maxg

You are correct in that the speakers intersect approximately 6ft 6 inches in front of the wall. This is something of a problem as that is a little too close for comfort. The reason for this, as I said, is that the speakers are too close together. However, there is one major saving grace with KHorns and that is the size of the sweet spot. Even with the speakers this close there is a relatively enormous area where the sound does not change (relative to my Heresy's that is - I have a sweet spot that is about 2 ft square). With the Horns placed as they are the sweet spot is about 12 feet long and 4 feet wide. If Artemidis was able to place the speakers 15 to 20 feet apart the sweet spot would be enormous. the downside of that arrangement, however, is that I would have moved in.

Well last night I finally made it round to Aristidis' house to discover what this high end thing is all about. I took a friend with me (also a high end guy with some very large Maggies and Martin Logans and a plethora of other equipment - including a tube pre-amp - an Atmospere something or other I think - no idea what that is - Mobile???). Anyway back to Aristidis - where to start? This is an Aladdin's cave of equipment much of which I didnt recognise. There are the Horns of course - for the first time placed sympathetically enough in the room so that they dont jump out and bite you (in neither the viusal nor the accoustic sense but more of that later). OK - in the middle of the 3 way rack is a large Plinius SS amp (Class A, 100 WPC - serious heat sinks) above that one of the tube amps, then the DAC of the Theta CD player and topped off with the Hofland Pre-amp. On either side of the Plinius were the 300B monoblocks we did most of our listening to. On the left hand side, rising from there I think is another amp and then a couple of tuners. On the right the power supply for the turntable, the Theta CD transport and finally the turntable itself (the Pierre Lune). Did I say finally? On each of the KHorns themselves are yet more amps, a 2 channel 2a3 on the right and yet another amp on the left (which I cannot remember) but was 15 wpc push pull. One of the first things Aristidis said to me was "My usual amps are out on loan - these are the ones I am planning to sell." I was just thinking that the place needed some more amplification!! We started by listening to a couple of CD's I brought with me that I always use in system testing (Dvorak's New World Symphony with Karajan conducting and Dire Straits - Money for nothing album track 9 - Private investigations). Initial impressions were somewhat coloured by the speakers themselves. There was plenty of attack here, but that is as much a property of the Horns as anything - it was not easy to tell that this meant the amps provided the sheer balls I would need with Heresy's. Overall the impression was very favourable. The KHorns are certainly being reigned in sufficently (which is not the case with SS amplification in my experience) and so the music flows through rather than bashing you over the head. Our later testing using the Plinius confirmed both my observations. Far more slam with Solid State but combined with a far more agressive presentation that didn't encourage relaxed listening - excellent for parties, not for listening on your own at night. We played a variety of CD's - some of which were utterly breath-taking (that is one serious player in my opinion). There was not a trace of distortion anywhere - even at comparitively loud volumes. I should say at this point that I am used to listening to my music at subdued volumes (in the region of 75-85 dB) and that these would go a whole lot higher when asked. You could, at a pinch, use the 300B's for a party but with the Plinius there it would be pointless. We did not, unfortunately get to hear the 2a3 amp (another visit maybe) but we did get to hear some vinyl. This is the point that I really struggled. I was between 2 vinyl jockeys who are obviously very enamoured with the format and I had great difficulty there, as well as here, in defining my feelings. There were moments when the music soared