TroyTN Posted May 6, 2001 Share Posted May 6, 2001 I have a pair of Klipsch RS-3's on my back wall and I was wondering what many of you have found the best height for these on the back wall for optimum surround performance? I have eight foot ceilings. Not sure with the dispersment of sound on these since they are not direct radiating. I have seen some others mention there is a sweet spot for these and suggest a certain degree one should be sitting or mounting these. How high do you have your surround speakers set? Thanks ------------------ Troy... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dougdrake Posted May 6, 2001 Share Posted May 6, 2001 I believe the target height is about 6' or so to the bottom of the speakers. Keep in mind that the dispersion pattern is 60 degrees vertical. You'll need to have them oriented relative to your seating position that the 60 degree spread will hit you. In other words, if they are mounted relatively close to the sides of your listening position, you may have to mount them lower or tilt them down so the sound doesn't go over your head. Did that make any sense at all? Doug Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RossVTaylor Posted May 6, 2001 Share Posted May 6, 2001 Doug, as usual, is right on here. The 6-foot figure puts the speakers 2-3 feet above your seated ear height, which is optimal. Of course, if you watch movies standing up then you'd have to place them much higher. Most people, it seems, tend to mount the surrounds too high on the walls. If your room setup forces a higher installation (like over a window), then you'd do well to angle them downwards (maybe even considerably). For the surrounds, most designers seem to agree they should be about 110 degrees from the front (from the apex of your head). In other words, with zero degrees in front of you and 90 degrees directly to either side, the surrounds would be mounted slightly behind your watching position. You mentioned mounting these speakers on the back wall - that's the best location for rear surrounds (as in a 7.1 setup). If yours is a 5.1 setup, try the speakers on the sides first (if you can). If you can't place them there, THEN try the back wall (or even the ceiling). With the RS-3's wide dispersion design, you can (if you have to) even place one speaker on a side wall and one on a rear wall - not optimal, but certainly possible with this speaker's flexibility. Experiment a bit and let us know more about your HT setup and room layout. Ross Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TroyTN Posted May 6, 2001 Author Share Posted May 6, 2001 I appreciate the help. I have the Denon AVR-5800 which allows me to have side surrounds and back surrounds so I bought a second pair of RS-3's. One pair to each side of my listening position pointing at each other just infront of my listening position per the Denon manual and THX standards. The second pair of RS-3's are mounted behind me 6' high as suggested by Doug (thanks) I had them at ear level and they sound Sooo much better 6' up. I was wondering if I should have the pair to my sides the same height? It seems sincer they are pointed at me I should do something differently? Any suggestions? I should say I tried the RS-3's for my center rear speakers for DTS descrete and Dolby EX but I prefer direct radiating for the center rear speakers and thats when I moved my second pair of RS-3's to my side. Now I have two sets of RS-3's for my surrounds speakers. I can switch my side wall mounted RS-3's on and off while listening to any source and they do not make that much of a presence like the rear wall mounted ones do. Thats is why I am asking how to make sure I get the best sound from the RS-3's being mounted to my sides. Using Ross's analogy of zero degrees is directl infront of me and 90 degrees directly to my right and left my current RS-3's are mounted about 85 degrees, 5' high. They just do not have the clean, precise sound as the other pair of rear wall mounted RS-3's. Any suggestions on improving the side wall mounted RS-3's? Thanks guys...what a great forum this is for us Klipsch lovers... ------------------ Troy... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RossVTaylor Posted May 7, 2001 Share Posted May 7, 2001 Troy, That's a great setup! I, too, have a Denon AVR-5800 and four RS-3's for surrounds. I'm curious about your comment that the Denon manual and THX specs indicate the surrounds should be "pointing at each other just in front of my listening position." I just went through my Denon manual again and I didn't find that. The manual has a few pictures showing surrounds on the side walls, about directly 90 degrees off to the sides of the listener's head. Don't even look at that confusing diagram on page 13, where they seem to show the surround speakers in the front field! AAAARRRGGG! Why did they do that? Just to confuse unsuspecting consumers, I think! I also checked the THX website, again, but I didn't find anything about placing the speakers in front of the listener. THX positioning standards wouldn't apply to these speakers, anyway, because the THX standard calls for dipole speakers (that fire front and back along the side walls) and have a null region. The THX standards call for placement so that the listener is in this null region, so usually directly to the sides of the listener. Wide dispersion surrounds, like the RS-3, have no null region. I've got great sound from my RS-3s with the same receiver, so I know the combo works well. If your side wall RS-3s are lacking, there are a couple of things to check: 1) Try moving them back. If they're in front of you, they'll tend to get "washed out" by the front speakers and their apparent effect won't be nearly as pronounced as if they're to the sides or behind you a bit. 2) Verify that you've got them hooked to the correct surround outputs on the 5800. You mentioned that you can turn the side surrounds on and off, but that doesn't sound right. Usually, the side surrounds are on with all 5.1 material. The rear surrounds come into play for 6.1 and 7.1 (DTS-ES and THX-EX) material, or for some of the sound field modes (NEO or 7-channel music). Make sure your side surrounds are connected to the "Surround Speaker A" outputs and your rear wall surrounds are connected to the "Surround Back" outpouts. The 5800's got lots of connections back there, and they're a bit confusing. It's really easy to mix up the surround connections. With your four RS-3 setup, you shouldn't be using the "Surround Speaker B" outputs. I use the "B" outputs for a pair of Heresy IIs, for music, and when they're on then the side and rear surrounds (the four RS-3s) are all off. If you're using the "B" outputs, or you've reversed the side and back wall surrounds, that could definitely be your trouble. What other speakers are you using and what's your room size? You've got a killer