sfogg Posted January 1, 2006 Share Posted January 1, 2006 Jeff, "Duke, if I'm running 39 watts, is that inclusive of peaks? It is hard to imagine that 1/2 way is 39 watts on a 310 watt/channel amp. That means there's 271 watts left in the second 1/2. Are you all sure of these calcs? " Again... volume control means *nothing* with regard to output power. All that does in attenuate the input signal. How much power the amp is going to put out will totally depend upon how much signal it is fed. If you turn down the input level on the Crown it just means it will need to be fed more signal for the same output level.... and vice versa turning up the input levels. I could make your amp put out 300w with the input level at 1/10 of the way up... ditto with it all the way up. Shawn Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duke Spinner Posted January 1, 2006 Share Posted January 1, 2006 perhaps i should re-phrase .... yes, our crude test is wild-a.ss speculation, is not accurate between the hours of 2 pm > 11 am, and only at a temperature of 38* celsius, and only at a latitude of 58*, barometric pressure 30" hg, and corrected for Standard Air, and 50% R.H., and.............. BUT we know he's not listening to 3 watts Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Matthews Posted January 1, 2006 Author Share Posted January 1, 2006 I see what you're saying, Craig, even though no answer has been offered as to what about the Crown makes it punchy and precise. In the "headroom" thread, we seemed to get somewhat of a consensus (including Duke) that it took serious power to get the full dynamic punch. Now, we're back down to 39 watts, so obviously 39 watts delivers a butt-load of fast, precise punch, although it seems Duke and others said otherwise previously. Maybe they didn't, and I didn't understand completely. If that's the feature I want, and headroom is not the issue, I need to know what specs about an amp (specifically my Crown) make it perform with the punch it has. I thought it was power and huge headroom. EDIT: FYI, the input knob on the pre-amp is wide open to the Crown. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duke Spinner Posted January 1, 2006 Share Posted January 1, 2006 well, to speculate some more , Jeff You Listen at some pretty LOUD levels .... if you are averaging 30+ watts it's a wonder the MT don't clip on peaks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Matthews Posted January 1, 2006 Author Share Posted January 1, 2006 Craig, music is Steely Dan's "Home at Last" on the album "Aja." Meter is: GB Instruments GMT-12A (an inexpensive one I bought at Lowe's). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Matthews Posted January 1, 2006 Author Share Posted January 1, 2006 well, to speculate some more , Jeff You Listen at some pretty LOUD levels .... if you are averaging 30+ watts it's a wonder the MT don't clip on peaks Now, we might be getting somewhere, Duke. I ask the questions; you give the answer, and we might go full-round to my initial thoughts. How about this question: Why on Earth would the Crown clip at only 30 watts? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duke Spinner Posted January 1, 2006 Share Posted January 1, 2006 EDIT: FYI, the input knob on the pre-amp is wide open to the Crown. Yowser ...!!! I'm reading this as your average level is 39 watts your peaks gotta be over 1kw, if it wasn't compressed do your IOC lites flash ..?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NOSValves Posted January 1, 2006 Share Posted January 1, 2006 Yup we have some thing accurate to go by here. Give me a break. http://www.tools-plus.com/gbegmt-12a.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sfogg Posted January 1, 2006 Share Posted January 1, 2006 Jeff, "EDIT: FYI, the input knob on the pre-amp is wide open to the Crown. " Still means nothing with regard to output power. Duke, "You Listen at some pretty LOUD levels .... if you are averaging 30+ watts" If the meter is at all accurate that is for sure unless he sits very far away from them or listens from another room. With 40w average a single K'Horn is going to be putting out on average around 120dB a 1 meter, the pair will be louder. That is *well* into the hearing damaging levels. "your peaks gotta be over 1kw, if it wasn't compressed" Maybe not depending upon the material. 