DrWho Posted December 21, 2005 Share Posted December 21, 2005 ...and Acoustic Elegance HE15 (Deon's baby) still seem a while away.... January! [] (if all goes well) Btw, I think you might be overstressing the cabinet bracing issue. Even with a perfectly rigid enclosure the cabinet will vibrate because the moving piston will end up moving the entire box (equal and opposite reactions). So there is a point of diminishing returns as a function of the cabinet mass. Usually, anything you might do to increase the mass (ie, doubling up on panels) is also going to reduce vibrations too. Polyfill inside the cabinet also goes a long way in reducing cabinet vibrations because it acts as a buffer between the pressurized air and the sides of the cabinet...so don't forget to do that either. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jay481985 Posted December 21, 2005 Author Share Posted December 21, 2005 damnit by april the tumults might be released (crosses fingers) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
formica Posted December 21, 2005 Share Posted December 21, 2005 Btw, I think you might be overstressing the cabinet bracing issue. Even with a perfectly rigid enclosure the cabinet will vibrate because the moving piston will end up moving the entire box (equal and opposite reactions). Or the entire home's structure... as in my upstairs living room. Wood structures naturally flex... I'm hoping my basement install will reduce this with my sub bolted to the concrete floor. I'll attempt to isolate it from the wall in which it is installed... ROb Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jay481985 Posted December 21, 2005 Author Share Posted December 21, 2005 ...and Acoustic Elegance HE15 (Deon's baby) still seem a while away.... January! [] (if all goes well) Btw, I think you might be overstressing the cabinet bracing issue. Even with a perfectly rigid enclosure the cabinet will vibrate because the moving piston will end up moving the entire box (equal and opposite reactions). So there is a point of diminishing returns as a function of the cabinet mass. Usually, anything you might do to increase the mass (ie, doubling up on panels) is also going to reduce vibrations too. Polyfill inside the cabinet also goes a long way in reducing cabinet vibrations because it acts as a buffer between the pressurized air and the sides of the cabinet...so don't forget to do that either. drwho what do you know about the release of the fabled he-15? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrWho Posted December 21, 2005 Share Posted December 21, 2005 Go read the AES forums...you'll find a link on the mainsite: http://www.aespeakers.com/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jay481985 Posted December 22, 2005 Author Share Posted December 22, 2005 I thought I read all the forum posts and no talk of the he-15??? Also I did see a subwoofer in the diy picture posts that did have the shape you were talking about Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
formica Posted December 22, 2005 Share Posted December 22, 2005 I thought I read all the forum posts and no talk of the he-15??? Jay, you should be ashamed for not being able to find the reference to "theBeast Mk-II" on the forum somewhat related to the unreleased HE15 Mk-II. I'd understand if you were a babyboomer or something...[] theBeast Mk-II Pictures theBeast Preliminary specs: Those pages were produced before Deon RE-teamed up with John at AE... so it's not technically the HE15 MKII (actually they are of a 18" hybrid [:S]). ROb Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jay481985 Posted December 22, 2005 Author Share Posted December 22, 2005 OH me im Generation X ??? hahah im only 20 see sn for birthday.... But I heard of the beast but ...... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kenratboy Posted December 25, 2005 Share Posted December 25, 2005 I did not real all 4 pages - but with a flexible cable - the cabinet would COMPRESS, but not EXPAND - a rigid brace will not let either happen. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom Adams Posted December 26, 2005 Share Posted December 26, 2005 Hmmmmm.....this thread has me wondering how well a honeycomb aluminum sandwiched composite enclosure would perform. We use this method to create floorboards and for the cabinet structures in our aircraft. The same method is used for all sorts of items from engine cowl doors to structural members. These panels are incredibly lightweight and can take some serious loads before failure. Hmmmmmm......... Tom Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jay481985 Posted December 26, 2005 Author Share Posted December 26, 2005 wow why have I not thought about that (hits self over head) that is strong material, the honeycomb composite (usually carbon fiber or fiberglass, right Tom Adams?) I guess thin it out by adding two thin pieces of sheetmetal to form lightweight sides. How are they on vibration? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrWho Posted December 26, 2005 Share Posted December 26, 2005 It's not the strength of the material that is a concern. It's the fact that the panel faces vibrate sympathetically, coloring the sound. I do not believe a honey-comb structure would be any more resitant to vibration than a solid piece of the same thickness. The best way to reduce vibrations is to move the natural resonation of the cabinet face to a frequency outside the frequencies being reproduced by the driver. Every time you cut the surface area of the panel in half, you double the frequency...and this can be easily done with a single cross-sectional brace. Still not out of the frequency range? Then cut each new half in half with two cross-sectional braces. This is usually just about all you need to do. And lastly, a solid frame is a lot heavier than a honey-comb frame (in fact, the whole purpose of honey-comb is to maintain almost the same strength, while weighing much much less). A heavier cabinet will be as a complete system harder to move back and forth by the changing momentum of the driver. