vman71 Posted December 26, 2005 Share Posted December 26, 2005 Cross-Over experts, I'm going to attempt to upgrade some of the parts on my CII and C7 cross-over networks. I know that space is limited using the stock PCB, therefore limits the number of upgrades one can do. Can somebody provide a list of recommended parts to swap for each speaker cross-over? Also, where to get the parts would be helpful. The most detailed description of the parts would be appreciated. Santa got me the tools to do some basic soldering, so I'd like to give it a shot. Thanks, Mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
popbumper Posted December 26, 2005 Share Posted December 26, 2005 Mike: My answer can only be of limited help since I do not have the original crossover boards in front of me to assess physical restraints. What I have found is that on most, there is enough room to replace HF caps and inductors (and resistors if present), but not enough room to change out the LF section components or midrange autoformer. While "incomplete", some reasonable performance gains can be gotten from addressing the HF and midrange caps/inductors. Again, not knowing the "geography" of your boards, I can suggest Parts Express for most parts, including Kimber capacitors and Jantzen air core inductors. Iuse these parts in my K-stacks, and was also able to mod KLF20 networks with these parts. Good luck! Chris Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
colterphoto1 Posted December 26, 2005 Share Posted December 26, 2005 I might take this opportunity to bang the drum for Chris's K-Stack series of crossovers. He has a replacement for the KLF-C7 that made a definite improvement in the dialog on mine. His is made of top quality parts and makes the Klipsch original xover look like it was made by Playschool. It's an easy mod to do, save your solding iron for other projects, this is a ready-to plug and play mod that takes just a few minutes to swap out. Original can be left on the jack cup in case you sell or want to swap back later. Michael Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deang Posted December 26, 2005 Share Posted December 26, 2005 Mike -- The great majority of improvement will be found by replacing the capacitors which are of relatively poor quality. Since Klipsch used air core inductors in the HF circuits of those speakers there isn't much point in replacing them. There is an iron core in parallel with the midrange, and some benefit might be derived by replacing it with an air core, but I don't think you can get it in there. Since it's not in series with the driver, it's not critical. The inductor in the low pass section is fine, but you might consider replacing the 68uF electrolytic with a new one. Forget about putting a polypropylene in there -- there isn't enough room, but an electrolytic for that position is fine anyways. When you pull your networks out, you will find the values of the capacitors clearly marked. Use the Kimbers -- they sound good, fit nice, and have long enough leads so you can stack the caps if you choose. www.partsexpress.com(4) 2uF, part #027-856 (2) 6uF, part #027-878(2) 20 ohm resistor, #005-20 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vman71 Posted December 26, 2005 Author Share Posted December 26, 2005 Chris, Thanks for the advice! Michael, I too have the K-Stack for my C7 and am very happy with it. Just thought about trying to upgrade the original cross-over.Dean,As always, you are a gentleman and a scholar! Not sure if I'll make them look as awesome as you do but I wanted to give it a try. They still might be heading out if I can't do it.You all are great and I'm always thankful to be part of this BB!Mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vman71 Posted December 27, 2005 Author Share Posted December 27, 2005 Dean, Is there a part number you'd recommend for the 68uF electrolytic? I tried looking it up but there are ones with different voltages and I'm not sure which one to get? Thanks, Mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vman71 Posted December 27, 2005 Author Share Posted December 27, 2005 Does it make a difference by using Kimber or Auricap? Is one better than the other? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deang Posted December 27, 2005 Share Posted December 27, 2005 Basically the same cap. Both rolled at the same place with the same film. Lead terminations are slightly different. The Kimbers leads will drop through the holes of the PCB without fuss. Auricaps can be problematic at times. http://www.partsexpress.com/pe/pshowdetl.cfm?&DID=7&Partnumber=027-356 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vman71 Posted January 3, 2006 Author Share Posted January 3, 2006 The parts arrived today. It looks as though it is going to be a very tight fit on the PCB. I'd like to see pictures of completed upgraded Chorus II networks so that I can have a better idea of how things are going to be laying out. If you cannot attach the files here, please email them to me at: mvansloten@gmail.com Thanks, Mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deang Posted January 4, 2006 Share Posted January 4, 2006 "I'd like to see pictures of completed upgraded Chorus II networks so that I can have a better idea of how things are going to be laying out." Uh, if you can't do this without pictures I strongly suggest you find someone else to do it. You have to think in three dimensions, and you may have to drill holes. I haven't done a set of Chorus II's in almost a year -- I just plain don't remember. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vman71 Posted January 5, 2006 Author Share Posted January 5, 2006 Dean, I just read through your post from 12-7-04 called "DIY Crossover". I created a "printable" word document to serve as a manual. The very thorough job you did with explaining the process along with the pictures is exactly what I needed. I've already pulled the Chorus II crossovers out and just needed to see some pictures of the stacking of caps. All I have to get now is the hot glue. I'm going to attempt this upgrade this weekend. Thanks, Mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
krustyoldsarge Posted January 5, 2006 Share Posted January 5, 2006 Only upgrade I've done to my ChorusII's so far has been the two 2uf tweeter caps, but it was definitely worthwhile. Used two pair of Mil-Spec 1% (US made) poly foil caps I bought off of ebay. Cramped but doable. Used "Shoe-Goo" (not for any particular reason) instead of hot melt to stabilize the install. I agree with the others here who have posted that the tweeter and midrange caps are the first place to attack in the CII crossover. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
