M.H Posted October 27, 2001 Share Posted October 27, 2001 Hello.. Finally!!!!!!!!!... Yesterday i bought a pair of La Scala's As u can imagine i'm very happy with it. The only problem i have now is the rest of my equipment. I still use pritty "simple" components. My amplifier is a pioneer 906 digital 5.1 and the cd player is also a medium quality pioneer. This results in a huge differends between my La Scala test and the sound i have now at home. At the test they used a tube and a transistor amplifier. The speed of those speakers really amazed me. The low part was so detailled..really impresive. Now at home it sounds a bit muddy and "dark?"..like there is a cloth over the speakers.. And not that spectactulair at all.. Because i know the La Scala's really need a good match i want to ask u what is a good amplifier for me . I like a fresh detailed and fast sound. I heard a tube on this speakers and i liked the sound,i only missed the speed in the low and high a bit. La Scala owners pls give me some help. Greetings M.H Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J M O N Posted October 27, 2001 Share Posted October 27, 2001 You might also want to evaluate your CD player. If it is an old unit, it may be part of the problem. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M.H Posted October 28, 2001 Author Share Posted October 28, 2001 Yes indead. I shall replace my cd player also someday. But for now i have just enough money to buy a serious amplifier. Dont forget i have just bought the La Scala also =). They are pretty expensive here in Holland. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Klewless Posted October 28, 2001 Share Posted October 28, 2001 M.H My suggestion to you would be to spend your money on quality, not power. A really good 30 watt amp should be sufficient unless, of course, you intend to entertain the whole neighboorhood! My opinion on tube vs solid state is that neither is perfect and that both can deliver excellent sound if of good quality. I am currently using an old Nakamichi transistor receiver and am perfectly happy with the match (I have both La Scala and home made K-horns). I have owned tubes in the past and, for what it is worth, I do not miss the tube microphonics, hiss and hum that I got from tubes. You really need to listen to any amps you intend to buy at home in your own environment and choose what sounds good to you. Hype can easily lead you down the wrong road. Keep an open mind. Good luck. I am sure that in time you will find good electronics to run your system. Remember quality not quantity. ------------------ John P St Paul, MN Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soundog Posted October 28, 2001 Share Posted October 28, 2001 I'm having good success with the combination of a tube pre-amp and transistor amp. The tubes do a great job with the mids and highs and the transistors provide the oomph needed for the lows. HT-1 Klipsch Heritage System (music oriented) Klipschorns w/ ALK crossover upgrades 4 Klipsch LaScalas (surround & rears) Heresy components in custom cabinet /monitor stand (center) Panasonic 32 Monitor W/ component video input 3 Sony CX400 CD changers Sony CX-240 CD Changer MSB Technology Digital Director w/ jitter reduction Nirvis DXS digital controller (auto selection of whatever changer is playing) Nirvis Slink-e computer interface Nirvis jukebox software (downloads net cd info, album covers& lyrics- programs & controls changers searchable for songs, artists, albums). Nirvis CDJ (CD Jukebox Software) Monster 5000 Power Center Sony Viao Laptop Computer Sony S530D DVD Player Sony 798HF VCR Sony XA1ES CD player Sherwood HX-PRO dual cassette deck Dynaco PAS4 stereo preamp W/ Tesla Tube upgrades (also outputs to HT2) Technics SL3300 DD Turntable w/ Shure cartridges Outlaw 1050 6.1 A/V Receiver (Dynaco inputs directly to amp section) Perpetual Technologies P1A Digital Correction Engine (jitter reduction, 16 to 24 bit conversion, future speaker frequency correction, and room acoustic correction ) Perpetual Technologies P3A DAC ( plus 44.1k to 96k CD upsampling) Klipsch KSW-15 sub (for DVD LFEs ) Klipsch LF-10 sub Phillips Pronto TS2000 Programmable Remote Scientific American Explorer 2000 Home Communications Terminal X10 computerized lighting controls Radio Shack Wireless Remote Control Extender Cables: Onix , MSB, Monster, AR., Iced Purple, RS Gold Monster Bi-wire speaker cables.