thirdeye

Plus Clamps are much more effective and easy to use if you want to experiment with Solid tables vs. suspended.

Well from my stint with the ES1 its a good table, and mint thats a resonable price, the stock arm aint great thats for sure, but also I have spoke with some Arm dealers and they suggest against the Rega arm with Spring suspension tables, I don't think you see to many Linns with rega arms either, but yeah the Linn arm would be a decent choice on the ES1.. Beyond that its a great little table if set up right, but more than likely will beg you to tweak and play with many ideas on clamps, new platter, mats, Cartridge selection and etc... Also I have replaced wiring with Cardas all the way to the preamp and absolutly made big advances in making the phono hum near non-existant and everything especially bass deeper, cause some of the wire is so thin and cheap stock that they get some crosstalk being so close on the cartridge sometimes, but thats my experiance... However at more money I found The Solid plater Tables with external motors Far superior to floating(bouncing on springs, even with upgraded springs) like the Linn and AR tables.

Horrible Combination, and Horrible price (1500.00) for the pair, okay not horrible price but pretty normal and nothing great. I have owned several combos with 7's they are definatly not an easy to run 2 channel speaker, but with subs and surround sound are excellent, and would work okay with denon in this case, thats as far as I will go.

The problem with the old classic Discwasher system is it can end up pushing dirt and refuse DEEPER into the grooves. I think some of the other brushes do a better job regarding this liability. I still have my old Discwasher from years ago but dont use it anymore. Nothing beats a quality record vacuum and if you DO have a ton of vinyl and buy used often, it's worth the investment. I've had a VPI HW-16 for over 20 years and besides replacing the wand and dealing with the subsonic sound when engaged, it's been a great cost effective investment. Can be found on the used market but unfortunately, is not that much discounted over the new if you find a good deal online. kh 100% nothing can do it better and make vinyl quieter if it is possible in the first place to eliminate any excess surface noise on the album, than a vacuume machine completly removing everything in the grove... You could scrub all day and losen stuff on the vinly and wipe dry or let the deposites dry on their own right back on the vinyl and it will never do you any good without sucking the stuff off it. Also this high power vacuume removal nearly eliminates excess Static and handling the album, unless you over vacuume it of course. out of convinence and safty of the vinyl its worth the cost of the machine, I don't care how anybody wants to argue it, its sweet! And not only that, but the MAJOR side benifit of the extreme vacuume removal and leaving no deposites behind is what Most people do not think about this is not only saving your vinyl and making it sound superior but your Super pricey stylus is not running thru picking up little hairs, and dust wearing it out even faster, for example almost everytime I used to play vinyl before having the machine all kinds of little stuff would collect at the tip of the stylus you could see with the naked eye no less.. With the cleaned vinyl that is vacuumed this would only occur is something falls out of the environement which does happen, while its playing. Far less dirty equipment in the end. Disc washer velvet type brush is the best, you can get the Clones from Musicdirect.com in chicago and they are the exact same ones, might be cheaper I think, I have a few of them and you can get the replacement velvet pads for like 2 packs at 4.00 or something as well.

I'll give my 2 cents here. There is a school of thought that a speaker should produce quality sound an octave below and above auditory limits of the human ear (although that is a pesky thing to make the same for all folks). My experince has been that it is reasonable to do so and that there 'seems' to be some difference when folks do so. I try to design my listening rooms for just that and I am quite pleased. So if 40 hz is as low as a grooved piece of vinyl gets, then the 20 hz meets my octave rule (in this case an octave below the reasobaly produced lower limit). Yeah I need another room down the road to tighten everything up no doubt, but hey its good when it works just forcing to work! Just kidding, Hey vinyl only gets down to 40 hz in general? Cause I know that without a subsonic filter in the phono stage you hear all the like 18 hz and below surface noise sometimes, just simply from the needle running in the grove and picking it up, but I had a phono amp with my klipsch that would Kick the hell out of the woofers bouncing them in and out of the cabinet pretty violently untill I added a phono stage with subsonic filter built in.. Who knows.

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Well the room as it sits is 29ft X 15ft... Level tested at is whatever the recording can produce and sound pretty "Live", so if its a type of music that demands more I give it more, if its peter gabriel clean type fairly balanced recording that sounds smooth at a certain volume then thats what I play it at dont need to drive it ... Do I use any equipmentto measure ? No, but I do have a Rat shack db meter and only use that to set up my surround system via white noise.