popbumper Posted January 6, 2006 Share Posted January 6, 2006 Ugh - the hot glue treatment - another pristine crossover bites the dust. Dean has done his job well here...;>). Chris Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deang Posted January 6, 2006 Share Posted January 6, 2006 Chris, http://www.globalspec.com/FeaturedProducts/Detail/HenkelLoctite/Potting_and_Encapsulating/15773/0 Partially or completely potting the parts is a good thing. At the very least parts should be securely attached to the boards and not supported by their leads. You make a great product, but instead of showing up here from time to time to criticize my work why don't you instead spend the time trying to find an adhesive acceptable to you so you can properly secure the parts to your boards. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
popbumper Posted January 9, 2006 Share Posted January 9, 2006 Dean: Working in the contract manufacturing business on circuit boards, I am aware of the methodologies and requirements for secure manufacturing. Your recommendattions are just that - recommendations; they do not change the integrity or quality of the product, and nobody beside you seems concerned. On the other hand, what you consider criticism is justified - how you could possibly take pride in the hot glue mess that you have solicited in past photos is beyond me. I'll put the quality of my product up against your reworks, as is, anytime, without embarrasment. To close, I recall in the recent past a time when I wished for, even politely asked for your inputs on this product. You having chosen to blatantly ignore my requests for your assistance, that time expired. I neither solicit nor require your inputs, and do not recognize your "expertise" as some may. I see words like "gentleman and scholar" and simply shake my head; I certainly missed the evidence of this. Thank you for sharing the photo of the product with the group. Your approval/disapproval is insignificant; you should not think so much of yourself. Chris Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deang Posted January 9, 2006 Share Posted January 9, 2006 Working in the contract manufacturing business on circuit boards, I am aware of the methodologies and requirements for secure manufacturing. Then you should use them. Your recommendattions are just that - recommendations; they do not change the integrity or quality of the product, and nobody beside you seems concerned. I'm not 'concerned', it's not my product. However, since you take such joy in taking stabs at the hot melt I thought it would be good to point out that it's a better alternative then supporting capacitors by their leads. On the other hand, what you consider criticism is justified - how you could possibly take pride in the hot glue mess that you have solicited in past photos is beyond me. I'll put the quality of my product up against your reworks, as is, anytime, without embarrasment. Yep, hot melt is messy/nasty stuff, and there sure isn't any way to to make things pretty when you use it. But a network sitting inside a speaker takes quite a beating, so it becomes less about looks and more about protection. As far as putting the quality of your product up against my hot melt wonders --it's not like I issued a challenge for cry'in out loud. You have a great product, and I've never said otherwise. To close, I recall in the recent past a time when I wished for, even politely asked for your inputs on this product. You having chosen to blatantly ignore my requests for your assistance, that time expired. Really? So why are all the parts you use the ones I recommended to you? Your recollection of this is sure different than mine. You were going to send me a copy of the instruction manual for my input and a finished network for evalution -- of which you did neither -- even though you had both my phone number and shipping address. You then disappeared off the forum for almost four months, then coming back explaining how you had lost your job but was still making progress and moving forward with the K-stack. There were some emails from you that I received at work, that weren't being ignored, but like everyone else's was taking a back seat to the 23 LAN projects I was working at the time. Don't make the mistake of thinking it was personal -- everyone here can tell you how long they sometimes have to wait to get an email response from me. I neither solicit nor require your inputs, and do not recognize your "expertise" as some may. LOL, well not anymore you don't -- I guess you got everything from me you needed. I see words like "gentleman and scholar" and simply shake my head; I certainly missed the evidence of this. Yeah, the scholar thing was a bit over the top. If you've missed evidence of gentlemanly behavior from me it's because you're not paying attention. In spite of our differences I still recommend the K-stack to those seeking the ultimate upgrade both on the forum and email. I have also opted not to offer my own product to compete against it -- though I could. Thank you for sharing the photo of the product with the group. Your approval/disapproval is insignificant; you should not think so much of yourself. I think thou dost protest too much. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
popbumper Posted January 9, 2006 Share Posted January 9, 2006 Dean: I would enjoy the opportunity to speak with you offline if you welcome it, but I need your permission. Let me know if and when, and I will make the effort. Thanks. Chris Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deang Posted January 9, 2006 Share Posted January 9, 2006 Yeah, we need to put an end to this nonsense. 937-299-6324 -- give me a minute to clear the hot melt out of my ears. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
popbumper Posted January 9, 2006 Share Posted January 9, 2006 Dean: I'll phone you tonite. If there is a better time than others to do so, please say, otherwise I'll shoot for like 9:30. Thanks! Chris Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deang Posted January 9, 2006 Share Posted January 9, 2006 That's a good time -- I'll be here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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