(Khorns) HT#2 Klipsch THX System (movie oriented) 4 Klipsch KT-LCR THX Speakers 4 Klipsch RS-3s (side & rear surround) 2 Klipsch KT-DS THX Surrounds 10 Linaem Tweeters Outlaw 1050 6.1 A/V Receiver (Dynaco inputs directly to amp section) Monster 3000 Power Center Sony X111 ES CD Player Sony 775HF VCR Sony STR-G3 (supplemental amplification for extra speakers) Toshiba 61 High Definition TV Sony NS700 Progressive Scan DVD Toshiba 4205 DVD/ CD Changer Klipsch SW-12II Sub Klipsch LF-10 sub Sony AV2100 remote Scientific American Explorer 2000 Home Communications Terminal X10 Computerized Lighting Vibrapods (vibration isolation) RS Gold , Monster, Iced Purple, AR Cables Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M.H Posted October 29, 2001 Author Share Posted October 29, 2001 quote: You really need to listen to any amps you intend to buy at home in your own environment and choose what sounds good to you. Hype can easily lead you down the wrong road. Keep an open mind. Thx..but thats exactly what i had in mind.. I buy the amp what gives me the best sound in my opinion. I really dont know if it will be a tube ore not.. But i really hope that the sound will become much better than i have now. The sound i have now is so differend than the sound i heard with the test.(and they used a tube for the test). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M.H Posted October 29, 2001 Author Share Posted October 29, 2001 quote: I'm having good success with the combination of a tube pre-amp and transistor amp. The tubes do a great job with the mids and highs and the transistors provide the oomph needed for the lows. So if i get u right a tube will give me less low? I thought that a good tube will IMPROVE the low This message has been edited by M.H on 10-29-2001 at 11:30 AM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ray Garrison Posted October 29, 2001 Share Posted October 29, 2001 I can't stress strongly enough how important it is to try out any amplifier you're considering using with the La Scalas before you make a final decision. The La Scalas, and the other Klipsch Heritage line, are much, much more sensitive than almost any other speakers. Because of this, an amplifier driving one of these speakers is operating in a different portion of its "power envelope" than it would when driving other speakers. I have found it is very difficult to predict how an amplifier will sound when you are operating the amplifier at a (comparitively) very, very low power output. Amps that sound very, very good when pushing 50 or 100 watts into some other speaker may not sound good when they're pushing 1/100 or 1/10 of a watt into a La Scala. The low level distortion and noise characteristics are frequently quite a bit different than they are at high power. I've tried a LOT of different amps with my La Scalas, and I found that the best sounding amp I've heard to date is an older Rotel integrated amp, the RA-850BXII. This was made sometime around 1985, and I think it's rated on the order of 30 watts/channel or so. I used to use this as a "backup" amp, and I've heard it driving B&W 801F, Theil CS3.5, Acoustic Energy AE-1, Klipsch Epic CF4, and several other speakers. It did not work very well with ANY of those - the high end was kind of harsh and "thin" sounding, and the bass was not very well controlled. However, into the La Scalas, it's a WONDERFUL amplifier. It sounds better than the Krell KAV300i, the Jolida SJ502, the Acurus DIA-100 mk II, a TEAC integrated, an older NAD preamp / B&K ST140 amp combo, and any other amps I've tried. I have no idea why this is true - I suspect it has something to do with the way the output transistors are biased, and the linearity of their transfer function at lower power levels, but that's just a guess. I found this out only by experimentation. With Heritage series Klipsch, more than with any other speakers, it is tremendously important that you try before you buy. The same sorts of things are true with speaker cables, by the way... the La Scalas make different cables sound more different than any other speakers I've owned, but that's a topic for another thread... Ray ------------------ Music is art Audio is engineering Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M.H Posted October 31, 2001 Author Share Posted October 31, 2001 WOW!!!..Ray..can u read my mind? U say exactly what i had figured out with a friend A friend of me has also a pair of La Scala's,and although he has a impresive audio set the sound is not so detailed and fast like i heard with the test. So what did he do? He used his headphone-line of the cd player as a line-out and turned the vollume level down.. Now he could turn the level up on his amplifier and indead.. It sounded much better..more dynamic.. So just like u said most amplifiers just dont work at such low levels..(he has a pioneer A-09). Anyway..tomorrow i get a tube for a test.. So i am really looking forward to that.. I whas so disapointed that my amplifier created such a sad sound on the La Scala's.. This tube should create a huge smile on my face. Thx for this reply.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cruzer Posted October 31, 2001 Share Posted October 31, 2001 MH, can you tell me from where exactly did your speakers? I am in Germany, and so far I have not being able to find a Klipsch dealer. ------------------ Cruzer Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colin Posted October 31, 2001 Share Posted October 31, 2001 MH, I am wondering from your description if the room, where you have the big old horns, is too small or if they are too close to the walls - have you played with their posistion? ------------------ Cornwalls & Klipsch subs; leather couch & feet up; lights out & tubes glowing! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M.H Posted November 1, 2001 Author Share Posted November 1, 2001 quote: MH, can you tell me from where exactly did your speakers? I am in Germany, and so far I have not being able to find a Klipsch dealer I have found my speakers in Belgium.. They are used ))..so i saved a lot of money.. If u want i can give u a URL from some one in Germany who has also a pair of La Scala's for sale.. They are wood collor.. First i wanted to buy those pair in Germany (i thought they where 5400,-),but then i saww those in Belgium.. They where very cheap.. Just let me know if u are intrested.. If u still want to buy them new i can give u a dealer here in Holland,but then u have to pay around the 12.000,-.. They have raized the price and u will have to wait till March before u can get them. This message has been edited by M.H on 11-01-2001 at 12:38 AM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M.H Posted November 1, 2001 Author Share Posted November 1, 2001 quote: Originally posted by Colin: MH, I am wondering from your description if the room, where you have the big old horns, is too small or if they are too close to the walls - have you played with their posistion? Well..my room aint that big indead. My room is 9m deep and 5.20 m width.. I have placed the speakers on the long side of the wall.. So i am listening 3.5 m from my sepakers.. The distance between the speakers is around the 2.5 m i think.. Maybe 3 m maximium... I have placed them on spikes (but i know now that the spikes are to small). If i want i can move the couch 1 m more to the backwall.. So then there is 4.5 m between me and the speakers. Moving around aint a option because my girlfriend aint that happy with the speakers. We had to change the whole room before we could place those huge monsters.. Unfortunally there aint much distance between the speaker and the backwall.. I have turned the speakers to the hotspot so there is a triangle formed space between the wall and speaker.. But i have placed them almost against the wall.. But i thought this doesnt really matter because of the horns? I mean..when u use a bassreflex system then u have to create some space between the spekares and wall.. But not with the horntype??. Greetings M.H Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dubai2000 Posted November 1, 2001 Share Posted November 1, 2001 M.H the first time I ever listened to the La Scala was in a room rather similar to yours. The speakers were perhaps slightly more apart than your 2.5 m but not much. The gentleman had them right in front of the back wall and still the sound was absolutely unbelievable. I don't think at all that your room is too small but of course experimenting with the position of your sofa might add something to your listening experience (and I don't know about your spikes). Still in your situation I'd rather concentrate on a different amp/CD player. Of course tubes is one way to go (see other recent threads) but I am quite happy with my vintage SS McIntosh gear which in comparison wasn't too outrageously priced. So try a variety of amps and feel happy that at least when it comes to speakers you'll probably be settled for life Wolfram BTW: and don't forget Al Klappenberger's x-overs, now THAT will certainly add a new dimension to your La Scala! This message has been edited by dubai2000 on 11-01-2001 at 05:53 AM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M.H Posted November 1, 2001 Author Share Posted November 1, 2001 quote: BTW: and don't forget Al Klappenberger's x-overs, now THAT will certainly add a new dimension to your La Scala What does that mean??? I have a new type of Scala's so i thought my x-over whas alright? Ore is there a better type? Anyway,i know that my biggest problem now is my amp. It's just a "simple" pioneer 906 5.1 digital and it cant handle these baby's. Yesterday i visit a friend who also owned the Scala's and it sounded so much differend then with me.. And the only real differend we have in set up is the amp.. So tonight i will hear them play finnaly ok (i hope). I will let u know Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dubai2000 Posted November 1, 2001 Share Posted November 1, 2001 M.H Al Klappenberger is a BB member who has developed a new x-over network for some speakers of the Heritage line. From all that has been written here on this forum they are highly esteemed by their owners. Myself I used to like my '73 Khorns with the original AA x-overs, but Al's are ever so much better. If you search this forum under ALK crossover you'll find enough threads to make you start saving again (after you got a new amp/CD player) Wolfram BTW: check under: www.alkeng.com/ to find out more about Al's work. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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