beautifully, where the presentation took on a superb dynamic edge that really sounded as good as anything I had heard but these were a little to far apart and only on some of the vinyl we listened to. I could not adjust to the noise floor at all. There is a constant hiss which became painfully obvious in quieter moments. Whilst during louder play this became a non-issue the pops, bumps, squeaks and so on continually made their presence known. I found myself wincing at each pop and listening, not to the music itself but for the next one in a kind of horrified fascination. Compared to the playing of Aristidis' best CD's this was a painful experience. I imagine that the introduction of a good SACD player would further illustrate the difference. I am not saying that the music produced is better on SACD than on vinyl, but, it is delivered in such a clean way that the end result, to my ears, is much more pleasant and relaxing. Vinyl may indeed (as the other 2 insist) sound less electronic but it also sounds more mechanical. It is not closer to "reality" than SACD, just different. Neither truely capture a live performance but with my hand on my heart I would say SACD gets closer, if only for the absence of mechanical noise in the playback. I am undecided, as yet, as too whether my reaction to vinyl is a disappointment to me or a relief. As someone who does not own any records to speak of I cannot see myself delving into vinyl now and am of the opinion that going SACD, rather than to a turntable, was certainly the right choice for me. Leaving aside the issue of vinyl I would like to return to Aristidis sound. There is one unfortunate thing in the system that does impact the playback and that is the room itself. The speakers are simply too close together and that impacts the soundstage and the imaging quite badly. Additionally, it causes a greater sensitivity to head height than I have noticed at other KHorn listeing sessions. Standing up is a far more rewarding experience musically than sitting down. To some extent this is alleviated if you move further back from the system. I found the ideal listening position to be about 6 feet further back and central to the 2 speakers. At this distance the soundstage truely opened up and all instrumentation in orchestral works suddenly found there proper place in 3 dimensional space. You can also sit down there without ill effect using one of the kitchen chairs. Aristidis is not an imaging freak and so such things are far less important to him than to me. This is his system and it suits his requirements for listening. I do not imagine he will be occupying that kitchen chair anytime soon. So how would I summarise my impressions? Well this is true KHorn sound, and with the 300B's done as well as I have ever heard, if not better. That the KHorns have been tamed is a remarkable testiment to Aristidis' knowledge and understanding of all things audio and doubtless a combination of a multiplicity of factors including speaker mods, amplifciation and some very serious source gear. I have no idea how much Aristidis has spent in total on this sound but I have the feeling we are heading into figures that would match the GDP of some African countries. It is obvious that we cannot talk in terms of ROI on such a system, as much as anything because there are so many amps kicking around. One thing is for sure - I was in the company of a true audiophile who has taken his hobby very seriously. I listened to Aristidis talk of his much modified amplifiers as if they were his children and thought quietly to myself - what price money in the light of such love? Thank-you Aristidis for allowing both Yiannis and I to listen to your system(s). It was a rare pleasure. ------------------ 2 * Heresy 2 (mains) 2 * Homemade horn speakers (rears) 1 * REL Strata 3 sub Accuphase E211 amp. Tube monoblocks with separate pre-amp (DECWARE ZTPRE with separate beefed up PSU) Marantz CD6000 player Sony NS900 SACD/DVD player Stax Headphones (on loan to a friend) Humax 5400 digital satellite receiver Sharp Video 32" Sony flat screen 16:9 TV Mogami interconnects Silver Synergistic speaker cable

