Surround Speaker Basics

[Fried Elliott]

I have a couple of questions about surround sound.

What is actually being recorded for the surround tracks? What I am trying to ask is, what do the producers/recording process intend for you to hear on those channels? Does anything go or is the sound of "lesser quality"? It seems this question would have some bearing on how to spend your speaker $$$ to get the most for your buck.

It seems to this rookie that four identical speakers, LR front and surround would be the ideal setup (plus the center and sub). Is this a good working theory?

But practically, isn't the "important" sound all upfront in the center and front pair, and doesn't economics enter into the picture?

To illustrate this point, it just seems morally wrong (if not a waste of the planet's limited high quality speaker resources) for some of you guys to relegate a pair of Cornwalls to spending their lives as surrounds when they could be worshipped and cherished as the primary pair in my system instead!!!

My other question has to do with surround speaker placement. Assuming we put them even or just slightly back of our listening position (<18 in.) as discussed in previous threads, what elevation is best: on the floor(tilt up?), ear level, or closer to the ceiling tilting down? Due to the geometry of our room, if we go ear level, they are going to be only about 3 feet away. Problem?

Thanks!

fried

This message has been edited by Fried Elliott on 08-20-2001 at 02:15 PM

[dougdrake2]

"What is actually being recorded for the surround tracks? What I am trying to ask is, what do the producers/recording process intend for you to hear on those channels? Does anything go or is the sound of "lesser quality"?"

Dolby Digital and DTS are designed as full spectrum, full power to all channels, as opposed to the old Dolby Pro which could get by the low power center and rear channels, due to limited use and bandwidth. Some movies (like U-571) put a lot of contect in the rears (as I recall). Also, with the new music formats (DVD-A, SACD, DTS Audio), mixers are putting more content in the rear channels. So, no, it would not be a waste to put your resources in the rear, assuming you have the fronts/sub well taken care of first.

"It seems to this rookie that four identical speakers, LR front and surround would be the ideal setup (plus the senter and sub). "

Yes, that would be ideal, except I would say 5 identical speakers, plus sub. However, most rooms can't (or owner's won't) handle 5 full size/full range speakers. Also, for the surrounds, you get into a difference in desired listening effects between surround music and surround theater. Typically, people prefer non-direct speakers (like dipoles or the Klipsch WDST design found in the RS-3) for theater, and direct radiating speakers (your typical mono-pole) for surround music.

"To illustrate this point, it just seems morally wrong (if not a waste of the planet's limited high quality speaker resources) for some of you guys to relegate a pair of Cornwalls to spending their lives as surrounds when they could be worshipped and cherished as the primary pair in my system instead!!!"

This sounds like a thinly veiled attempt to cause some Cornwall owners to assuage their guilt by offering to give you their speakers (LOL).

"My other question has to do with surround speaker placement. Assuming we put them even or just slightly back of our listening position (<18 in.), what elevation: on the floor(tilt up?), ear level, or closer to the ceiling tilting down? Due to the geometry of our room, if we go ear level, they are going to be only about 3 feet away. Problem?"

Typically, assuming you use WDST-type speakers, best surround results are found by mounting them about 6-7 feet (to their bottom) above the floor, just behind the listening position. You have to be sure, though, that the "cone of dispersion" (roughly 60 degrees on the vertical) will hit the listening area. IOW, if your rear speakers are too close to the listening area, the sound will go over your head. In that case, you can angle the speakers down to fix that.

If you use direct-radiating speakers for the rears, you would probably mount them either behind you or directly on the side, pointed at your seats. Some people put them on speaker stands some distance back from the rear corners of the couch.

Somewhere in this tome there might be some useful info. If not, well.... Good luck.

Doug

[t-man]

Doug made some great comments. I am in the camp that still believes that economics and space DO come into the picture. Therefore, I still think it is fine to use smaller rear speakers. Personally, I enjoy my direct radiating speakers just behind and to the side of my couch at ear level. I really have no other choice given my room.

T-man

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KG 5.5 (mains)

KG 2.2v (center)

KG 1 (rears)

KSW-12 (sub)

Denon AVR 681/1601

Toshiba SD-3109 DVD

Kenwood LVD700 LD

Sony CD changer

Sony 27" Trinitron

Sony PLX I

[ColaBear]

FE,

I am in the direct radiating speaker camp. Since the channel is a full range channel, why not use speakers as capable as your mains. I originally had my speakers set up several feet behind my listening area. I then moved them to the sides per Dolby Lab site and a recommendation from a fellow Legend owner. Big difference in sound and effects. I must add that I do have a rather large room. The side surrounds are about 12 feet from the center of my listening area. I tried the WDST, but didn't care for it....sounded kind of thin. But there are many on theis site that favor the KSP-S6 as the best way to do surrounds, both side and rear. Hope this helped!

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KLF-30 mains

KLF-C7 center

KLF-30 side surrounds

KG 3.5 rear surrounds

KSW200 subwoofer

Denon AVR5800

Pioneer Elite DV-09

Pioneer Elite PD-F19

RCA DTC100 DSS/HDTV

Sony Playstation 2

Denon MD1000

Vidikron Epoch D-600

Vutec 100" 4:3 1.5 gain