Q-Man

Mike, Once you go front effects, there is no turning back.Quite an emprovement in the front stage. Another thing I like about the 3000, is how the Pre-Outs work. You can run an external amp from the pre outs and still use it's on board amps at the same time. they don't cut out. That's how I run two pairs of rear surrounds. The 3000 powers one pair and an external amp powers the other pair. Q. ------------------ Q-Man

O.K., keep talking. How are you using this amp? Q. ------------------ Q-Man

I bought them from EV and Klipsch. I bet Klipsch still has them. Q. ------------------ Q-Man

I got my Signsture back today. Sunfire shipped it back in new boxes and used 3 day air from Washington to Florida. This surprised me, because they said they would ship it ground. I shipped it to them 3 day air , so I think they extended me that courtesy. They told me it was the 97th. one made, so they did update it. They replaced the active dirver, which I blew. They put in some kind of anti clipping circut, two new resistors, a diode and a couple items I can't read. They also sent me a new manual, much more informative then the original one. It recomends the mink oil treatment that The EAR mentioned. My sons are giving it a work out right now, so I think I'll go join them. Later, Q. ------------------ Q-Man This message has been edited by Q-Man on 03-07-2002 at 08:09 PM

I agree with with soundog. I prefer the newer ones out there with the AK-3 networks. Just keep looking , they will turn up. Q. ------------------ Q-Man

HornEd, I tried replying to your email questions. I keep getting , User Unkown. Q. ------------------ Q-Man

HornED, Both pairs of my K-horns are factory wired with Monster cable. The newer pair is 97,98,or 99, with AK-3 networks. The older pair has the AK-2 network. The banana plugs from the top horn section to the lower bass horn are a loose fit. Take the fine point of a knife and spread open the male insert, so it fits tight. Mine would vibrate loose and fall out. My false corners are 54" high, 36' deep TV side , and 58" deep on the wall side. They have a top on them that extends over almost all of the top of the K-horn and all the way back to the back wall. This top works out nice. It's serves as a shelf for the LaScala front effect speakers and some other equipment. I'll include a photo of it in my mail out to you. I have a photo CD with a couple photos of the front end and about 20 photos of the assembly process of the University bass horn cabinet. I took the photos for John Warren, but I didn't send them to him yet. I was going to try to post them first. If I send the CD to you , do you think that you could post them for me? Maybe some of the others will like to see them. My 13 yr. old son is starting to pick up this insane habit. The other night he was looking at the false corners and said. "They might make good subwoofers." " You should put a couple of 18" drivers in each one of them." Now, why didn't I think of that? I figured it out , and each false corner has 72 cu. ft. of sealed air space in them. Seems like it will be a waste of space not to take advantage of it. It should have been incorporated in the design from the start. 72 cu. ft. should be enought for the right driver to get down to 15Hz. with low distortion and good output. Everytime I think that I'm satisfied and finished, something elce comes to mind. Q. ------------------ Q-Man This message has been edited by Q-Man on 03-03-2002 at 08:03 AM

HornEd, I've been toying with the idea of building a new home theater room around four Klipschorns, two Imperials, two Universities, and some LaScalas. The room is about 23' by 36' with six false corners to toe in the Imperials and Klipschorns. The center channel K-Horn will have a screen in front of it. The 23 foot wall will be the front stage. The 36' lenght will just give me enought room for two rows of seats. The second row will sit on a raised floor which will continue to the back of the room. This way the rear speakers will also be raised. Being a Cabinet and Kitchen designer, I have connections with many of the local builders. I drew up one set of house plans that I have to drop off to a home builder friend of mine to price. Those plans only show an open shell of the room and detail the rest of the house. I want to build the room myself. I don't trust anyone elce to get it right. I also drew up a set of plans to remodel my present home, so I can fit in a simular room. I have to have him price that out too. This project may be on hold for a while. My oldest son will be entering college next year. Ouch! And, my accountant is working on a plan to help me find investors to help be buy out the cabinet manufacturing business that I'm currently running. I'm doing this along with my own small custom cabinet business. So I have alot going on right now. I do have the Home theater room drawn up a couple of ways , so I'll know how to build it once the shell is up. Email me with your address ,if you have any interest in seeing it. I'll mail you the drawing, once I find them and blow off the saw dust. Q. ------------------ Q-Man This message has been edited by Q-Man on 03-01-2002 at 11:43 PM