Unless I get horrible lost I should be there by 6 pm and we will see what we will see (or is that hear?). I am very much in Arco's category of someone who has not heard single ended troide amps but has heard from others that they lack the attack that I believe I need. Arco seems confident they do not and I am sure he is right - we are well outside my area of knowledge in this aspect. The good news in on the VTPRE front. I have found the setting combo that I like and it is with the Agressive setting (less bias) and the original 0.47 Mf cap fitted on option B. I had first Beethoven and then Rachmaninov let rip last night till the wee hours and it was wonderful stuff. This is a huge relief for me - I was genuinely thinking of going back to my old SS pre-amp if this test failed whilst I started this whole cap swapping exercise. AS it is I am delighted with the sound as I have it now and am likely to stay that way till at least 6:30... Just never stops this hobby of ours does it.

Ya know - call it prescience if you will but I have the strange feeling me old mate Mobile is replying here about now. This "who is logged in feature" is really cool - it shows you what people are doing too... Hi Mobile!!

Thanks Arco - you had said you had made changes but I did not realise that you had removed the 4 uf cap altogether and replaced it. Thus far I also prefer the "b" selection - "a" seems to be somewhat darker and a bit more ponderous. Maybe that is its signature but I think it is not for me. I am currently evaluating the Aggressive/normal bias switch and tonight plan to test agressive with classical music - I certainly prefer it with Rock as I said above. I certainly dont want to make the sound of the classical too hard, but, on the other hand on the normal setting it seems a touch too sweet for my liking after prolonged listening (4 hours last night). Some pieces respond particularly well to this sweetness (especially the Grieg and the Straus Waltz's which are simply sublime) whilst others suffer a little at the lack of attack (the Rach 3 is a bit subdued as is Beethoven's 3rd Symphony). To be honest this is my main concern for my future amp developments as well. I have heard that the triode amps lack the attack I like - even for classical. I am so kean to test your set up in this regard. I am really hoping I can alite on one setting for all my music (probably optimistic) because getting up and fumbling around the back for the right switch is already getting to be a bit of a pain. So far the biggest beneficiary has been the soundstage - it has gained depth and height (although the latter may be a result of the re-aligned speakers as well). I have still not got around to testing vocals at all - so much to do - so little time!!

Kinda depends on what your budget / room layout is. The easy answer if you have available corners and a large budget is KHorns - they will do everything - but I am guessing your question wants a more limited budget answer. My vote for the best compromise speaker at a very reasonable price would have to go for the RF3. Plenty of Bass, masses of volume and a fair degree of detail and soundstaging for 2 channel - even for major orchestral works. It is also a great match with the Klipsch subs / centre channels and so on making it an ideal basis for building up a decent home theatre. Actually it has enough bass to get away without a sub, and sufficent staging and imaging to allow you to manage without a center channel if you re in the sweet spot. As I write this I am wondering why I do not own a pair....oh yes...I have Heresy's - phew! ------------------ 2 * Heresy 2 (mains) 2 * Homemade horn speakers (rears) 1 * REL Strata 3 sub Accuphase E211 amp. Tube monoblocks with separate pre-amp (DECWARE ZTPRE with separate beefed up PSU) Marantz CD6000 player Sony NS900 SACD/DVD player Stax Headphones (on loan to a friend) Humax 5400 digital satellite receiver Sharp Video 32" Sony flat screen 16:9 TV Mogami interconnects Silver Synergistic speaker cable

Refering to the manual which I downloaded on line: "Starting from the left as youre looking at the back, the first switch is changes the output coupling caps from 4uf to 0.47 uf. Both caps are poly and audiophile grade quality. The 4uf cap (Cap A) will have extended bass response and a slower smoother presentation. Some amps will puke during heavy peaks from the excessive dynamic range offered by this cap. The 0.47uf cap (Cap excels in speed and accuracy to a point of revealing the many faults of mid fi digital front ends. Its drier presentation is often preferred with Vinyl." What does it mean that an amp may "puke"? "To solve this problem, the ZTPREs output level switch actually changes the circuit from a conventional paralleled single ended triode with the plates driving the output, to a nifty little variation where the cathodes drive the output. In the cathode (or NORM) position, the ZTPRE actually attenuates without compromising the signal path with additional parts." Huh?? Anyone? These setting changes certainly make a huge difference in the sound. I played Dire Straits "Private Investigations" last night and it didn't perform all that well until I adjusted the Bias switch to "aggressive" and the output coupling cap from 4uf to 0.47 uf. Then it just blew me (and the Accuphase) away. Pity these switches are all mounted on the back - changing settings is going to be a real pain. It would probably have been better to put everything on the front plate and just provide a flip down cover or something to hide the wiring. ------------------ 2 * Heresy 2 (mains) 2 * Homemade horn speakers (rears) 1 * REL Strata 3 sub Accuphase E211 amp. Tube monoblocks with separate pre-amp (DECWARE ZTPRE with separate beefed up PSU) Marantz CD6000 player Sony NS900 SACD/DVD player Stax Headphones (on loan to a friend) Humax 5400 digital satellite receiver Sharp Video 32" Sony flat screen 16:9 TV Mogami interconnects Silver Synergistic speaker cable

