kingdave Posted August 2, 2005 Author Share Posted August 2, 2005 Thanks alot all you guys, your comments have been very helpful and very encouraging! dave Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dragonfyr Posted August 2, 2005 Share Posted August 2, 2005 ---------------- On <?xml:namespace prefix = st1 ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:smarttags" />7/31/2005 8:14:53 AM kev313 wrote: <?xml:namespace prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" /> ---------------- On 7/31/2005 12:51:43 AM dragonfyr wrote: ---------------- On 7/29/2005 11:08:29 PM kev313 wrote: Comparing the study habits of Chinese children to Americans is not only interesting, it is darn close to introducing a relevant response. The no belt crotch grabbing comment, however, may evidence a bit of a "generation gap".---------------- Hmmm. So it takes a different generation to see this? Or to eschew the lack of positive values generally displayed in rap and so many of the other current social manifestations? I guess I am just jealous that the artists of my ancient generation didn't partake in drive by shootings with rival bands! At least 'my' generation had the Last Poets...rap simply has b!tches and hos. And like the idiots who accused Beavis and Butthead of serving as models for kids to copy - B&B were simply reflective of what had already happened! And if you can't see this in the ghetto/prison inspired 'know what I mean' grab your crotch substitution for being able to coherently express what they mean, pointing this out is a waste of time. And it has NO bearing on what generation you are from. The values, or lack thereof, transcend generations. <?xml:namespace prefix = v ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" /> ---------------- If that was the meaning of your original post, it was not clearly articulated. By referring to baggy pants, the original post failed to differentiate between hip-hop youth culture in general as opposed to harmful manifestations of certain aspects of that culture. Failure to delineate these two things may not be indicative of your age, but failure to understand the difference is an example of a "generation gap." To be honest, I still have no idea where you stand as your second statement ("Or to eschew the lack of positive values generally displayed in rap and so many of the other current social manifestations?") is totally at odds with the remainder of your post. Notably, however, I really don't care. I would agree that age is really not determinative of one's ability to sort these things out. It does play a role, however, in your exposure to these types of issues and ability to contextualize various phenomenon. For example, if you are not referring to Corso, GInsberg, et al with your "last poets" remark, you are just dead crazy. I just "don't get" your music. See...generation gap! ---------------- I respond, not because I feel a need to defend my position, but if someone is going to take issue with what I say, at least deal with the reality of what I said!!!!!!!!!!!! I never talked about "baggy pants"!!!!!!! I referred to the pants worn so low in need of a belt or using their hands to hold them selves and their pants up! A play on words and an accurate image of 'fashion'(sic) that anyone in the last 15 years can attest to! And I use the images I chose to refer to the aspects and points I choose! Your inability to understand that makes my point no less salient. And your looking for obtuse alternative meaning reflects YOUR thinking, and NOT my point! And I don't have to delineate between anything! I referred to values as manifested in behavior! If you need delineation, write Essence, the NCBW and other groups' regarding their campaign (that I am sure you misunderstand as well) against the rap industrys glorification of violence, misogyny, drugs and pornography!! And whether there are degenerate values expressed in hip hop towards woman and other elements is moot! And I cannot help you if this is just too esoteric for you to understand! And my statement is COMPLETELY consistent! Sorry but the problem is in YOUR head! And dead crazy????? How many "Last Poets" do you know!? Oh, don't tell me, as you probably know lots of crack head would be rappers meandering around lost! Unfortunately I am not plagued by your rampant confusion, and I know exactly to whom I refer! They are Umar Bin Hassan and Abiodun Oyewole! They at least expressed legitimate and provocative issues of social and cultural concern and not merely expressions of the denigration of women and an overall lack of redeeming social value. Next time anyone wants to critique what I say, it would be nice if: 1) you address what I actually said, and not YOUR erroneous misquoting or misinterpretation! 2) and that you debate the points I address instead of turning it into a diatribe about your confusion over who the Last Poets are! Get a clue! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kev313 Posted August 2, 2005 Share Posted August 2, 2005 ---------------- On 8/2/2005 6:22:45 PM dragonfyr wrote: ---------------- On <?xml:namespace prefix = st1 />7/31/2005 8:14:53 AM kev313 wrote: <?xml:namespace prefix = o /> ---------------- On 7/31/2005 12:51:43 AM dragonfyr wrote: ---------------- On 7/29/2005 11:08:29 PM kev313 wrote: Comparing the study habits of Chinese children to Americans is not only interesting, it is darn close to introducing a relevant response. The no belt crotch grabbing comment, however, may evidence a bit of a "generation gap".