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One final question - as I understand it you are planning to use this new setup for music listening. Is the ability to go down below 20 Hz important in your opinion for music? Max, This is just a Spec. in the end, but what I find important is to not have restriction in the end, so why not? Especially Knowing it is possible to get some frequencys we miss on recordings due to limited bandwith. As to the comment on "Best Value in Audio Today" I would not have ever seen myself spending this kinda money honestly, But facts are the Pile of parts alone are worth more than 90% of the speakers retail out there being sold to you in general.. I did not pay close to retail on these either, but even at 4500.00 a piece with amps taking care of the 40hz and below with the capabilities of a speaker like this not even talking about the incredible quality finish on them and 14 custom drivers(and being larger 10" for the most part) total doing what they do, not to mention the fact No there is no crossover costs involved but No crossover is better than ANy thing you could put in the path of the wire and drivers in existance anyway. I say yeah they are a great value in this audioworld.

Maxg, Yeah you never know the true end! But Balanced to me is the bottom end fills in as much as the Horn, so it is not screaming at low levels with no bass presence. Now that being said the HERITAGE are far better in general including the Cornwalls, I however found NO matter What klipsch speaker was used I always need to boost the bass via tone controls to "balance" them out in general, I did this with my other preamp a Mcintosh with 5 band EQ... KIipsch has many potentials in general no doubt, but common guys if you think they are the most controled speaker I'm sorry its not true, but they are A rockin fun speaker if you can keep them from going over the top bright at high levels to get the Bass drivers moving is all. K-horns ARE far less Raw and aggressive sounding to me than the rest, Cornwalls are not bad but it is a bit of a tuff speaker to setup if you want to talk about "correct"... Not thats not a good solid design and sounds like crap but I guess if you are in the position that I ended up in at a near 25,000 system then I guess you might ask for more too.. I am sure many of you guys have that much in collected gear and several systems, but for me I like one system to deal with and do not keep spares around as many guys do, (I do have a surround system) but I don't think that counts as many here would agree...

No not really , but okay...

No maybe not PSG, I might post more cause I still have all klipsch surround sound in another room.

Great point Dean. Umm, not sure of the point accept yeah they beat the very close priced K-horns too, but okay?

snicker ......[] wuzzzer, I hear ya!!! but I got em' for free so guess what!?! I aint taken a chance buddy

Yup the "Kiss" theory (keep it simple Stupid) Paper drivers

RF35's, but yes my friend has upgraded 3's and they were more punchy in the bass. the cornwalls are probably more warm or organic, but not as dynamic sounding. In my opinion I had to run my Corn's angled in the corner just like K-horns to get the full sound and bass, but loss of Soundstage was of course a problem doing that and they are simply just Short height wise.... So having 3 series out in the room a couple feet gave More of a high-end sound with depth and 3d with voice and things that were at a loss with the cornwalls. But I am sure in certain configurations some of this could be corrected. Sorry but the 3's set up correctly are a great speaker used for a few hundred.

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Hmm, if you can live without remote, and want to deal with tube rolling then it could work very well. But then again very few tube amps are stable to 2 ohm, so I really doubt this unit would be.