setup! Ross Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TroyTN Posted May 7, 2001 Author Share Posted May 7, 2001 Ross, Thanks for the prompt response. I have Klipsch Forte II's for my mains and RS-3 for the surrounds. It is page 57, the last paragraph where the Denon manual suggests moving the surround speakers be placed slight ahead of the listening positon to get a better effect. Your right, maybe my fronts drown out my secondpair of RS-3's. I have double checked my connections here they are: Surround speaker A (RS-3's on side wall) surround speaker B (RS-3's on back wall) Surround speaker rear center (old pair of bookshelve infinity speakers) direct radiating. My back wall is only 3 feet from seating position with a large window and the RS-3's for my center rear were not as effective as a pair of direct radiatng speakers I had around the house. I thought about the RB-5's (direct radiating) but they are too heavy and large to hang behind me. I even thought about a pair of Quintets for the surround center rear. Your thoughts? I leave my surround speaker A and B on at all times and it sounds pretty nice. If I move my side wall RS-3's behind me slightly, they will be about one foot from the back wall RS-3's. Maybe I can experiment more with moving the RS-3's to the rear center. I would have to mount them high since there is only 12 inches from the top of my window to the ceiling. my room is small, only 15' wide 17' long with 8' ceilings, only one door and large picture window behind couch. I assumed the RS-3 would sound the same on my side wall at 80 degrees from the seating postion as it would be 100 degrees. I would still be looking at the side firing horns. Make sense? If the are mounted in front of me I am looking at the right horn, if they are behind me I am looking at left horn of the RS-3. Thats is if you looked directly at them. It helps to bounch some different configurations at another Klipsch owner. Tro ------------------ Troy... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T2K Posted May 8, 2001 Share Posted May 8, 2001 Just for information,I recently bought some Omnimount brackets to mount surround speakers.Omnimount makes good quality brackets at reasonable prices.I imagine the RS3's are tapped for brackets(don't have RS3's).They make brackets that allow for a 20' angle of the speakers.The model is WQF-20 or WQF-20T.They are drilled with the same hole pattern as the RS3's.The WQF20's allow for more spacing of the speaker from the wall or ceiling.I recently got WQF-T's and am very happy with them.Since Omnimount does not sell direct,I recommend calling Crouse-Kimzey in Fort Worth @ 1-800-433-2105 or 972-660-6100 and ask for Stephanie @ ext.124. They will take your payment and Omnimount will send direct to you.I paid $29.50 each for the WQF-t's and $7.00 UPS.Painless.See below and scroll towards bottom of page under Utility Hardware. http://www.omnimount.com/home.tpl?cart=3198270362261503 Keith Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HT_Andy Posted May 9, 2001 Share Posted May 9, 2001 I'm setting up a 5.1 home theater using a pair of RS-3's as surrounds. Thanks for all the helpful placement information. What do you think about haning the RS-3's vertically on the wall? If I can do that, then I can place them perfectly from listening position, i.e. slightly above & behind. Thanks! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RossVTaylor Posted May 9, 2001 Share Posted May 9, 2001 Troy, I'm at a loss then, as to why you're side-surround RS-3s are lacking in presence. They should be obvious! When my B surrounds are on, my A surrounds are off - but that's my setup. You may just have to play around with them to see. Andy, I don't think you'd be too pleased with the dispersion pattern of vertically mounted RS-3s, but you'll never know unless you try them out. BobG has suggested that you can, if needed, mount RS-3s above the listening position oriented front-to-back. Doug Drake has his wide-dispersion surrounds mounted this way and they work very well. But, vertically on the rear wall may not create the "open, spacial" sound you'd like for movie surrounds. Not that it won't work great - it might be awesome, but I wouldn't hold out great hope and you'll only know by experimenting. Lots of help I've been... I just told two members to "play around and see." Ross ------------------ "Time flies like an arrow. Fruit flies like a banana." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TroyTN Posted May 10, 2001 Author Share Posted May 10, 2001 Ross, So I assume since my first pair of RS3's are six feet high on my back wall that I should also have them six feet high on the side walls just to the side of the listening position? I have read some people feel if the RS3's are to be mounted on a side wall that they be mounted lower than if on a back wall otherwise the dispersion could go over your head. What are your thoughts on height fo rthe RS3's on a side wall? What level do you have your RS3's? Thanks ------------------ Troy... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RossVTaylor Posted May 10, 2001 Share Posted May 10, 2001 The ideal height for surrounds is 2-3 feet above your seated ear, so that works out to about 6 feet or so AGL (above ground level...). Doug mentioned, correctly, that if the speakers are higher that you might want to angle them downwards some. If they're truly 2-3 feet above your ear, however, you probably shouldn't need to angle them. Mine, when installed in the final setup, will be above the ideal height by a couple of feet and will be angled downwards towards the listeners - they'll be mounted on the face of an angled soffit so that they point downwards at about a 40 degree angle from about 8 feet up, in a room 10.5 feet wide. Ross ------------------ "Time flies like an arrow. Fruit flies like a banana." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike Lindsey Posted May 18, 2001 Share Posted May 18, 2001 This is a good thread and has answered some questions I was wondering about. I have some Epic CF-2's and a KLF-C7 Center with a Denon 4800 on the way. I have decided on the RS-3's as well (possibly the RS-7's when I get some feedback on them) but only have one side wall with the Kitchen on the other side of my family room. I was thinking of putting the RS-3's on some stands to the L and R of my couch but don't think that would look right. Especially if they need to be 6 feet in the air. I guess one option would be to hang them from the ceiling. The other option would be to place them on the back wall, like you guys are doing with your back surrounds. Of course, these would be my main surrounds. If I chose this option, and mounted them 6 feet up the wall, would I get the desired surround effects out of them. If you were me, what would you do? Thanks in advance... Mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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