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Got my '74 Cornwalls Tuesday....


Chris Garrett

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Hello all,

Well I guess a little bit of money and some luck can buy someone admission into a classic fraternity and I'm happy to gain entry. My 1974 'M' coded Cornwalls arrived at the Yellow Freight depot here in Miami on Tuesday morning. I picked them up that evening and they were professionally packed by Mark (aka Soundbug1) up in Providence, R.I. They came bundled on a palet and after getting them home last night, I only had the energy to open one up. Tonight, I opened the second box.

Both look to be just fine and their oiled walnut veneers are in very good to excellent shape with only a few battle scars after 27 years of use. Both serial numbers check out--"3 M 988 and 3 M 989" as per the sticker on the back and the embossment on the top rear plank. I opened both up and found that all drivers and Xovers are intact as per the description and per the photos.

The tweeters are K-77s with serial numbers of 20263 and 21763. The end cap is all metal. The midrange horns are some sort of cast black metal with driver K-55 Vs and serial numbers of 21762 and 21763. Again, metal endcaps. The woofers have bronze colored metal baskets and big square magnets. The model is

K-33 P and the serial numbers are 20259 and 20263 with white printing on the squares themselves of 5815109 for both and then after that, 137 7210 and 137 7474. There is no indication of who made these drivers.

I put a meter on the jacks on the back and get readings of a stable 4.0 ohms +/- a bit for #988 and a fluctuation of 4.0-8.0 ohms on #989. Kind of odd. Both Xovers are TYPE B with the metal plate nailed to the side of the mounting plank. All padding is pristine and all wires are white jacketed stuff of unknown composition. They all look 'as new.'

These Cornwalls have the Mids and Tweeters vertically mounted near an upper corner with the woofers offset in the opposite lower corner. How should I orientate these? Horns on the inside/woofers facing outward, or vise versa? I'm not too sure. Both speakers have DUAL ports, not the triples. Their speaker terms are screws, just big enough for 18ga. Zip Cord or smallish spades. I have yet to hook them up as they really, really big Mother-#######!!!

The grills look near impossible to remove, but are in excellent shape. Someone who saw the original ad on EBAY stated that they might be replacements, but honestly, I don't see how someone would replace these without doing a major demo job.

I'm off of work Thursday and will rearrange the room and give them a listen.

Any comments will be welcome and thanks,

Chris

------------------

2 Channel #1:

Dynaudio Contour 3.0s

in black ash veneer.

Cary SLAM 100 monoblocs set to 95w Triode.

Blue Circle Galatea tube preamp.

Sony SCD-1 SACD player and ART DI/O DAC.

Kuzma Stabi w/external

PSU, Stogi Reference arm, Lyra Lydian B MC (.4mV) cart, SF Phono 1 SE tube stage.

PP300 and Chang CLS 9600 ac conditioners.

Stealth PGS ICs, Audio Note AN-VZ silver ICs, Vampire Wire ST-III copper spkr. cables and Shunyata Black Mamba & NBS AC III/Serpent II ac cords.

2 Channel #2

Wright Mono 8 300B monoblocs.

Doc Bottlehead's full blown Foreplay tube preamp.

Alesis Masterlink 9600 4.3g HD CD burner w/Dodson 217 mkII 'D v.1' DAC.

1974 Cornwall w/vertically arranged Alnico magnet drivers.

Italian ESB 7/08 3-way floor standers w/1" silk dome tweeters, 2" silk dome Mids and 10" woofers.

Restored Dynaco FM-1 w/stereo board tube tuner

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Some nice gear. The verticle drivers are actually a plus as they have better sound dispersion qualities than the horizontal drivers; in other words, so you lucked out.

Will be very interested in your impression of your Cornwalls since you have single ended and PP tubes. Dont do any mods until you get very aquainted with these beasts. Rest assured, the presentation will be very different than what you are used to.