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Sorry, but I think everyone here A' either works for klipsch or B' is truly in the belief these are the return of christ... Look at this, 1988 an average threshold Amp would run you around 3000.00, a Pass labs amp today at about the same level will cost you around 3000.00.. And Yes the newer amp is more advanced with finer parts and basically will be what it is. 1985 mcintosh preamp, 2000.00, 2005 (today) easily could get a mcintosh preamp for 2000.00 again with better parts, newer toys, remote etc still 2 channel.... 1990 top of the line Sony ES player, 3000.00, Today far more advanced Sony player, Not to mention SACD 3000.00 ? Okay now lets take some speakers, anybody's except klipsch... Because yes they are about the only company I can quote has doubled their price on something like the K-horns in like 20 years, Cerwin VEGA, lets say, they have a model with a 15" woofer , 3 way late 80's early 90's easily right around 1000.00 a pair, okay lets take todays vega 15" model, better crossovers, advanced drivers, decent cabinets, how much at the local best buy? 286.00 a piece!!...and they are 102db efficient, and not to mention 86lbs a piece, so very comprable to the size of the CW's and this is not to say vegas are great, but it is a popular model all you guys have seen, and very easily close to the same amount of money put into the CWIII.... I posted a pic just for fun Look at ANY speaker manufacture and find if one single model made popular by them has gone up by much more than 15%, again accept Klipsch. A merridian Speaker system that was like 5000.00 in 1992 is still like 5000.00 in 2005.. SNELL, Polk, Top of the line Infinitys, JBL, they are all within the same pricing for their newer models that are similar to the old ones. Look at Surround Receivers too, top dollar stuff can be had for around 1000.00 all day and night from several manufacturers, and back 15 years ago, sure you could buy a top 2 channel receiver or pro-logic unit, sometimes without a remote for around that money, now you get a ton of stuff and 7 channels. Look at DVD, HDTV, VCR's started out far more expensive than todays top DVD players. this stuff is suppose to compete to some extent and reduce in price as technology gets advanced in someways, but if people are willing to shell out just for the hell of it then yes klipsch or anyone else will rob you blind. AS a matter of fact this forum alone is giveing them proof you are willing to pay, regardless what the market will bear. And besides, isn't the new HIII suppose to be 1500.00? If so how could the manufacturer justify even more than 1000.00 a pair higher for the CIII, I mean all we are adding is a couple square foot of wood and 3" to the driver, and I am sure that will not cost much to manufacture vs. the smaller HIII, Not to mention an RF7 is probably DOUBLE the manufacturing cost to build than the CIII would be. This Audio market is very different than others, cars and things like Motorcycles, that for some reason people decided Okay I'll pay 30,000 for 2 wheels and a Gas tank vs. 1988 would not fetch much more than 5-8000.00 or something is just ludicris. So basically you guys can keep agreeing that you want to pay 4000.00 for a pile of 500.00 parts all you want, but I will not. Now regardless if you agree with my statements and that is fine, I do have some pretty good points and Valid facts. But it is this thinking that has gotten this country into this problem in the first place "the oh well it will happen anyway" of course some things will increase in price, like my house it cost 75,000 in 1985 now its worth like 260,000 and I would never pay that for this cheap of construction house, but somebody will.

Well out of all the players in the 1000.00 to 5000.00 range, WADIA is by far my favorite, super smooth 4 volt output on the RCA's vs. the standard 2 volt machines, built way beyond what you could imagine for a cd deck to be, and it is the fullest body sounding unit with the most real sound stage, okay the soundstage is not real it actually sounds double the size it should be, my room went from 8 ft to 20 ft ceilings ... and truth is I turn on my turntable and can't believe it could get better, but then the wadia warms up after about an hour of use and it is astonishing at how truly analog it sounds but with more weight and of course Bass is top dog out of the wadia but anyone will tell you that, but they are very powerfull sounding CD players, very open and very in your face, most dvd players sound a little rolled off and like you are in the 12th row, but the Wadia is very upfront, like you are standing on stage, could be good for some, could be bad for others, its all in your taste but mine is perfect for me, and It replaced a 3000.00 dollar universal, Yep SACD and all but the Wadia stomped it, I left SACD since and have completly invested in Redbook and Vinyl ... But If SACD or DVD audio are important, then I suggest for the lower end of the spectrum a Marantz unit, or integra research(Onkyo's hi end) P.s. the Wadia plays Killer tunes even when a bad disc is thrown at it, scratched, MP3, CdR's anything I can think of is flawless.

Okay 3800.00 then, but too bad because klipsch will not sell many. again street price for those will have to be around 1800.00 after the first year of the CWIII's I would not see anybody really messing with them otherwise, I mean klipsch has plenty of options in that range that will be picked over them, but again the Asian market may catch fire and that is where they would be succesfull.

I'm pretty sure the HK is one of the highest current receiver designs for the newer stuff around, I remember seeing them lay down supposedly spec. wise about 40 amps per channel, but who knows now with some models having 7 channels. But yeah I agree go with something for 2 channel, I say a great used piece off ebay or something would be a big intergrated mcintosh, for some reason the mcintosh always has a good flavor with the klipsch speakers, also not to sure that HK will stay completly stable for you with the 7's going under 4 ohm load, any receiver probably loses a little performance doing that. I believe in the menu on the HK it will ask you for whether your speakers are 6 or 8 ohm, I guess if you use it the best you can do is pick 6 ohm , but try it either way.

I guess everything sounds good until you hear something better to reference it, unfortunatly it happens to me all the time,