I'm rushed for time right now , and may have to finish this later. I have the ICBM crossover set to 40Hz. mains, 80Hz. center, 60Hz. rear LaScalas, 40Hz. rear center, Rear Imperials full range. I'm using the ICBM recombine switch, so everything below these frequencies are sent to the mains and sub. Again, the sub has been set no higher then 50Hz. , so the mains reproduce everything above that. I'm not saying I'm right and that your wrong. I just would like to understand this, so I can get it right. Are you saying that the ICBM won't sent anything above my 40Hz. crossover setting on the mains to the sub? I think it only works by not sending anything below 40Hz. to the mains. For example, the center channel is set to 80Hz.. Everything below that goes to the mains and sub. I don't want my sub reproducing those 40Hz. to 80Hz. signals from the center channel. This is why I didnt think that I would want a sub without a crossover . One like the Ultras. By the way, I read a review on the ICBM. After testing the crossover settings, they said that the crossover adjustmens are actually 5Hz. higher the what they are labled as. Hey, if I'm not understanding this crossover sub business, strighten me out. Thanks, Q. ------------------ Q-Man This message has been edited by Q-Man on 03-01-2002 at 12:36 PM

Boa12, I know that in the ICBM manual, it says to turn the sub crossover all the way up. I didn't try this, I thought this would be wrong. Maybe I've been missing something here. For argument sake, let's forget about the ICBM. I'll get back to that later. In most processors you you have options. One is to set the mains to large or small. Another is to send the LFE channel to the mains only, sub only, or to the mains and sub. My thinking here is that the mains, in my case Klipschorns, will reproduce any any sound down to 45Hz. (maybe lower), better then any sub will. So, this has been my starting point when setting the sub crossover. I try to adjust the sub to pick up the low frequencies just above where the mains begin rolling off. Isn't this what they mean by adjusting your sub to blend in with your mains? Or, are they just talking about the volume? Also, arn't low frequency test tones designed to show you where your speakers are rolling off? This way you know where to adjust your sub crossover to pick up the slack. The LFE channel is being sent to the mains, in this case, so how can I be missing any of it? If I set the sub crossover all the way up, then the sub is also reproducing some of the same frequencies as the mains. Say 45Hz.to 100Hz. That to me doesn't sound desirable. This could be why some say subs are slow. They are reproducing frequencies that they are not intended to. At least for bass horn mains. Subs probably blend in better with conventional speaker, since they both use the same type woofer box design. Does this make any sence ? Am I off base here? Q ------------------ Q-Man

I just read that review again, because it's been about a year since I first read it. It said that the Ultras don't have a crossover. Does that mean that you can't adjust them to roll off at a desired frequency? I better go back and read more about them on the web site. I never had my Signature above about 50Hz. I also don't plan on adjusting any sub that I use to play higher then that. I want the Klipschorns to produce all the sound above that. Maybe the Ultras wouldn't be for me. Before I say more, I better go read about them. Q. ------------------ Q-Man

I found the review. Sorry ,but this little old cabinet maker isn't as smart as the rest of you. I don't know how to make it so you can just click on it. I'll have to have Mike come back over and teach me some stuff on this darn comp.. The review was from the SVS site. Go to svsubwoofers.com. Click on (Reviews) in the upper rt. hand corner. Then click on,( Discover Brian's entire review )to the lower right. Q. ------------------ Q-Man

Horn ED, First of all, I wouldn't be too concerened with the lower end harmonic distortion with the Ultras. The review was very favorable about the clean sound that they produce. It just wasn't quite as accurate as the HGS. I'm going to try to find the link, so you can read it yourself. Since the HGS keeps pace with the K-Horns, in most cases, I'm going for the slightly cleaner sound. I just called a dealer and his lowest price on the HGS is $2500.00. If I don't feel comfortable with the $1800.00 to $1900.00 ebay price, then I will have to pay the $2500.00 In that case I might go with the Ultras and have my stereo subs with a little more punch. Decisions,decisions. Now your really living up to your name. Horn Ed should have fully horn loaded speakers. Q. ------------------ Q-Man This message has been edited by Q-Man on 02-28-2002 at 05:01 PM