Maybe we need an audio travel forum as well as a tube forum on here OK - I promise that when you get to Athens I will allow you time to see some of the sites as well - and, of course, sample some Greek wines (there are over 4000 of them so we may need more than one night ) If we are lucky we should have found and moved in to our new house by then. If so I promise all accomodation will be free, if not, it can be free but you may have to rough it a bit (all being well my daughter will be about 3-4 months old by then). I have a couple of questions regarding some of the settings on my new pre - but I think I will post those in a new thread - this one is growing uncontrolably. BTW - Dubai - I did get you mail message and replied - did you not get that? I am thinking about the quads but the problem is that the budget I had in mind for the amplification will likely go on a 300b of my own now. Problems, problems - so much audio - so little time, space and money...

Mike, HornEd and Mobile (and anyone else who frequents this forum) You are all welcome to come to Athens at any time - just let me know when and I will arrange as many system viewings as you can handle. Plus, I cant tell you how much it would tickle me to have Americans come to Athens and buy Greek tube amps to take home with y'all. Aristidis is certainly correct in that there are better tube amps than the Tsakiridis Devices units that I have - but for this money??? This is in the price range of an AIWA integrated unit (certainly over here) - and they are made to let you roll tubes to your hearts content. I alone can arrange for you to see a Heresy setup, Forte, RF3, KHorn, La Scala's and maybe Belles - who knows what Aristidis can line up - he is a member of the Audiophile club of Athens with access to presumably innumerable systems far far better than mine (with price tags to match). Just let me know when you are all coming - if you dont come together I can probably even put you up...

"with better amps " What - you dont like my $500 monoblocks???? Good heavens and what a surprise!!! And not in love with my $250 CD player either Well I suppose I can live with that (dont really listen to CD anyway). I do promise, however, that as soon as firwire ports come out on SACd players I will re-visit the source issue and maybe get a transport / DAC separates system. As for the next meetings - lets do it! Glad you enjoyed the multi-channel effect. ------------------ 2 * Heresy 2 (mains) 2 * Homemade horn speakers (rears) 1 * REL Strata 3 sub Accuphase E211 amp. Tube monoblocks with separate pre-amp (DECWARE ZTPRE with separate beefed up PSU) Marantz CD6000 player Sony NS900 SACD/DVD player Stax Headphones (on loan to a friend) Humax 5400 digital satellite receiver Sharp Video 32" Sony flat screen 16:9 TV Mogami interconnects Silver Synergistic speaker cable