What are you music preferences?

kh

f>s>

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s y s t e m

Linn LP-12/Linn Basic Plus/Sumiko Blue Point

Rega Planet

Cary Audio SLP-70 w/Phono Modified

Creek OBH-12 Passive Preamp

Welborne Labs 2A3 Moondog Monoblocks

DIYCable Wire - Various

1977 Klipsch Cornwall I

Alternate Components:

EICO HF-81 - btw, perfect Cornwall match

ASUSA A-4 EL-34 UL

ProAc Mini-Towers

EICO HFT-90 Tube FM Tuner

Sumo Aurora Tuner

Nakamichi CR-7af>s>

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Just hopped on your Asylum page and saw some of your taste. Lordy, we have a lot of the same type equipment. I had a NAK RX-505 as well - but after problems with the unique tape side switching mechanism, abandoned it in favor of my faithful NAK CR-7a. I've had more Nakamichi tape decks over the years than brain cells. I rarely use them now.

Love my little EICO FM tuner - what great sound - something magical about old vintage FM tube gear.

Will be very interested in your reaction to the Cornwalls with your Indie stuff. I have to tell you, some of it is now rendered unlistenable depending on the instruments. Just powerer through My Bloody Valentine's Isn't Anything on vinyl this eve and the sound at high volume via the 2A3 Moondogs was pretty much close to intolerable. Yet Guided by Voicesand Robert Pollard sound damn good on LP depending. In essence, some stuff will work, some will not. The PP tubes seem to help with the Indie patrol.

Electronic stuff on vinyl such as ISAN, Godspeed You Black Emporer, etc can sound very good via PP or SET.

Do yourself a BIG favor and get Kings of Convenience "Quiet is the new Loud" on vinyl. This is just about as good as it gets with tubes and Cornwalls as these tracks were recorded on a Studer 24 track all analog with an obsolutely first rate pressing to vinyl.

Of course, acoustic, combo jazz is literally top notch via vinyl -> tubes -> Cornwalls. Rollins, Coltrane, Davis, Ornette Coleman, Dolphy, Pepper, Bill Evans, Mingus, and the great female vocalists will simply make you swoon. The guys on here that hook up their solid state AV receivers and integrateds have NO IDEA what they are missing!

Let me know what you find.

kh

f>s>

This message has been edited by mobile homeless on 11-07-2001 at 03:53 AM

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Chris,

With speakers standing vertically, the horns should be positioned to the outside right and left when facing your speakers. Toe in each if you feel the need, as their vertical horns are going to naturally give you a much wider dispersion. The back of the cabinets may also contain arrows that show the correct orientation for the speakers when placed horizontally or vertically.

BTW - Caution! Your grills can't be removed from the front. They can only be removed from the inside, which involves removing all their components. That PWK emblem is not available from Klipsch.

Wes

------------------

"KLIPSCH IS MUSIC"f>

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Chris,

This is off-topic but I see you have the Doc Bottlehead Foreplay preamp. I am currently putting together another system (2 channel only) in my bedroom which will consist of a 1978 Yamaha M-4 amp (SS), POS Teac CD player, Dual CS-721 turntable and a pair of 1976 Heresy's. Just recently my C-4 preamp died and I was thinking that I would like to go tubes with this system. I can't afford the tube amps just yet but was thinking on starting with the preamp.

I have been to Doc's webpage and done some reading on this preamp and it sounds as if this might be the preamp I want to start with. I know very little about electronics but have used a soldering iron before. Can you tell me your impressions of this preamp (putting together, Anticipation and SW upgrades, sound, etc.) and whether you think it will work with my system? I would also like to know which tubes you are using and if you have made any other tweaks to it (caps, etc).

Thanks a lot and looking forward to hearing about what you think of your Cornwalls...

Mike

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Thanks Malcolm,

I guess as long as the cones/baskets/magnets are intact and working (and they are since I hooked them up at 3am Wednesday) I shouldn't be too concerned. I just haven't read anything here about the 33-P woofer? Bs, Es, etc., but nothing on the 33-P. I do get a slight hum out of the horns at idle, but with their efficiency, it probably should be expected and I don't hear it once the volume is turned up. My Foreplay preamp has about 8v of gain, so things are running hot.

