: Panasonic A320

S-VHS: Panasonic PV-S7670

LaserDisc: Pioneer CDL-406

CD: Kenwood CD-404 5-Disc Changer

EQ (for CD player only): Furman E151X2

Protection: Furman AV1215 Power Condition/Voltage Reg

[Tom Adams]

Hey Ed! Looks like you're well on your way for a very simple & clean HT. Your K-Horns have me curious...is that some kinda add-on trim/moulding on them?? I noticed your sig says "slightly modified", care to elaborate? And finally, how deep or far away from the screen do you sit?

Thanks for the photos!!

Tom Adams

[edwardre]

Well....with regards to the K-Horns, it's very hard to get reliable history on the various iterations from the late '40s early '50s timeframe. Maybe a Klipsch moderator or historian can lend some wisdom. I date them as 'pre-55's' because I received a excerpt from Elso Kwak from the 'Dope from Hope' publication that describes what components were used in K-Horns at what date. My horns have the Stephens Trusonic 103LX2's for the woofer, University SAHF's for the mids and University 4401 Mid-T tweeters. All this in tandem with the K500-5000 network. The components have labels that read "Tested and Approved by Klipsch and Associates". According to 'Dope', the K500-5000 was only used until '55. Both the University's were used from '51 - about '60 and the Stephens is listed as being used from '40 - '50. So in reality, they are probably of somewhere around '51 vintage.

The top section is not removable from the bottom or 'bass bin' portion and they are a few inches narrower than current model K-Horns. I have an old Klipsch pamphlet from that time period that shows three models of K-Horn as well as several models of shorthorns. The three models of K-Horns are as folows: 1 looks very similar to what we currently associate visually when we hear mention of Klipschorn. The second looks vagely familiar to the ones that I have, they are one piece and unfinished. The 3rd model listed is a bass bin with a sectoral horn mounted naked on top. The model numbers as I recall (I'm at work not at home so I don't have the pamphlet in front of me) go something like Model B, C, and D respectively. Someone once told me long ago that he felt mine were model A's or KLA's. But I also know that during that time, Klipsch did some custom builds as well. Would be interested to know if anybody has ever seen or has a set of Khorns that looks like these.

The 'slightly modified' refers to Altec 511B horns (and about 50lbs of putty per) replacing the Klipsch fiberglass sectoral horns that these were originally outfitted with. I hope to duplicate the effect(more glorious and spacious sound than the straight horn) in my center Belle (see post Belle Mod Question below).

Finally, seating is approx 14 feet from the screen.

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Ed

Fronts: Pre-1955 Klipschorns (slightly modified)

Center: 1984 Klipsch Belle

Sub: Klipsch KSW200

Surrounds: Tannoy PSM6.5's

Receiver: Denon AVR1701

Video: InFocus LP350 DLP front projector

Satellite: DishNetwork 4722 (DD5.1)

DVD: Panasonic A320

S-VHS: Panasonic PV-S7670

LaserDisc: Pioneer CDL-406

CD: Kenwood CD-404 5-Disc Changer

EQ (for CD player only): Furman E151X2

Protection: Furman AV1215 Power Condition/Voltage Reg

[eq_shadimar]

Wow very nice. I bet that sounds awesome. How do you have your projector mounted?

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FOR SALE OR TRADE COMPLETE R*3 SYSTEM FOR 3 HERESY'S

Main System -

Cornwalls (L/R main)

RC-3

RS-3's (white)

SVS 20-39CS

Harman Kardon AVR 510

Hafler P505 (running sub)

ProMedia 4.2 v400 for PC

[Colin]

very nice! now that is a theater in a home system ...

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horns, tubes, subs, leather couch & female vocalists

[jdm56]

Nice! Very interested in vintage klipschorns. I'd never seen any like yours before.

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JDMcCall

[edwardre]

Thanks all for the kind words.

Eq - The projector is not mounted as of yet. It sits behind the couch atop a black electronics/equipment cabinet that I had my electronics in prior to the big screen. Now most of that stuff sits in the horizontal cabinet up by the left K-Horn. Long term plans are to ceiling mount. I'll probably ceiling mount in a glass front enclosure because despite how any projector is marketed (quietest in the industry), I still hear the whirring of the fan. About like a PC, but still perceptable none the less.

As stated as recently as last week, I thought to replace my Tannoy rears with Fortes. Still will if the right deal comes along... like the guy who listed mint walnuts for a 'buy it now' price of $420 the other week on e-bay but sold them for $405. However, I'm now leaning towards making a set of La Scalas for the rears. I got hold of some detailed plans and it looks simplistic enough. I have a good table saw and am fair with wood. I have a spare set of all the drivers that are currently in my K-horns, except I only have one University 4401 mid-T tweeter, as well as a spare set of AA networks. Anybody out there attempted this? Are there any pitfalls you can steer me away from? Do the components seem like they will all 'git along'?

