montigue Posted July 24, 2001 Share Posted July 24, 2001 after extensive research on reveiws and specs. Not to mention some help from my fellow Klipsch klan member's right here at Klisch.com. I have decided on the final two subs that would be perfect for not only my room size but my budget as well. And here they are.... 1. Paradigm PW 2200 retail $799 I can get a demo for $599 2. SVS Model 25-31PC retail $699 I have always valued all of your opinion's BUT NOW I NEED THEM THE MOST!! i'm about to fork out some mucho dinero I want to do the right thing. Please help!!!! ___________________________________ " WHERE KG SERIES LIVE" "SOUND STAGE" Klipsch KG 5.2 mains Klipsch KG 2.2 rears Klipsch KG 2.2 rear center Klipsch C-7 front center Sony Wega 36" Flat screen Sony DTS DVD player Sony HI-FI VCR player Harman Kardon AVR 65 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
forresthump Posted July 24, 2001 Share Posted July 24, 2001 here's what you do - take advantage of the return policies (if you have to with the paradigm) & listen to them with your ears with your equipment at your place. last I heard it takes about 40-60 days to even get an svs, though now that i said that it's probably changed. but maybe somebody has heard both of them & maybe even side by side & can give you THEIR insight. ------------------ go forth & hump the world Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HornEd Posted July 25, 2001 Share Posted July 25, 2001 Monty, the Paradigm is a good solid box for the money and Seb would be the first to tell you so... and your demo price makes it all the better. But if it were my money, I'd put it on SVS... because, for 45 days they will give it back (the only thing it costs you is return shipping). I have chatted via email with a number of SVS customers... and I have yet to hear any of their customers say, HornEd, SVS just didn't measure up to my expectations. Granted, Monty, that at this moment, I own the best that SVS has to offer... and with all my expectations... I too underestimated the power of these tubes. I even set up one tube by its lonesome just to see what it was like... and again it passed expectation. It's just hard to fail... and whether with my herd of 30's or pair of Cornwalls... I am more than satisfied... I just hope you can be too. HornEd Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Curt Jett Posted July 25, 2001 Share Posted July 25, 2001 I was looking at the Paradigm at one point myself. After lots of listening at various B&Ms I still had to ask myself if I would always be asking myself, WHAT IF????? I took SVS up on their 45 day trial and that was the end of that. Just the deepest cleanest bass I have ever heard. Try e-mailing SVS tech support and ask Tom his opinion. Give him your room measurements and listening preferences and he will tell you straight up how they might compare. Most lines, if not all now, are shipping the same week as the order. I waited for my twin 20-39s for about 5 weeks and it was well worth the wait, though not easy. ------------------ Mains: RF-3s Center: RC-3 Rears: RS-3s Sub: Dual SVS 20-39cs Receiver: Onkyo 696 DVD: Toshiba 6200 TV: Mits Diamond WS65907 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seb Posted July 27, 2001 Share Posted July 27, 2001 I love my PW-2200, and the fact I paid the ridiculous price of $670 CANADIAN for it helps too... But if I had your budget and lived in the US I would definitely choose the SVS, basing myself solely on the opinions of basically everyone who experienced the SVS hardware first-hand... and on da man himself, Tom Vodhanel, very honest and intelligent guy. At the very least try them out! ------------------ 'cuz not a lot of people have ever said "Pump up the treble!" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frank_F9 Posted July 28, 2001 Share Posted July 28, 2001 I must say, I love my PW-2200. It was quite honestly the best investment I made in my home theater. She's a rock that goes solidly below 20hz and still remains quick and musical. 8 months after purchasing it, it remains the one piece of hardware I wouldn't replace. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
forresthump Posted July 28, 2001 Share Posted July 28, 2001 could the paradigm PW2200 be the chevy 327 engine of the subwoofers? sorry seb that's before even your parents time ------------------ go forth & hump the world Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RWMIN Posted July 28, 2001 Share Posted July 28, 2001 I would do have to agree with Cjett. Email Tom at SVS and ask. He will let the know. I don't think that particular sub would best the PW2200 at 20-25. In fact the 20-31 w/300 watts has the same 20 hz output and just slightly more from 25 and up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
orthj Posted July 28, 2001 Share Posted July 28, 2001 I own the PW-2200 and it is a monster! Who wants mail order if something goes wrong with it? You can't interact with those you are giving all of the $$$. The output of the PW2200 is simply awesome. I have Forte IIs, which are no slouch, and the PW-2200 never EVER skips a beat (while other subs such as M&K, Velodyne have). I have had it for 3 months and it is better each and every time I hear it. You will not be disappointed, that is a quarantee. The Servo 15 is its big brother, and as you must know, is very highly regarded, ever hear of the trickle down effect...the PW-2200 has benefited from this. I am a fan of the 'old' Klipsch, and have to say that many of Paradigms current models are a better value sound/$ than the 'new' Klipsch. Have fun with the Paradigm. J. ------------------ James D. Orth 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TVodhanel Posted July 28, 2001 Share Posted July 28, 2001 >>>could the paradigm PW2200 be the chevy 327 engine of the subwoofers? sorry seb that's before even your parents time<<< Good analogy! the pw2200 is really one of the best *mass-market*(meaning it has wide spread dealer support) available...at $799 retail...it's VERY good. Course if that's a mouse...than HornEd's CS_Ultras would have to be a rat 6-71/454 on the gas anyone? And the pw2200 and the 20-39cs would both reviewed by Nousaine. 