Acro (Aristidis) came round to my place last night with one ZTPRE and one Bottlehead Foreplay pre-amp. We plugged them in and whilst waiting for them to warm up he patiently examined my sound using both his CD's and my SACD's as test subjects. I should state at this point that everyone who has come round to my house to date has simply been blown away by the sound and therefore not been in a position to be able to contribute much in terms of changing/improving the sound. Not so Arco! He listened and pronounced that there were 2 problems he could see (from his test CD). First problem was bass - it was too low (we fixed that with a simple turn of the sub volume control) and the second, more interesting problem, the sound was muddy. First he suggested that lying my Heresy's on their side may not be such a good idea. He could understand why I had done it (the speakers are some 4 feet off the ground - woofers at ear level - tweeters above), but thought it might be better to mount them normally. We therefore turned the heresy's back to their normal position and it did indeed sound better. Then he examined my cleverboy wiring technique - monoblocks and accuphase connected at the same time to the speakers with the sub taking its signal from the Accuphase speaker outputs even with the accuphase off. This meant that whilst using the tube monoblocks for the amplification the signal was traveling to the speaker and then back down the wire to the accuphase where it linked with the sub speaker connectors and into the sub itself. Arco suggested that this might not be such a good idea so we disconnected the accuphase from the front channel altogether and then split the sub cable so that it could take its signal from the monoblocks. This represented a big improvement which is always nice when it doesnt cost a dime. During the process I sneaked in a multi-channel SACD (Roger Waters - Live and in the flesh). I had noted Arco's distain for multi-channel during our previous conversations but this, I think, really surprised him. I deliberately set it up without telling him what was happening (he kept asking why the meters on the Accuphase were suddenly registering) and only confessed that this was MC when he stated he liked what he was hearing. I dont know if what he heardwas enough to make him want to rush out and buy an SACD player but I bet it took him closer. After all of this, finally we were ready to test the pre-amps. First up the Bottlehead. To be honest this was a little disappointing. It didnt perform any better than my solid state pre. It was pleasant enough - and I would have bought it simply because, at the money, it was a no brainer. Certainly looked sexy (if a little small) with its 2 little bulbs glowing red to match my KT88's - but soundwise it was a step sideways rather than upwards. One pleasant surprise was how well it coped with less typical tube music. We put on an SACD with big bass (MAriah Carey - track one -with some RAP star of other)and it coped with aplomb - almost exactly as my SS pre did. then we put on the Stevie Ray Vaughn's Texas Flood SACD for some real electric guitar and again it coped admirably. Somehow, however, it just didn't sing. There was nothing special about the sound so after about an hour of listening we switched to the ZTPRE. I should point out that this pre has a beefier than normal external PSU but it looks like crap. Even Arco's attempt at disguising the pre with chromed controls at the front and a wooden plinth didnt help much. Who would design a tube pre where you cant see the tubes? Most disappointing!! Then we connected the SACD and let fly. After a bit of messing around with the various switches at the back (mainly selecting the source - not easy with the hidden rear facing switch between the 2 outputs(!) and then adjusting the output level from low to high. Suddenly we had sound. and what sound. Crystal clear! An amazing and huge difference was imediately apparent. Instantly the other 2 pre's were relegated to the position of also-rans. I re-tested with music tubes are not supposed to like (Bass and the massively fast electric guitar) and it breezed through. Within a few seconds of, to be honest, the first classical SACD, I knew I was going to buy this unit, and after a quick trip to the cash-point I did! As Arco was leaving we chatted about things audio. I think he genuinely liked my sound (now at least!) - maybe he will comment here?? Next up is a visit to his house to hear his system. Frankly I cant wait - KHorns and vinyl should be amazing. Then we will investigate his suggestion of some triodes to replace the push-pull amps I have currently and after that who knows. Anyway - to summarize I am one happy bunny! I listened to the sound again this morning (Beethoven's 3rd Symphony) and it sounded sweeter and tighter than ever before. Think I will now go and adjust my signature once again.. ------------------ 2 * Heresy 2 (mains) 2 * Homemade horn speakers (rears) 1 * REL Strata 3 sub Accuphase E211 amp. Tube monoblocks with separate pre-amp (solid state). Marantz CD6000 player Sony NS900 SACD/DVD player Stax Headphones Humax 5400 digital satellite receiver Sharp Video 32" Sony flat screen 16:9 TV Mogami interconnects Silver Synergistic speaker cable

and back to the original subject.... I am kinda hoping my sealed unit speakers and sub will be fairly child proof. The only protection for the woofers on the Heresys is the front cover but that is not the easiest thing to remove for a child (I hope!) Well time will tell - should be about 7 weeks till the little tester is borne - we will see what interesting variations she comes up with.... More seriously I am worried out the tube amps. Those tubes look very pretty and from what I know I think they contain all the real nasties (Lead, Cadmium, mercury etc. etc.) Wonder how high I am gonna have to place them... ------------------ 2 * Heresy 2 (mains) 2 * Homemade horn speakers (rears) 1 * REL Strata 3 sub Accuphase E211 amp. Tube monoblocks with separate pre-amp (solid state). Marantz CD6000 player Sony NS900 SACD/DVD player Stax Headphones Humax 5400 digital satellite receiver Sharp Video 32" Sony flat screen 16:9 TV Mogami interconnects Silver Synergistic speaker cable

Well Mobile - I understood almost nothing of your last post but I am sure it is all great info. Hopefully Arco and I will get together this weekend with both of his tube pre's so we can compare them not only against each other but against the SS amp that came with the units. This will also give me a chance to get an expert opinion on my current sound. Maybe Arco will post something of what he hears we'll see. Right now I woud say it is even money that either of the pre's will prove better to my ears than the current unit. Well, maybe slightly better than even - but this dang thing just sounds so good to me right now I am totally out of my depth for judgement purposes.