10dB of additional dynamics would require about 400w of power. Again... this is all based on the volt meter readings which could be very very wrong. Shawn Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stormin Posted January 1, 2006 Share Posted January 1, 2006 Jeff, Your comparing a true 30wpc rms @ 8 ohms @ 20hz-20khz with a THD around 1% and a damping factor of problably around 30 with a pro-amp at 310 watts rms @ 8 ohms @ 20hz-20khz with a damping factor of more like >500 and you wonder why one has more slam and quicker on the transients than the other. Come on just think about that a minute. They were designed for different listening habits. I bet you at low to moderate listening levels your marantz crushes your crown in smoothness, less hard sounding. Crown was meant to blast a nightclub and your particular marantz was designed for moderate listening in a home environment. It wasn't designed to be moving mass amounts of air from 15 inch woofers and kicking you in the chest. Not a fair comparison at all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NOSValves Posted January 1, 2006 Share Posted January 1, 2006 Craig, music is Steely Dan's "Home at Last" on the album "Aja." Meter is: GB Instruments GMT-12A (an inexpensive one I bought at Lowe's). Do you happen to have a reasonably good quality MP3 of this song? I only have that album on LP. I'd like to try something here with some reasonable quality test equipment. email it to craigostby@comcast.net if you can. Craig Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duke Spinner Posted January 1, 2006 Share Posted January 1, 2006 the Garbage-Bender, as we refer to the company, Meter is 3-5% in accurate Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Matthews Posted January 1, 2006 Author Share Posted January 1, 2006 Yeah, I knew I'd get the cheapy meter picture. [] I won't discount your observation at all, but it was funny to predict that picture would be posted. Now, Duke's comment takes me full circle (because I agree the cheapy meter isn't going to make the difference between 5 watts and 40 watts. So, let's go beyond that. The comment by Duke was that peaks would be way up there. That's the headroom issue, is it not? That was Question 1. Here's Question 2: Is that why I would not get the same precision, punch, speed, whatever out of a 60-watt Marantz? (The real focus here is on punch.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sfogg Posted January 1, 2006 Share Posted January 1, 2006 Yeah... probably wouldn't trust that meter for much in the AC ranges. Also.... Jeff.... do you know how to properly read an analog meter? If you are looking at the wrong scale on the meter your numbers would be very wrong and would explain what appears to be insane SPL numbers. Best bet... just buy an SPL meter at Radio Shack and we can figure everything out from there too and be more accurate with it. Shawn Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Matthews Posted January 1, 2006 Author Share Posted January 1, 2006 Shawn, I read the correct scale. As to the SPL meter, I am hearing $60 is what they run. Don't want to chunk the $60 for a one-time use. If I was in the stereo business, that'd be different. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Matthews Posted January 1, 2006 Author Share Posted January 1, 2006 Craig, I think I can get you the tune. Hang tight. Also, how about some answers to Questions 1 and 2, above? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Matthews Posted January 1, 2006 Author Share Posted January 1, 2006 Jeff, I bet you at low to moderate listening levels your marantz crushes your crown in smoothness, less hard sounding. Noooo. Checked that out last night. For example, on "Hey Nineteen," the drummer is playing the high-hat on a 2-count with his left hand and a 4-count with his right, hitting the snare on the 3rd count. Through, the Marantz, you can't hear the 4 count going. Just the 2-count. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duke Spinner Posted January 1, 2006 Share Posted January 1, 2006 $60 is well worth figuring what your doin' to your hearing, Jeff .... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sfogg Posted January 1, 2006 Share Posted January 1, 2006 ", I read the correct scale. " If that meter is accurate and you actually listen at those levels kiss your hearing goodbye then........ http://www.dangerousdecibels.org/hearingloss.cfm "As to the SPL meter, I am hearing $60 is what they run." Anywhere from about $30 and up. Though most meters can't even read accurately at 120dB as the microphones compress above 105 to 110dB and also distort badly up there. Shawn Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stormin Posted January 1, 2006 Share Posted January 1, 2006 Here's Question 2: Is that why I would not get the same precision, punch, speed, whatever out of a 60-watt Marantz? (The real focus here is on punch.) Jeff, Your marantz is 30wpc not 60 not 90. 30wpc ss compared to 310 wpc ss with different design goals and listening habits in mind. With the way you like to move the woofers you are leaving the marantz in the dust. I will say again its not a fair comparison and quit picking on that poor little marantz. GEESH Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.