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jay481985 Posted December 26, 2005 Author Share Posted December 26, 2005 drwho did you ever see the speaker that vibrates with the music.... I know it goes against all the train of thought but if I can find it, it was 13,000 yeah ..... but it was supposed to vibrate with the music much like a violin resonants to add color to the string. But it was supposed to sound great with classical music. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrWho Posted December 27, 2005 Share Posted December 27, 2005 Ya, I remember reading about it...Cabinet vibration will always be there no matter what we do, so trying to make them sound pleasing is by no means an invalid approach. But they should still be reduced as much as possible (ie, few "good cabinet distortions" are better than many "good cabinet distortions"). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jay481985 Posted December 27, 2005 Author Share Posted December 27, 2005 something vienna company made it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jay481985 Posted January 5, 2006 Author Share Posted January 5, 2006 no no no, not a pyramid....a "triangular prism." A 5 sided cabinet. The bottom and top look like equilateral triangles and then each side face is a rectangle. The drivers are still normal front firing (no funky angles). In fact, a PR must fire horizontally. This makes the only "free" panels the top and bottom, so bracing would only need a vertical pole in the center. And I'm not sure why the heck you would need so many PR's for a dual tumult setup. Two 18's per driver is all you need. Also, you might want to look into building an active peaking 2nd order highpass filter to go in front of your amplifier...it will limit cone excursion, while also increasing SPL AND decreasing the necessary cabinet volume. I've got a design here somewhere I can show you...it basically makes the sub indestructible. Btw, since you've got two drivers you might want to consider going with a stereo subwoofer setup (or at the very least a mono setup with a driver in each corner). It really helps balance the sound out and you most certainly don't have to worry about maxSPL with a tumult [] DrWho do you have insider information!!! with the new klipsch subwoofer line that is! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CECAA850 Posted January 5, 2006 Share Posted January 5, 2006 no no no, not a pyramid....a "triangular prism." A 5 sided cabinet. The bottom and top look like equilateral triangles and then each side face is a rectangle. The drivers are still normal front firing (no funky angles). In fact, a PR must fire horizontally. This makes the only "free" panels the top and bottom, so bracing would only need a vertical pole in the center. And I'm not sure why the heck you would need so many PR's for a dual tumult setup. Two 18's per driver is all you need. Also, you might want to look into building an active peaking 2nd order highpass filter to go in front of your amplifier...it will limit cone excursion, while also increasing SPL AND decreasing the necessary cabinet volume. I've got a design here somewhere I can show you...it basically makes the sub indestructible. Btw, since you've got two drivers you might want to consider going with a stereo subwoofer setup (or at the very least a mono setup with a driver in each corner). It really helps balance the sound out and you most certainly don't have to worry about maxSPL with a tumult [] DrWho do you have insider information!!! with the new klipsch subwoofer line that is! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TauRus Posted January 5, 2006 Share Posted January 5, 2006 This post is not too serious, and is perhaps remotely relevant to the subject, but for some reason as I was reading through the pages I constantly had this object in my mind as a potential shape for a DIY sub. http://www.biggreenegg.com/home.shtml Now just flip it upside down so that the wider portion is the bottom, ... and there you go - an egg sub Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CECAA850 Posted January 5, 2006 Share Posted January 5, 2006 How about a new Klipsch in wall sub...................... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrWho Posted January 5, 2006 Share Posted January 5, 2006 DrWho do you have insider information!!! with the new klipsch subwoofer line that is! don't think so... A triangle shaped sub (single active, dual passive) has been an idea of mine for a while - and I'm sure others have thought of it too. It's cool though to see klipsch pumping out something that I've thought of (just shows I'm thinking along the right lines) [] I'm not sure what the price point for the new subs are, but I'm pretty sure they're not going to outperform the Ultra II subs (the last thing you need is to compete with your own product). Or if they do outperform, then they will most likely far exceed them (in both price and performance). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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