---------------- Hmmm. So it takes a different generation to see this? Or to eschew the lack of positive values generally displayed in rap and so many of the other current social manifestations? I guess I am just jealous that the artists of my ancient generation didn't partake in drive by shootings with rival bands! At least 'my' generation had the Last Poets...rap simply has b!tches and hos. And like the idiots who accused Beavis and Butthead of serving as models for kids to copy - B&B were simply reflective of what had already happened! And if you can't see this in the ghetto/prison inspired 'know what I mean' grab your crotch substitution for being able to coherently express what they mean, pointing this out is a waste of time. And it has NO bearing on what generation you are from. The values, or lack thereof, transcend generations. <?xml:namespace prefix = v /> ---------------- If that was the meaning of your original post, it was not clearly articulated. By referring to baggy pants, the original post failed to differentiate between hip-hop youth culture in general as opposed to harmful manifestations of certain aspects of that culture. Failure to delineate these two things may not be indicative of your age, but failure to understand the difference is an example of a "generation gap." To be honest, I still have no idea where you stand as your second statement ("Or to eschew the lack of positive values generally displayed in rap and so many of the other current social manifestations?") is totally at odds with the remainder of your post. Notably, however, I really don't care. I would agree that age is really not determinative of one's ability to sort these things out. It does play a role, however, in your exposure to these types of issues and ability to contextualize various phenomenon. For example, if you are not referring to Corso, GInsberg, et al with your "last poets" remark, you are just dead crazy. I just "don't get" your music. See...generation gap! ---------------- I respond, not because I feel a need to defend my position, but if someone is going to take issue with what I say, at least deal with the reality of what I said!!!!!!!!!!!! I never talked about "baggy pants"!!!!!!! I referred to the pants worn so low in need of a belt or using their hands to hold them selves and their pants up! A play on words and an accurate image of 'fashion'(sic) that anyone in the last 15 years can attest to! And I use the images I chose to refer to the aspects and points I choose! Your inability to understand that makes my point no less salient. And your looking for obtuse alternative meaning reflects YOUR thinking, and NOT my point! And I don't have to delineate between anything! I referred to values as manifested in behavior! If you need delineation, write Essence, the NCBW and other groups' regarding their campaign (that I am sure you misunderstand as well) against the rap industrys glorification of violence, misogyny, drugs and pornography!! And whether there are degenerate values expressed in hip hop towards woman and other elements is moot! And I cannot help you if this is just too esoteric for you to understand! And my statement is COMPLETELY consistent! Sorry but the problem is in YOUR head! And dead crazy????? How many "Last Poets" do you know!? Oh, don't tell me, as you probably know lots of crack head would be rappers meandering around lost! Unfortunately I am not plagued by your rampant confusion, and I know exactly to whom I refer! They are Umar Bin Hassan and Abiodun Oyewole! They at least expressed legitimate and provocative issues of social and cultural concern and not merely expressions of the denigration of women and an overall lack of redeeming social value. Next time anyone wants to critique what I say, it would be nice if: 1) you address what I actually said, and not YOUR erroneous misquoting or misinterpretation! 2) and that you debate the points I address instead of turning it into a diatribe about your confusion over who the Last Poets are! Get a clue! ---------------- Ok, I guess I can critique that. When you state, "I never talked about "baggy pants"!!!!!!! I referred to the pants worn so low in need of a belt or using their hands to hold them selves and their pants up! A play on words and an accurate image of 'fashion'(sic) that anyone in the last 15 years can attest to!", I think we are actually referring to the same thing, so no misunderstanding there. Perhaps my term was not descriptive enough to communicate that point. My apologies. I'm not looking for obtuse interpretations of your statement. I'm pointing out what appears to be oversimplification of one element of pop culture on your part. That is further reinforced when you state, "Oh, don't tell me, as you probably know lots of crack head would be rappers meandering around lost!" I will certainly grant you that that was not the thrust of your original post. It was, nonetheless, one I took offense to. Your original post wasn't too "esoteric" for me. Its conclusions were too simplistic. You make much of your scientific principles in other posts. Why not apply some of that rigorous logic to your commentaries of the liberal arts? My post wasn't a diatribe about lost poets. That was an illustration as to how people can disagree as to the relative merits of an artist's work and how that disagreement might be, in part, based on age. The "dead crazy" comment was tongue in cheek. Thought that was obvious. I must say that your, in my opinion, in your short time on this forum, you have shown yourself to be quite the ***. Your posts, in general, seem to be a delicate blend of vitriol and an "I'm smarter than you" attitude. Not very attractive. If you want to debate an issue, that's fine. It is not necessary to include the personal comments. Don't jump to conclusions about who I am and my ability to comprehend your rants. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jheis Posted August 3, 2005 Share Posted August 3, 2005 Dragonfyr: What Kev said in his last paragraph. What do crap $8 shoes have to do with anything - other than to prove my point? And, in case I missed something, when did Demming go to China? If you are going to critique my posts, at least have the courtesy to respond to what I've said. By the way, kingdave (to get back to the original topic), congrats on a good purchase. Hope it serves you well. James Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kingdave Posted August 3, 2005 Author Share Posted August 3, 2005 wow... how did my original post turn into this conversation? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