20hz---pw2200/84dB---20-39/91dB 25hz---pw2200/104dB--20-39/105.8dB 25-63hz(avg)---pw2200/108---20-39/109.5 So from 25hz and up...the 20-39 had a dB or two more output. But at 20hz, the 20-39 had 7dBs(or about the same amount of clean output as 2 of the pw2200s). TV Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RWMIN Posted July 29, 2001 Share Posted July 29, 2001 At Paradigms web site (Nousaines data from the review) and from a previous post from you (TV), the Paradigm is shown with an output of 91 DB at 20 HZ. TV initially posted the info on 12-19-2000 PW 2200 - 107.4 / 20 hz 91 This info is from Tom Nousaines review for Sound and Vision and it is posted at the Paradigm web site. The current info at 84 db 20 hz is a mistake, typo? http://www.paradigm.ca/Website/SiteParadigmProduct/PReviews/PReviewsIndex.html This message has been edited by RWMIN on 07-29-2001 at 07:01 PM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TVodhanel Posted July 29, 2001 Share Posted July 29, 2001 No, the first data is from a review done about 2 1/2 years ago. In the last performance check on the PW2200(last months soundvision I believe---VERY recent)...it had lost some real low output...and picked up a little from 25hz and up. A good trade really.Might be something as simply as going with a slightly different tuning point. Whenever Tom Nousaine *re-reviews* a subwoofer...I always use the more current data available(like when he remeasured the BWs). TV Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RWMIN Posted July 29, 2001 Share Posted July 29, 2001 WOW, that's some difference TV. I will be seeing about returning my PW 2200 for the SVS for sure! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TVodhanel Posted July 30, 2001 Share Posted July 30, 2001 >>WOW, that's some difference TV. I will be seeing about returning my PW 2200 for the SVS for sure!<< I really wouldn't suggest that. You have the pw2200 and really like it. From about 25hz and up...both subwoofers are very close in total clean output capability. And that's where 98%+ of all bass is anyway. Sure you might come across a bit of <25hz stuff once in a great while....but it's nothing I'd be repacking the pw2200 over. Now---if you were consider one of our dual 39/S700 packages... TV Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
montigue Posted August 1, 2001 Author Share Posted August 1, 2001 TVodhanel you really are a straight shooter. thanks for your professional advise. If I only had a chance to listen to the SVS. Too bad you can only buy them online. A product that is suppose to be this good should be in retail stores. ________________________________________ " WHERE KG SERIES LIVE" "SOUND STAGE" Klipsch KG 5.2 mains Klipsch KG 2.2 rears Klipsch KG 2.2 rear center Klipsch C-7 front center Sony Wega 36" Flat screen Sony DTS DVD player Sony HI-FI VCR player Harman Kardon AVR 65 Paradigm PW 2200 ? SVS 25-31PC ? i'm so confused!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HornEd Posted August 1, 2001 Share Posted August 1, 2001 Hey there, Monty... Just wanted to add my 2¢ worth of retail vs. Internet. Certainly SVS is good enough to be in retail stores (except, like Klipsch, their blow away character would be tested by other manufacturers "dealer incentives") but then TV would be too busy to build product by hand and give candid, non-money grubbing answers to people like you and me. Klipsch is far from being the world's biggest speaker retailer... but the "headshed" folks in Indy know that competing in the retail world is no picnic... and the "workerbees" in Hope know they can't use the production techniques that PWK did building his reputation by hand. As a consumer, this is a magic time to deal with SVS. They are in their "just" stage... just large enough to honor their commitments, just small enough to give executive level personal service, just successful enough to have virtually no dissenters among consumers or reviewers, and just "just" enough to give honest answers even when it may cost a sale. Be careful what you wish for Monty... much smaller or much larger and SVS may not be able to deliver all that they can just now! You can bet if they land in the clutches of a venture capitalist in order to fund their expansion, today's consumer opportunities will not be the same as tomorrow's. I suppose the best that could happen to Ron & Tom would be to duplicate C. C. Poon's experience at Monarchy... make investments that provide you with financial independence so that you could devote your time and talent to design world class sound gear, enjoy the luxury of a high level of integrity and have them custom manufactured for sale on the Internet at a profit-margin that conventional companies could not live on. Hmmm, wonder if SVS bought a company lottery ticket this week? Being fortunate to catch a little company with a world-class product and the integrity to lay the facts on the line (whatever they may be) is extremely rare in the cut-throat world of electronics retailing... as was glimpsed in the "HornEd sees Red" thread on General Questions that turned over the 