Ear, Thanks very much for your reply. I think I know what I want to do now. When I get my updated Signature back from Sunfire, I might sell it. I would like to keep it, but after buying the McIntosh amp and some misc. items to go with it, I could use the money. The Signature sells on ebay for $1300.00 and up. If I decide to sell it I'll put it on for $1100.00. As I said, I have always liked this sub with my Klipschorns. But, after reading the review and getting your opinion on the two subs, I think I'm going to go with the HGS-18 . I should like the HGS even more. If I can't find it in me to sell the Signature, then I'll use it as a center channel sub. It will fit in front of the TV. It's time to start shopping for the HGS-18. Maybe in the furture I'll get another one for the stereo effect . What's this about an Aerial? Darn! Now I have to look that one up. Probably too expensive. Q. ------------------ Q-Man

I never even asked Sunfire what the warranty would be. I guess I was to interested in what they were going to do. I shipped it today, when I get it back I'll let you know about the warranty. Now I have to go buy some mink oil and show the sub how much I love it when it returns. Q. ------------------ Q-Man

Horn Ed, My front effect companion . You can add in your two cents on your Ultras if you like. Q. ------------------ Q-Man

Dog, That adjustment is for making the center speaker sound more like your main speakers. I don't use it , because my center is the same as my mains. Q. ------------------ Q-Man

EAR, I've been meaning to ask you this question for some time now. Which do you prefer, or how would you compare your Velodyne HGS-18 to your Sunfire Signature? I have a Signature and I'm toying with the idea of adding another one to my system. The Outlaw (ICBM) bass manager splits the LFE channel , and the other channels that are sent to the sub into stereo. It gives you left and right stereo sub channels. I may try this set up. A no brainer would be to just order another Signature and have an equal match. I read a review , that I think that I found on the SVS website or on the Hometheaterhifi.com site. This review has be pondering over which sub might be the best one to use with Klipschorns. The review compared the following subs while using Klipschorns as the main speakers. I was trilled to have someone blending them with with the Klipschorns. He compared the SVS CS-Ultra, Velodyde HGS-18, Klipsch KSW-15 , Klipsch RSW-15 and a couple others. But, no Signature in the line up. So, I'm counting on your ears to help me. The SVS CS-Ultras were tops in SPL, but introduced some lower end harmonic distortion. They had no problem keeping pace with the Klipschorns The HGS-18 was second in SPL and didn't produce any harmonic distoration. It was the most accurate sounding of the bunch. It did however fall short of keeping up with the Klipschorns in one test. The other subs didn't compare in my opinion. I wish the Signature was included in the comparison. I liked what he had to say about the HGS-18. He couldn't say enought about the sound quality and how accurate it is , even at it's bottom end at max. volume. I'm a little affraid about the statement on it not quite keeping pace with the Klipschorns durning one demo track. I could judge this better if you can tell me how the HGS's SPL compares to the Signatuer. If it can't at least play as loud as the Sunfire, then it wouldn't do for my system. The HGS-18 can be had on ebay from $1850.00 to $2000.00. The Ultras could be the main left and right sub for around $2400.00. With a little loss in sound quality to the HGS, but a gain in SPl. Then I could always use the Signature for a dedicated center channel sub. I can get a Signature from a dealer for $1800.00, or on ebay for $1300.00 to $1400.00. Right now I'm leaning towards another Signature. It would be cheaper, matches what I have, and I like mine with the Klipschorns. I'm just looking at these other options. You know how it goes, never satisfied. Thanks, Q. ------------------ Q-Man

Some of you know that when Mike came over for a Klipschorn demo, we blew up my Signature sub. I first called the dealer, they told me to bring it into them for repair. It was there for a week and still sitting in the same place where they told me to put it. I called Sunfire, they told me to go pick it up and send it to them. Sunfire said that no dealer can repair them and that they didn't understand what the dealer was up to. It's four years old and out of warranty. Sunfire said that they service them for a flat rate of $165.00. They will fix anything that is wrong and make any updates that are necessary to match the current model. This price also includes shipping . Not a bad deal, is it? And another thing, Sunfire won't keep it any longer then two days. I just thought that I would past along this information. Q. ------------------ Q-Man This message has been edited by Q-Man on 02-26-2002 at 07:48 PM