getech Posted August 3, 2005 Share Posted August 3, 2005 King Dave, The Denon 3300 is a very hearty receiver and should run your Klipsch quite nicely. Enjoy your new purchase!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrearlygold Posted August 6, 2005 Share Posted August 6, 2005 ---------------- On 7/28/2005 4:19:02 PM dragonfyr wrote: ---------------- On 7/28/2005 2:20:57 AM jheis wrote: ...some Chinese made piece of crap James ---------------- Interesting. And too often complete nonsense. Let's start by asking who's buying and who's selling! But in any case, you might want to get used to it! By 2010 they will have the world's largest economy and control over 50% of the world's manufacturing. And judging from the many Chinese with whom I routinely speak and with whom I have worked, they aren't having trouble getting their kids to study nor to hold their pants up with a belt instead of a hand to their crotch! Nor do their teachers fear them in their classroom! ---------------- Obviously you're so mesmerized by the Chinese you probably won't understand what I'm writing but having a lot of experience in Asia I can tell you that the huge growth there is every bit hinged on the fact that the US continues it's march into idiocy, laziness and socialism whereas the Chinese, Vietnamese etc are trying to break OUT of certainly the socialism. Far as the education, as in any other socialist system, everything seems great from a symbolic point of view, however substantively, the system is designed to dumb down more than anything. I can't tell you how many job applicants I have had in both China and Vietnam who for example claimed various talents on their application but when asked a simple question, looked back at me like a deer in a set of headlights would. The traditional cultures are also disappearing, especially in China, and sure to catch up in Vietnam. It's a shame as that is one of the most endearing qualities in Asians in Asia is the traditional values. Communism has indeed taken it's toll however and now with the added confusion of trying to break free, there are changes which are less than positive. This is a subject that is interesting to me and having residences in both places ( Vietnam although I travel the region, and US ) affords me a viewpoint that most don't have. But absolutely know that the continued downward direction the US has been and is heading in has more of a part to play than some alleged Asian superiority and that's for sure. Now, anyone have a pair of CF-3's to sell me? Please? Tom Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrearlygold Posted August 6, 2005 Share Posted August 6, 2005 Obviously you're so mesmerized by the Chinese you probably won't understand what I'm writing but having a lot of experience in Asia I can tell you that the huge growth there is every bit hinged on the fact that the US continues it's march into idiocy, laziness and socialism whereas the Chinese, Vietnamese etc are trying to break OUT of certainly the socialism. Far as the education, as in any other socialist system, everything seems great from a symbolic point of view, however substantively, the system is designed to dumb down more than anything. I can't tell you how many job applicants I have had in both China and Vietnam who for example claimed various talents on their application but when asked a simple question, looked back at me like a deer in a set of headlights would. The traditional cultures are also disappearing, especially in China, and sure to catch up in Vietnam. It's a shame as that is one of the most endearing qualities in Asians in Asia is the traditional values. Communism has indeed taken it's toll however and now with the added confusion of trying to break free, there are changes which are less than positive. This is a subject that is interesting to me and having residences in both places ( Vietnam although I travel the region, and US ) affords me a viewpoint that most don't have. But absolutely know that the continued downward direction the US has been and is heading in has more of a part to play than some alleged Asian superiority and that's for sure. Now, anyone have a pair of CF-3's to sell me? Please? Tom Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrearlygold Posted August 6, 2005 Share Posted August 6, 2005 This is a subject that is interesting to me and having residences in both places ( Vietnam although I travel the region, and US ) affords me a viewpoint that most don't have. But absolutely know that the continued downward direction the US has been and is heading in has more of a part to play than some alleged Asian superiority and that's for sure. Now, anyone have a pair of CF-3's to sell me? Please? Tom Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrearlygold Posted August 6, 2005 Share Posted August 6, 2005 Sorry for the multiple duplications. Jeeez. Keyboard stutter? Tom Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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