K-Horns vs. Reference

[Iceman]

Sorry for having to ask the total and complete newbie question, but I know nothing about the heritage line. How does it compare to the reference series? How much do these speakers cost? Why have they remained so relatively unchanged? Are they just that good? How loud can they go? Are they better for home theater or for music? Please take notice of the equpment I'm running and realize that I'm not a complete idiot. Thank you very much for your time and compassion

[WMcD]

It is a long story.

The K-Horn was invented in the 1940s. There were some later updates in the mid and treble, and crossovers. Whether these made any big improvement is a matter of debate, except for the addition of a tweeter in about 1949. By anology, anyone who owns a 1950 Steinway is not craving an update.

They're that good. Used prices you can see on e-Bay and shipping can be a big factor. However, you can buy a pair for less than $2000.

The K-Horn is a bass horn for corner placement, plus horn mid and horn treble. A three way system with horns at each position.

Other members of the Heritage system are the Belle and LaScala, each with smaller (less bass expanse) bass horns. Two true Hertitage additions had direct radiator bass units. The Cornwall is a bass reflex with the same driver. The Heresy is a closed box bass, more optimized for size than anything else. Both have horn loaded mid and tweeters. After a while, there were -II versions.

These were followed by some related offspring using horn mid and sometime tweeters too. The Tangent, KLF, Chorus-Forte-Quintet.

Why no change overall in the bass horn loaded designs over the decades? The first part of it may be PWK being stubborn in thinking that no improvement of his brainchilds were necessary or possible. The second part of it may be that the buyers agree. It is a difficult combination to argue around.

The Refs. and Synergy are a product of the new company. They're darn good. But it is a different design theory and production theory. The Heritage hail from a time where speakers were made of expensive plywood and metal. Price pressures and the market's need for something new compel the newer ones.

In certain living rooms, T H E O L D W A Y S D I E H A R D. Smile. With much justification. Some musicians do well with a digital keyboard. Most would like a 1950 Steinway.

Best,

Gil

[lovemyhorns]

I'll just add, yes, they are that good!

[Iceman]

McDermott, thank you very much for your detailed explanation. I guess now I just have to hear them to believe 'em.

[WMcD]

I heard them for the first time Friday after Thanksgiving 1974, in Ithica.

The world of audio reproduction changed for me.

I'd expect that others had a similar experience and that is why the design survived so long. Other corner loaded bass horns like the Hartfield and Tannoy and EV licensed units do very well too.

Best,

Gil

[lynnm]

I prefer my Khorns above all others but had the luxury of living with KLF 30's for a long while before obtaining my Ks. These are two very different "animules".

That said both are capable of inducing shivers of delight ( ie. Something just short of damp undies ) .

I A/B'd the KLF30s and the RF7s and frankly the difference was a Rolls/Bentley type of situation. I would have lived happily with either but preferred the 30's.

The Khorns have an incredibly open soundstage and present an essentially seamless image. By that I mean that the sound seems to originate from somewhere other than the speakers with no tendency for the experience of this sound comes from the left speaker or left woofer but rather the impression is that the pianist is a little left of center and the guy on bass is behind him and to his left. The vocalist is generally in the centre but is moving around a bit especially when he is talking to the audience. The guy on drums stays put at right centre .

Both the 30's and the 7's can accomplish all that is described above but to me the Khorn always has sounded more airy and natural than any other speaker.

[Chris Robinson]

Klipschorns are in a league by themselves. As Lynn and Gil advise, they have HUGE dynamics and a sound that is the size of a house. They need a nice big room to breathe in, and near-field listening (e.g., a 12x12 room) will constrain them.

The Heritage line has many fans here. I personally own the Klipschorns, Cornwalls, a Belle, Heresies. I've heard the RF-7's, Chorus II's and Forte. All are wonderful with the right room, source and amplication, but I would put the Heritage line as my first choice for 2-channel listening. The Reference and Synergy lines would do well with either 2-ch or multi-channel.

I just couldn't bear to part with any of the Heritage speakers I have so they constitute my 5.1 system and the Klipschorns are in the 2-channel system at the other end of the house.

As with the Steinway, I have no further need to tweak my speaker selection. To me, it's as good as I need to get.

[avman]

i CAN say the reference series would sound better than k-horns...IN YOUR DORM ROOM

(probably)

avman.

[Colin]

The Heritage line compared to the Reference series is more of the same Klipsch sound, only larger, flatter, deeper, better defined, more efficient in much larger, heavier, wood panel loudspeakers. Their cost reflect their original prices, versus what they sell for today.

Khorns are to Steinways what the Reference series is to upright pianos. Larger, classier, far more cumbersome, expensive, wider and flatter soundstage, better separation, smoother bass and treble definition, amazingly ultra-sensitivity, extremely revealing, detailed, dynamic, fast paced, effortless, extremely low distortion, incredible on-axis response, superior imaging and bargain prices when compared to Avantgarde Acoustics horns. They sound more like music. My big ole horns easily play over 100dB SPL with flea-powered tube Bottlehead 2A3 Paramour amplifiers rated at 3 watts.

All of the Heritage models are wonderful for music, which means that they certainly can do great for movies, but they need sub-woofer support to get the movie theater boom so many people want with their home movie and music reproduction systems. The Khorn is exceptionally flat across the musical spectrum in my living room, down to about 30Hz. So the accuracy is there, but for movies, I like a little more punch and will dial up more bass. It is NOT an accurate or flat frequency response, but it sure feels nice.

[Chris Robinson]

Colin, as usual, well said!

[jhawk92]

Here, here Colin, very well said. I love my Heritage HT and my K-horns sing when playing 2-ch selections. You can't go wrong with Heritage. Reference sounds good, but I'll take my "old boxes" any day of the week.

[Daddy Dee]

This thread has some excellent advice and description of the Heritage line. You really do have to go hear them somewhere to hear for yourself. Yes, they are that good. Amazing in fact. I'm amazed when I sit down to listen to my Scalas. Even the Heresy is impressive. I refurb a few Heresy's now and then and had a pair sitting on the floor near the Scalas and was listening to them. I thought, man they sound good. The sound could have been coming out of the Scalas, for my imagination. I was evening wondering for a little while, why am I going to all the trouble to have these big rascals. The Scalas are definitely better, but the Heresy's give a huge percentage of what you get from the larger Heritage speakers in spite of their size.