Mike, I'm glad that you enjoyed the demo, and that the Klipschorns lived up to your expectations. It was fun having you here, and I even liked some of your music. My wife and kids got a kick out of you, when you went into the room and ran from speaker to speaker checking them out. They said that you were like a kid in a candy store. Especially when I had to take the University apart to explain the bass horn. They now know that there are other nuts in this world, and that I'm not the only one. We'll see you again, and thanks for the kind words. Q. ------------------ Q-Man This message has been edited by Q-Man on 02-17-2002 at 09:37 PM

Horn Ed, I may have to email Tom with a few questions that I have. I've been reading all the post on the SVS subs. I've been to his website a few times. I guess, I can't go wrong with a 30 day trial period. I'll wait to see what's wrong with the Sunfire and what it will cost to fix it. Mike and I were pushing the limit a few times. I noticed the McIntosh needles maxing out a few times. I should have turned down the bass and or the sub down at that volume level. My two sons were in the room for a while. They tried to warn me to turn the sub down when the concrete slab felt like it was going to crack. Mike is right about clean un-distorted sound. Something That I'm not used to yet. Before I could always hear some distortion develope somewhere to warn me to turn down the volume or adjust something. But, now the room sounds better then it ever did. I may have finally even reached the point of no improvement, or at least where I don't feel the need to do so. I think it's a combination of the changes that I just made. 1) A 30 amp dedicated circuit. 2) Finding all the vibration and reverberation points in the room and eliminating them. 3) The new false corners are constructed with 2x6's 12" on center and faced with double 3/4" plywood.They are 3 to 4' deep in some places and screwed to the rooms block walls. 4)The McIntosh amp.. 5) Up graded interconnects. 6) Thick throw rugs added on top of the wall to wall carpeting. It's kind of scary now. You can, and want to listen louder and louder. The system seems to have no limit. The wine was Clos Du Bois, Cabernet Sauvignon 1988. Since Mike finished the red wine that he brought, I told him to pick a bottle from the wine rack. He saw the year and was being polite , trying to refuse it. I told him not to worry, that it was probably in my wine rack for that long. No one here drinks red wine. I guess it will now be for my Klipsch guest. Better hurry, there are only a few bottles left. Q. ------------------ Q-Man This message has been edited by Q-Man on 02-17-2002 at 09:12 PM

I hope that I don't make anyone angry. I think that it was in 1974 when I went to a dealer to buy my first pair of LaScalas, after growing up listening to my neighbors Klipschorns. I was being cheap and went home with a pair of Cornwalls. I kept them for one week, but couldn't take it any more. I brought them back and traded them in for the LaScalas. Q. ------------------ Q-Man

How about this guy? He showed up a week early, drinks my best bottle of wine,and BLOWS UP my Sunfire Signature subwoofer.Now he won't even comment on his impression of a Klipschorn system for you guys that never heard one. I just crawed out of the attic retrieving the Sunfire shippig box, so I can send it in to be fixed. Is it time for a pair of SVS- Ultras? Q. ------------------ Q-Man This message has been edited by Q-Man on 02-17-2002 at 11:57 AM

Don't do it. The AK-3 is a good network. Q. ------------------ Q-Man

Mike, I'm sorry. I never should have tried to use my sick sense of humor in type. I can be very sarcastic, but it's ment in jest. I guess I wouldn't expect you to understand it without seeing my facial expressions or knowing me better. I won't try that again. Please, bring Debbie. It will be fun. Now , if you knew be better I would really say to you. Please, bring Debbie. Then I won't have to talk to you. I'm always using those sick one liners with people that know be better, and they understand that I mean just the opposite. Again, I'm sorry. I'll email you tonight with directions and some other information. You can come as early as 6:00 P.M.if you like. That way you won't have to try to find your way in the dark. Q. ------------------ Q-Man This message has been edited by Q-Man on 02-14-2002 at 06:40 PM