Thanks!

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Ed

Fronts: Pre-1955 Klipschorns (slightly modified)

Center: 1984 Klipsch Belle

Sub: Klipsch KSW200

Surrounds: Tannoy PSM6.5's

Receiver: Denon AVR1701

Video: InFocus LP350 DLP front projector

Satellite: DishNetwork 4722 (DD5.1)

DVD: Panasonic A320

S-VHS: Panasonic PV-S7670

LaserDisc: Pioneer CDL-406

CD: Kenwood CD-404 5-Disc Changer

EQ (for CD player only): Furman E151X2

Protection: Furman AV1215 Power Condition/Voltage Reg

[DLUngurait]

Ed,

Great lookin' set-up! There is a thread in the Updating Older Speakers section regarding DIY LaScalas.

Dave

[TheEAR]

Nice simple setup,you dont need to many watts to move lotsa air here!

May I ask is the KSW200 planty fot this setup?The room looks quite large and the K-Horns mains with the Belle as center can play at very realistic levels.How can this sub keep up? Hmmmm

Maybe you are not a bass freak like me.LOL

Good setup,simple,did not cost to much and no doubt sounds good.Very nice

TheEAR(s) Now theears

[edwardre]

Howdy TheEAR(s) - You know, I get a lot of input to that effect....simple setup. And it pretty much appears to be just that largely in part due the the amount of real estate the screen demands. Thank you! I have been striving for a 'cleaner' theatre experience.

Prior to the front projector, I had a 50" Proscan RPTV. This unit was topped with a C-7 and flanked with all the electronics in the obligatory vertical component cabinet. Next to that was the sub, then the KHorns. The whole kit-n-kabootle stuck out from the wall almost 3 feet enclosing the room by that much. It was very 'conventional home theatre' in appearance....you know, basically a cluttered wall of electronics, speakers, TV and supporting cabinetry. Even with the smoked glass cabinet doors, there were various 'light effects' from the myriad of components in the field of vision. Not at all unsightly, but at times distracting when the room lights are dimmed and you are attempting to achieve that 'movie theatre expierience' minus the crowd. The same amount of equipment still exists, but it is off to the side and the C-7 has been replaced with the Belle.

The room is roughly 20x20 and without that clutter, finally feels like it's 20x20. Believe you me, it was for this reason that I tailored my sales pitch to the missus for the projector purchase authorization and I believe that I'm beginning to see a ***** in her 'what do we need that for' armor. I guess she's happy when she has a vast expanse of floor to vacuum. I do not work for a projector company but I have to say that the front projector has been the best 'upgrade' to the HT. For $2500, not only was it responsible for transforming the perception of complex clutter to simple, but I have to say that a 10ft x 5ft viewing area makes the experience truly theatre like. It's the nuts. We're all here on the Klipsch BB because we live for the glorious sound. Now the visual is as awe inspiring as the audio.

The KSW200 is a nice little unit. I initially bought it when I went 5.1 because I needed something to play the '.1' channel. At the time of purchase Klipsch was switching over from the KSW200 to the KSW12. I bought the 12. Brought it home and tossed in Dark Side of the Moon with the rational that the opening 'heartbeat' sequence would be a fair test. The 12 did not pass the test. At moderate to semi loud volume, it didn't know if it was coming or going and started burping and bleating. I took it back to a chorus of 'I told you so' from the salesman who kept insisting that the KSW200 was waaay better. So I swapped it and put the heartbeat to it. Passed with flying colors. The KSW, Belle and pant flapping cornerhorns provide plenty of solid bass. Explosions, especially in DTS quite literally part your hair. I have trouble understanding what a 'better' sub would get me other than perhaps to 'go lower'. Aside from that, what can I expect from a 1650W LF10 say as compared to the 200W KSW? Just loudness? I listen to all kinds of music as well as the HT. Current setup goes plenty loud without distortion. I still have plenty to go on the sub volume knob should I want more, but then it sounds ridiculously over bassed. The Denon receiver is a 75W x 5 and if I turn it up more than halfway, people go running from the house with hands on ears like shot from gun. Perhaps someone can enlighten me on what I'm missing!

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Ed

Fronts: Pre-1955 Klipschorns (slightly modified)

Center: 1984 Klipsch Belle

Sub: Klipsch KSW200

Surrounds: Tannoy PSM6.5's

Receiver: Denon AVR1701

Video: InFocus LP350 DLP front projector

Satellite: DishNetwork 4722 (DD5.1)

DVD: Panasonic A320

S-VHS: Panasonic PV-S7670

LaserDisc: Pioneer CDL-406

CD: Kenwood CD-404 5-Disc Changer

EQ (for CD player only): Furman E151X2

Protection: Furman AV1215 Power Condition/Voltage Reg

[J M O N]

Ed, apparently you're not missing a single thing!