I recently saw a market analysis of the most respected brands in America. From memory Rolls Royce was third and Bose was 6th. Go figure!! The only Bose setup I ever heard that sounded good lives in a club my friends and I ocasionally frequent. they have 901's mounted on the ceiling (about 8 of them I think) being driven by about 1000 watts of power amp. There are a few subs around the place too - but not Bose models. The atmosphere in the club is excellent and they play almost entirely 70s and 80s music (my era). It is invariably packed out and most people go there for the music. It isnt the last word in detail and there is no soundstaging to speak of but it does pound out the music perfectly well for its environment. Its been that way for over 10 years now - and to the best of my knowledge they have never had to change anything on the speakers. Say what you like about the company and the product but that for me is testimony to their longevity if nothing else. Bravo Ray - A brave post indeed!! ------------------ 2 * Heresy 2 (mains) 2 * Homemade horn speakers (rears) 1 * REL Strata 3 sub Accuphase E211 amp. Tube monoblocks with separate pre-amp (solid state). Marantz CD6000 player Sony NS900 SACD/DVD player Stax Headphones Humax 5400 digital satellite receiver Sharp Video 32" Sony flat screen 16:9 TV Mogami interconnects Silver Synergistic speaker cable

Dubai, You are selling the Quad 63's? What kind of condition are they in? Have you done any mods on them? Any chance of some pictures? I seem to remember there was a version of the 63 that was refered to as the pros - updated and larger wiring but I may be wrong. Let me know if yours are pros. Who knows - maybe its a big spending day. Cheers BTW - you can email me direct if you prefer at maxg@hol.gr.

Think I will have to arrange a quick test of these if possible. Mobile - any thoughts or preferences. Should be interesting if we can arrange and obviously I will report back here on what we find. BTW - Arco's system looks seriously WOW. Maybe I can get a demo on that one....

WE dont say much it seems (lol). Well I am an exponential Horn fan myself. Trantix just dont seem be be quite there on the vocals in comparison, from what I have heard so far anyway (RF3, KSB 3.1, RF7, KLF 30). Maybe they just needed better amplification - who knows?? ------------------ 2 * Heresy 2 (mains) 2 * Homemade horn speakers (rears) 1 * REL Strata 3 sub Accuphase E211 amp. Tube monoblocks with separate pre-amp (solid state). Marantz CD6000 player Sony NS900 SACD/DVD player Stax Headphones Humax 5400 digital satellite receiver Sharp Video 32" Sony flat screen 16:9 TV Mogami interconnects Silver Synergistic speaker cable

Oh yes - I completely forgot. The tubes are wonderful. So wonderful in fact that I am immediately going to change everything again. I will be speaking to my amp supplier next week to see if he can modify my amps to run in triode mode (and maybe class A - we will see how difficult that is). Right now I have the best sound I have ever had in my house - and I am hoping it is only going to get better!! Just love this hobby!!

Gee Dubai - what a surprise! You have an awesome soundstage with a little old pair of KHorns...well fancy that (lol). I am not saying you cant get a decent soundstage with CD based music - just that relatively the SACd soundstage is more robust, more defined and a whole lot larger, or at least it can be. Obviously we will reach the laws of diminishing returns with a pair of KHorns. You already have an enormous soundstage - how much bigger can it get?? And no, I would not expect my soundstage on an SACD/ Heresy combo to match a CD/KHorn combo - but it is a whole lot closer than it was with CD playback. Just as an aside I was in the local Klipsch distributor last week and he had a pair of KHorns in the window with a pair of Heresy's on top. Jesus was I unprepared for the size difference!! The Heresy's looked liked headphones perched on top of the Khorns like that. Really made me laugh - they look quite large in my living room. I have seen Khorns many many times but every time I get a shock at their size! Of course the cost of my Heresy's plus my SACD player plus the 70 odd SACD's is still a whole lot less than half the cost of a pair of KHorns over here. You get what you pay for.

