kentmjohnson Posted July 15, 2005 Share Posted July 15, 2005 I am curious if the Denon products in conjunction with Klipsch speakers seem to produce to much clear/highs? I used to to have the KG5.5's and they weren't that bright. I assume since the KLF-20's have seperate horns that might cause this. I am thinking of upgrading to Parasound and hoping that the speakers aren't as bright. Anybody have any experiences with these combinations? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zen Traveler Posted July 15, 2005 Share Posted July 15, 2005 I almost don't know how to respond. Some may think they sound TOO good. Oops, that would be me. I have a 5.1 system using the Denon 3803 with KLF-20's/KLF C-7/ RS-3's and a KSW 15 in a 1600 sq. ft room and it sounds great! I have 2 other Denon/Klipsch systems that also sound phenominal! That being said I haven't felt the need to upgrade to Parasound, however I have heard good things about their combination. [edit: I realize this was a 2 channel post, but wanted to put in my .02} Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kentmjohnson Posted July 15, 2005 Author Share Posted July 15, 2005 Just curious what you run your bass and treble settings at? I run mine at +2 bass and -2treble and they still seem a bit bright and definitely lacking on the bass side(I have a cement foundation that doesn't help plus I run the old AVR-3300 receiever.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zen Traveler Posted July 15, 2005 Share Posted July 15, 2005 ---------------- On 7/15/2005 9:01:45 PM kentmjohnson wrote: Just curious what you run your bass and treble settings at? I run mine at +2 bass and -2treble and they still seem a bit bright and definitely lacking on the bass side(I have a cement foundation that doesn't help plus I run the old AVR-3300 receiever.) ---------------- Sorry. I don't know anything about that model. Maybe I shouldn't have replied in the 2 channel section. {edit:BTW I have my bass and treble set at "0"} The foundation in that HT set up is cement also, and I have the ksw-15 with it. Insofar as the bass is concerned crank that bad boy up if it's not cooking. I had a Yamaha receiver in that configuration before and it was bright--Since the Denon 3803, No problem. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kentmjohnson Posted July 16, 2005 Author Share Posted July 16, 2005 I have the rsw-12 and bass is no problem at all on the sub. I have just heard some people say that the KLF-20's hit pretty hard and I have yet to see it. The KG5.5's did hit hard though. Maybe if I go with a parasound that will change. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dragonfyr Posted July 16, 2005 Share Posted July 16, 2005 As so many make this claim, I would love to know what distinguishes Denon's topology from the competition - and how it is so radically different from other SS and Tube units. This seems like a wonderful opportunity to explain this phenomena. As seldom has any line had so many claims made regarding its performance and so many been made against others such as Yamaha. I would love to have the subjective difference quantified into something substantial. I run a Denon 3803 for my HT multichannel set up and it is fine. But personally I have not experienced any thing that would qualify as a religious experience. And in fact, I would actually prefer the unit with either more substantial isolated amplification or better yet- to find the same or similar unit in only a pre- format without paying for the limited amplification section. And the alternatives where the separates jump up substantially in price are not justifiable by me simply to watch movies and special effects. Inquiring minds want to know! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zen Traveler Posted July 16, 2005 Share Posted July 16, 2005 ---------------- On 7/16/2005 1:20:55 AM dragonfyr wrote: As so many make this claim, I would love to know what distinguishes Denon's topology from the competition - and how it is so radically different from other SS and Tube units. .... I would love to have the subjective difference quantified into something substantial. .... And the alternatives where the separates jump up substantially in price are not justifiable by me simply to watch movies and special effects. Inquiring minds want to know! ---------------- Well, I would love to be the one to explain "the subjective difference quantified into something substantial," but technically I'm not the one to do it . Let me try to give my subjective explanation and a weak attempt to explain it technically: My personal experience with the Denon-Yamaha debate. The short part of a long story is that I bought a Denon 4802 R for my main (but small) HT. I was/am very happy with it. I moved my Legend based system to a large Workout room along with my Yamaha RXV 800. It sounded OK at lower volume, but