[TheEAR]

Edwardre thank for the answer

"I guess she's happy when she has a vast expanse of floor to vacuum." LOL

I wish I was into Klipsch when the KSW200 was there,the KSW300 from what I did read also has more punch than the KSW15!

20'x 20' is a large room,the KSW200 must be a great sub to keep up(volume)with the likes of the K-Horns and the Belle as center.I doubt not when you say visitors run out with ears covered!Klipsch is known for speakers with real punch and most Klipsches will play at very loud levels with almost no stress and require only a few watts!

I cant say much about some classic Klipsch speakers but if you replace the Tannoy's with horn loaded Klipsches you will enjoy total Klipsch theater.

I always match Klipsch with Klipsch and Dynes with Dynes.This week I shouldget the RF-7's,RF-5 will serve as sourround,RC-7 as...center.For now Sunfire and Revel subs will cover the lows(yes I may very well be a bass freak ).

I like the Klipsch sound for HT,even on music it can recreate the live experience.Klipsch is great value,in fact I may say there is no better value for the dollar.

I would not even go with a LF-10,the KSW200 has more punch,its sounds faster.The LF-10 is a dud,the RSW12 or 15 should be the new star subs for Klipsch.

TheEAR(s) Now theears

[TheEAR]

FYI when I said the KSW200 sounds faster then the LF-10 is because I had the LF-10 on test and the sub failed to meet the TheEAR(s) strict bass quality tests.The Sunfire Mark II bested the LF-10 in bass quality and quantity,by a wide margin.I was on my way to buy the LF-10,after the tests I was disapointed.

I only heard the KSW200 in store and remember the PUNCH the sub provided.This is confirmed by the sub being able to keep up in a 20'x20' room with serious Klipsch speakers.

I guess you sometimes get more and pay less!

TheEAR(s) Now theears

[edwardre]

TheEAR....you are right on when you suggest replacing the Tannoys with Klipsch. I actually like the sound of the Tannoys, but they have a different efficiency (95db @ 1w) which is not linear with the Klipschs, so as I adjust the master volume up, they just disappear.

Currently actively on the hunt for a decent set of Walnut (or black I guess) Forte I's as replacement. A month or so ago, there were oodles of pairs on e-bay in my price range....450 - 500. But now alas, slim pick'ins. Add to that the longer it takes to find, the more grief I receive from the CFO. She's already starting to hmmmm and hawwwww about granting permission to where I've had to 'embellish' the price range....'oh, don't worry dear, I should be able to pick up a 'fixer upper' for about $350'. Yeah right.

I've targeted the Forte I for the rears for a couple of reasons. Sonic match with the heritage series. The Forte reportedly goes low (~32hz?) and I want to be able to set all speakers to 'full range'. Size was a major 'peace keeping' consideration. Ideally, if it were up to me, there would be a set of KHorns back there. No way that would fly with Mrs Control Freak. Corns are a little less obtrusive but then I would be hit with the price issue. Heresy II's, the recommended rears for this setup would be nice, but I think that for the little extra you pay for a set of Forte I's, you will get a lot more speaker. Especially in the bass punch arena. Please let me know if any of you reading this have had problems or issues with Forte I's. From what I've read, they are tremendous and should be more than adequate for this environment. Guess I just need some reassuring.

Surprised to hear that the LF10 is a 'dud'.

Finally, a question: What is a good CD or DVD to use to evaluate speaker freq response? Certainly doesn't have to be elaborate. Just run up the freq range so I can accurately determine when the woof rolls off, mids cut in and out, etc as well as check response throughout the range?

Thanks!

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Ed

Fronts: Pre-1955 Klipschorns (slightly modified)

Center: 1984 Klipsch Belle

Sub: Klipsch KSW200

Surrounds: Tannoy PSM6.5's

Receiver: Denon AVR1701

Video: InFocus LP350 DLP front projector

Satellite: DishNetwork 4722 (DD5.1)

DVD: Panasonic A320

S-VHS: Panasonic PV-S7670

LaserDisc: Pioneer CDL-406

CD: Kenwood CD-404 5-Disc Changer

EQ (for CD player only): Furman E151X2

Protection: Furman AV1215 Power Condition/Voltage Reg

[TheEAR]

Well Edwardre is use a Stereophile TEST CD...I got with my Stereophile.Has the bass tests,midrange and high end tests.With this CD I test all the new subs to see how low with power they can go.

And some may tell you the LF-10 is great,its their opinion.I compared the LF-10 to a Sunfire Mark II and the Mark II bested the LF-10 in output and bass quality.

You should try a Sunfire sub(Mark II or Signature)I think you may like them.One thing to know the Sunfire has to be sut no higher than 60Hz to perform well.The Sunfire does not have any mid-bass thump,just sub bass.

TheEAR(s) Now theears