So what sort of price are we talking about for these non-corner KHorn lookalikes??? ------------------ 2 * Heresy 2 (mains) 2 * Homemade horn speakers (rears) 1 * REL Strata 3 sub Accuphase E211 amp. Tube monoblocks with separate pre-amp (solid state). Marantz CD6000 player Sony NS900 SACD/DVD player Stax Headphones Humax 5400 digital satellite receiver Sharp Video 32" Sony flat screen 16:9 TV Mogami interconnects Silver Synergistic speaker cable

My comments on soundstaging are all relative to the same (or similar) recordings on CD - I should have said this. After listening to SACD for a session switching back to CD is like encasing the sound in a letterbox. Everything is much more confined in all directions (height, width, depth). There also appears to be much less movement of instruments across a recording on SACD. I have noticed with some of my CD classical recordings that instruments appear to drift between movements and between full orchestral moments and quieter single or dual instument sections. Whether this is due to the medium, or merely a reflection of the greater care taken in producing an SACD recording I cannot tell. Suffice to tell that I am steadily replacing my classical CD collections with SACD's and relegating the CD's to the car. If and when Sony bring out a car SACD player the future of my CD's is bleak - maybe for use only on my computer at work - otherwise I will probably sell them.

Buying used is not a problem. Buying from the US might be. I can only get things into Greece without having to pay tax's if they are marked less than $20!! Works for SACD's - but a pre-amp moight be a bit of a push - maybe in kit form though. As always - thanks. I am running out of ways to say thanks to you - could we take it as red from now on. BTW - any recommended reading? If I were to learn some of this stuff I wouldnt have to drive you nuts with all these questions all the time.

Which is probably a fairly limited group but anyhow: I have notived that some of the older recordings that have been transfered to SACD have the largest soundstaging on a home system I have ever come across. The following, in no particular order, as the 2 channel SACD recent additions that really struck me with their depth and breadth of soundstage: All of these are Sony disks: Beethoven Symphony #3 Schubert Symphony #9 Schuman Symphoniues #2 & #4 Rosini Overtures Mendelsson Symphony #4 Most of these are recordings with Szell as the conductor and were originally performed in the 50s adn 60s. There is some hiss in the 50s recordings but nothing compared to vinyl. Difficult to give an indication of how big these soundstages are - would it suffice to say that they make my Heresy's sound like Belles. Extends well beyond speaker placement - wall of sound stuff. ------------------ 2 * Heresy 2 (mains) 2 * Homemade horn speakers (rears) 1 * REL Strata 3 sub Accuphase E211 amp. Tube monoblocks with separate pre-amp (solid state). Marantz CD6000 player Sony NS900 SACD/DVD player Stax Headphones Humax 5400 digital satellite receiver Sharp Video 32" Sony flat screen 16:9 TV Mogami interconnects Silver Synergistic speaker cable

OK - stike one pre-amp kit. I posted somewhere else asking for recommendations for tube pre-amps. Come on, help me out here - ya know I dont know my arse from my elbow in this area...... Seriously - thanks yet again for the input.

If it wasnt for you early morning guys I would be hear all on my own. Athens is 8 hours ahead of EST (2 hours ahead of GMT). That means that 90% of the time I post something and read the replies the next day. Must be great to get instant feedback. ------------------ 2 * Heresy 2 (mains) 2 * Homemade horn speakers (rears) 1 * REL Strata 3 sub Accuphase E211 amp. Tube monoblocks with separate pre-amp (solid state). Marantz CD6000 player Sony NS900 SACD/DVD player Stax Headphones Humax 5400 digital satellite receiver Sharp Video 32" Sony flat screen 16:9 TV Mogami interconnects Silver Synergistic speaker cable