speakerlab

[ka7niq]

Due to the V shape of the chamber the sound will not reradiate through the cone....You have a better chance of re radiating from the spokes of woofer basket. as far as reradiating in back chamber of a mid driver that motion is very miniscule compared to a woofer cone....What you have been reading on the other sites is voodoo science and half truths of obsessive compulsives pontificating there own false agenda....Paul Klipsch new what he was doing.

"And behold, they melted down all their Gold and made a new God, a Golden Calf while Moses was up on the Mountain"

So, what you are saying is this "If PWK were here, he would not approve" ?

Now Maron, let's look at a possibility ?

Is it not at least possible that SpeakerLab took the Dacron Stuffing effect into account when they made their own woofer for the Klipsch Copy ?

The other day Marion I made me some coffee to wake up.

I was out of sugar, so I used some Honey instead.

The objective was to get the coffee sweet, and the Honey did the trick.

Could it be possible that SpeakerLab intentionally made their woofer parameters " slightly wrong" with the intention of having it "made right" in a tunable fashion by the addition of Dacron ?

My old VMPS speakers come over damped from the factory.

They have a passive radiator with a mass of putty on them.

You simply remove a small amount of the putty until bass is right sounding.

I have not actually seen the SpeakerLab SK bass bin plans.

But some who have claim it says to use Dacron, and even gives an amount.

Now I realize that the owners of SpeakerLab were NOT PWK.

But they were audiophiles, and electrical engineers too.

Pat Snyder worked at Boeing as an engineer, and Dave Grabner owns Bohlender Grabner today.

I am having a difficult time with this Marion.

I simply can't imagine a pair of bright young music loving engineers taking the time to copy the Klipsch Patent, and making their own woofers and Horns, yet screwing everything up by adding stuffing to what they copied ?

COULD it be they actually improved a little on Pauls design, and that is why he hated them so much ?

Could it be he had a "dam, why didn't I think of that moment" when he saw the SpeakerLab SK ?

Angled woofer chambers are fine, but they are still bare naked wood with no stuffing to absorb the sound.

Both the Klipschorn and SpeakerLab SK woofers are playing well up into the midrange, so why not have some damping material in the rear chamber to reduce coloration ?

Lets say the design calls for a 1 cu ft rear chamber, ok ?

Why not make the chamber physically .8 cu ft and stuff the shit out of it instead ?

This way the chamber appears to be 1 cu ft, and you reduce coloration too ?

Am I missing something ?

.

[ZAKO]

Yes we do have a golden calf here....Thats why your wandering around in the desert...If you want to flash around some ones Boeing credentials,,,,,Look at mine,,,or better yet Paul Klipsch. Or better yet Roy Delgato.. The Klipschorn is still in production,,,Speakerlab horn is not,,,and for a good reason,,,It was sloppycopy thinking.

[ka7niq]

Yes we do have a golden calf here....That's why your wandering around in the desert...If you want to flash around some ones Boeing credentials,,,,,Look at mine,,,or better yet Paul Klipsch. Or better yet Roy Delgado.. The Klipschorn is still in production,,,Speakerlab horn is not,,,and for a good reason,,,It was sloppy copy thinking.

It really is a shame Paul is not with us any longer.

He truly was a pioneer, and is missed.

But Maron, times have changed, new Guru's have come onto the scene, people like Bill Fitzmaurice and Tom Danley.

I have been reading their thought on reactance annulling.

There is a program called Hornresponse I think.

I wish I knew how to use it.

According to Hornresponse, below the low frequency cut off of the horn, the rear chamber determines response.

If you port the rear chamber, it rolls off like a ported box at 24 db octave.

But, if you leave it sealed, it rolls off like a sealed box, at 12 db.

You are correct Maron from what I read.

IF the woofer is carefully chosen, and the horn well designed, the two chambers should null perfectly.

Maximum efficiency takes place in this condition.

BUT, Hornresponse shows that if you will give up a little efficiency, often lower bass can result by playing with the rear chamber.

This is JUST what I read, and may be total BS ?

Maybe someone else will chime in with another viewpoint ?

[ZAKO]

Times have changed indeed.....But basic physics have not.....Paul Klipsch would slap the crap out of these wouldbe Gurus.....I remember him doing that to Hartley of Hartley woofer fame....Poor ol Hartley slithered away never to recover again.

[ZAKO]

There is a great article in Stereophile this month in ,,,,AS We See It,,,, J Gordon Holt does a good slap at todays Gurus.... I recommend every body here on this Forum to read it.

[ka7niq]

I used to breed Dobermans, and of course, MY Dogs were the best Maron.

Unfortunately, I overlooked what other breeders had accomplished.

It is called being Kennel Blind.

PWK was a great man, for sure.

Unfortunately, he is no longer with us.

There is much to still be discovered and applied.

I just got my Stereophile, and will look for the article.

[ka7niq]

Times have changed indeed.....But basic physics have not.....Paul Klipsch would slap the crap out of these wouldbe Gurus.....I remember him doing that to Hartley of Hartley woofer fame....Poor ol Hartley slithered away never to recover again.

In Seattle, a friend used his fireplace as an enclosure for the big Hartley.

He sealed his chimney/fireplace.

The big hartley barely moved, yet it flutttered pants legs.

Most impressive!

[ZAKO]

Yes that 24" woofer was really something.....A friend of mine in Chicago used 4 of them in a concrete inclosure, most impressive..

[ZAKO]

I have a three legged Lab...Named Tippy Midnight.....But you ought to see him run. He do,snt know he only has three legs.

[ka7niq]

an Irish Girl was sitting by a swimming pool.

I asked her what she was doing there ?

Her answer "Patty O' Furniture"

[ka7niq]

Yes that 24" woofer was really something.....A friend of mine in Chicago used 4 of them in a concrete inclosure, most impressive..

Hartley was a different company for sure.

They made complete speaker systems with air column midranges, or something like that.

I am only familiar with that big 24 inch driver.

Why did PWK take them to task ?

[ZAKO]

It was about Hartley,s small fullrange speaker...I,ll have to look up the article for details.

[ka7niq]

It was about Hartley,s small fullrange speaker...I,ll have to look up the article for details.

I know Paul did not like BS claims.

I remember meeting him in Detroit at Cobo Hall.

He was wearing a BS Button, as were all his employees.