1,000 hit mark and started over. In forty years of esoteric business adventures, I have known a lot of companies that are recalled with an "I remember when..." from the gourmet standout "Brambles" (that caught the oil wildcatters' fancy... until the hardworking owner chose to close it rather than sell it and risk having its reputation tarnished) to an emerging Neiman Marcus (the late Stanley Marcus was one of the finest, sharpest and down-to-earth people one could ever hope to know). I've lived longer than expected and worked hard at being a recluse... and it is not easy for me to break the habit of many years... and freely share whatever I can on this board. Fortunately, I am secure enough in my person and my lifestyle that I do not have to look to endorsing companies (like Klipsch, SVS or Monarchy) to either make me feel important or line my pockets. Like most folks, I have opinions that are subject to change from what I learn on this board... hopefully, I have retained a shred of decency by "Mystery Guest Standards"... and the adventures I have had as an entrepreneur have given me experience and insight that may be helpful to others... even though it goes against my reclusive nature and long-standing profit-oriented motivations. Well, Monty, whether you ever buy a "money-back-guaranteed" SVS product on the 'net or not, as the years go by, you have just had an "I remember when SVS was so small that..." experience to remember. I just hope Ron & Tom find a way to meet their high ideals and product standards without working themselves to death in the process. I trust I have not "worn out my welcome" on this board with my lengthy opinionated prose... but being able to share honest (non-political) opinions and a few would be witticisms from time-to-time makes this board as special as a K-horn in full Mahler (in homage to the poster who deemed my reply as "drivel"). As we go through life, few "human wells" can offer the richness in diversity, worthwhile helpfulness, spontaneous humor, and caring concern that this Klipsch monitored and funded Forum has. And, somewhere behind all the walls of words, there are paid and volunteer Klipsch minions who have slipped in an experientially comedic or technically insightful comment that have set the tone. What other electronics' retailer has done as much for its consumer-fans? Yes, Monty, do be careful what you wish for. For right now, there are a lot of 'net related "former employees" of tanked or "throttled down" companies that wish they had the prudence, integrity and measured progress that SVS has enjoyed. Their "Catch 22" challenge is that it is just hard to believe their website... until you actually hear their product... and making it easy for you to hear their product in a retail environment would "gut" their opportunity to bring you build-quality, price and performance. Go figure? PWK did. HornEd This message has been edited by HornEd on 08-01-2001 at 04:17 PM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dubai2000 Posted August 1, 2001 Share Posted August 1, 2001 HornEd I hope you will excuse a newbie from distant shores commenting on your last statement: I do not at all think that 'you have worn out you welcome'. Though I many respects a newbie indeed, I enjoy reading your comments on the various topics (even if I don't always catch your sense of humour), so please go on contributing the way you do (though I have no doubt at all that you'll do so even without my irrelevent words!). And when it comes to SVS I have to add that I am indeed impressed by how they react to people like me who after all made it clear that all enquiries are only preliminary and that any $$-flow is something that can only happen in future. Let's hope that they can keep this attitude and do not turn into a 'major league player' with their often anonymous customer treatment. So I for myself will be willing to give them a try once funds permit. Wolfram Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RWMIN Posted August 1, 2001 Share Posted August 1, 2001 I agree W/ D2000 We all enjoy HornEds information and woderful opinions. He writes them quite well. I wish I was able to convey my thoughts as adaquatly as he does. Horn, Ask T2K about the left feild post I through at him not long ago. Talk about being off topic. \ As for SVS Yout right on regarding TV. I think that's part of the reason so many people want to (and do) buy from him. His knowledge and the mannor that he represents it and himself is SUPERB! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
montigue Posted August 2, 2001 Author Share Posted August 2, 2001 It's people like Horned and his enthusiasm for this hobby that keep my intrest going. ( you can have a million dollar system in your living room but if you don't have anyone to share it with then its just not as fun)...so to reply to the "worn out my welcome" statement from Edhorn I would just like to say your FAR from that Ed. As a matter of fact I beleive most of us think of you as The leader of the KLIPSCH KLAN!! All in favor say I.... hehehe I've decided to put my order in for a SVS after reading the posts on this topic. THANK YOU!! By the way were can I buy $10,000 in SVS stock? Monty AKA Montigue ...proud member of the KKM ___________________________________ "SOUND STAGE" Klipsch KG 5.2 mains Klipsch KG 2.2 rears Klipsch KG 2.2 rear center Klipsch C-7 front center Sony Wega 36" Flat screen Sony DTS DVD player Sony HI-FI VCR player Harman Kardon AVR 65 This message has been edited by montigue on 08-02-2001 at 03:01 AM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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