it didn't fill up the room. When I turned up the volume it got fatiguing to my ears very quickly. I went to my local tweeter and got a deal on a pioneer (don't remember the model #). When I cranked up the volume to get it loud enough it shut down on high dB passages on movies right off the bat. I took it back and got the Denon 3803. As soon as I hooked everything up and watched a few movie scenes and listened to some music at levels that were very loud and enjoyable compared to the other 2 units, I realized this was the keeper. I wondered why (obsessed may be a better word) the 110 watt per channel Denon sounded better than the 100 watt per channel Yamaha. I got out the spec sheets and went down the list. The 2 things I found were: 1) The Denon was a heavier machine weighing in at 36 lb. vs. the Yammi's 28 lb. My conclusion was that Denon used a heavier brick or their amplification section was more substantial. 2) The main thing that caught my eye was the Power consumption number of the machines. Unfortunately I don't have the number of the Yamaha in front of me, but the Denon 3803 is rated at 7 amps. If memory serves me correctly it was almost 2 1/2 times higher than the Yamaha. Then after researching why people bought separates it appeared the common denominator was higher dynamic range through high current design. When I asked why these separate amplifiers were so heavy, I was told because they needed to be to deliver efficient power (of course I have just recently learned of the sunfire amps). Well, I put 1 and 2 together and developed my opinion. I am in complete agreement with you on the cost/enjoyment justification for buying separates. I don't feel the need to go that route yet. {BTW, It wasn't as much of a religious epiphany for me when I changed receivers as much as a wood getting experience, if you get my drift.} Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikekid Posted July 16, 2005 Share Posted July 16, 2005 Isn't the 3803 about $400 dollars more than the 800?? Mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zen Traveler Posted July 16, 2005 Share Posted July 16, 2005 ---------------- On 7/16/2005 5:12:35 PM Mikekid wrote: Isn't the 3803 about $400 dollars more than the 800?? Mike ---------------- I paid $775 for the Yamaha RXV 800 and $850 for the Denon AVR 3803. If I bought the Denon first, I wouldn't have needed to upgrade. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikekid Posted July 16, 2005 Share Posted July 16, 2005 I realize you were "upgrading".The 3803 msrp was $1,199.00 when it came out while the 800 was $799.00. "I wondered why (obsessed may be a better word) the 110 watt per channel Denon sounded better than the 100 watt per channel Yamaha. I got out the spec sheets and went down the list. The 2 things I found were: 1) The Denon was a heavier machine weighing in at 36 lb. vs. the Yammi's 28 lb. My conclusion was that Denon used a heavier brick or their amplification section was more substantial. 2) The main thing that caught my eye was the Power consumption number of the machines. Unfortunately I don't have the number of the Yamaha in front of me, but the Denon 3803 is rated at 7 amps. If memory serves me correctly it was almost 2 1/2 times higher than the Yamaha." To compare these receivers is pointless...two completely different price/performance classes. That was my point........... Take care Mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zen Traveler Posted July 16, 2005 Share Posted July 16, 2005 ---------------- On 7/16/2005 7:12:03 PM Mikekid wrote: To compare these receivers is pointless...two completely different price/performance classes. That was my point........... Take care Mike ---------------- I was a newbie at the time I bought the Yamaha and at the hands of the salesperson. When I bought the Denon I was somewhat more knowledgeable. The above mental process was done AFTER the fact. If I knew then, what I know now, I would never have bought the Yamaha. That was my point. I want someone to learn from my mistake. I had the chance to buy either one on the initial purchase. They were in the same showroom. I was looking at Watts per channel and didn't understand how those numbers worked--I have since learned. Like you said they are two different machines, but not necessarily to a Newbie {edit: BTW, I have nothing against Yamaha} Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dragonfyr Posted July 22, 2005 Share Posted July 22, 2005 As I mentioned, I have the Denon and it is OK. Not bad and nothing spectacular and very current limited when pushed to its limits.. What I would much prefer is the Pre/Processor section available as a separate unit without the limited amplication section at ~ half the price. Now THAT would be a unit worth checking out! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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