Kelly: Right now I'm running the Belles 150a Hot Rod 100wpc SS amp as I misinserted a 300B and popped some caps on one of the Mono 8s. The amp is at George's place right now being fixed and I'll install it as soon as it returns. Also, I bought my Nak new during the summer of '85, when I put my first Hi Fi system together. I just sold the Hafler kits I built and I was using the Italian ESB 7/08s as late as yesterday and they still look/sound nice for domes after 16+ years, but at 87db and 6 ohms, not a great match for 300Bs--hence the Cornwalls.

I did get lucky as Mark's ad had a BUY IT NOW option and had been sitting there for two days w/o a single bid. You bought Robert Greene's speakers in Asheville? If so, I was in contact with him for a few days, but I didn't want something in black. My Dyns are black. They sounded like a nice example from what he wrote.

Wes: I see the arrows, but thought that was just a shipping issue. I have the speakers in a small room and fairly close together (only 5' apart center to center) and the horns on the inside. I sit maybe 7' away and I'm pretty much on axis with the horns. I might flip them after a few days of listening, but my room is far from ideal and these speakers are massively present, both physically and sonically. Not the greatest match, but I'll not be here too much longer.

Mike: I bought my Foreplay from a fellow Asylum moderator, Mr. Pig. He bought one along with a friend who assembled them both. Actually a very nice job using pure copper magnet wire ($2/ft) and with all the upgrades. The C-4 boards, better volume pots, yadda yadda yadda. He recently bought an Art Audio Diavalo SET tube amp and the Foreplay, with its 7-8v of gain (quite high) was just too much for the AA's .33v INPUT sensitivity. He couldn't keep the volume down low enough. I have this issue to a degree, as the volume pots are stepped and somewhat coarse. So far, the sound is lovely and I'm happy I bought her. I paid him $420 shipped as a reference and the thing was put together during the summer, so it's fairly new. It is one of the most 'ugly' pieces of gear that I've owned, so don't expect much (and he spruced this one up if you can believe it.) Currently I'm running the 5814A tubes, which are a variation (along with the 6955) of the 12AU7 9 pin dual triode. I'm somewhat of a tube collector and while the Foreplay is my first piece that uses the 12au7, I do have a few flavors to play with once I've stabilized everything.

For an inexpensive preamp, this one is just what I was looking for. We'll see how it mates with the Mono 8s when the repaired one arrives next week.

Well I hope I addressed everyone here. Email me with any other questions if you want.

Thanks, Chris

------------------

2 Channel #1:

Dynaudio Contour 3.0s

in black ash veneer.

Cary SLAM 100 monoblocs set to 95w Triode.

Blue Circle Galatea tube preamp.

Sony SCD-1 SACD player and ART DI/O DAC.

Kuzma Stabi w/external

PSU, Stogi Reference arm, Lyra Lydian B MC (.4mV) cart, SF Phono 1 SE tube stage.

PP300 and Chang CLS 9600 ac conditioners.

Stealth PGS ICs, Audio Note AN-VZ silver ICs, Vampire Wire ST-III copper spkr. cables and Shunyata Black Mamba & NBS AC III/Serpent II ac cords.

2 Channel #2

Wright Mono 8 300B monoblocs.

Doc Bottlehead's full blown Foreplay tube preamp.

Alesis Masterlink 9600 4.3g HD CD burner w/Dodson 217 mkII 'D v.1' DAC.

1974 Cornwall w/vertically arranged Alnico magnet drivers.

Italian ESB 7/08 3-way floor standers w/1" silk dome tweeters, 2" silk dome Mids and 10" woofers.

Restored Dynaco FM-1 w/stereo board tube tuner

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aes-3.jpg

Hi, Mike.... Saw you questions about preamps in the $400 range. That is a tough range to inhabit. The Bottlehead Foreplay is a very popular choice, however. If you want something else to consider, give the little Audio Electronic Supply (division of Cary Audio) AE-3 a look as it is available used for under $400 every now and again on AudiogoN. One just sold there last week as a matter of fact. I happen to like the 6SN7 tube in preamps (can be traded with good 5692 as well for better results depending). Here are the comments from AES:

The AE-3 is a single-ended, R-C coupled, Class A, triode, voltage amplifier coupled to a low impedance, single stage buffer.

The AE-3 has three line level input jacks on the rear apron. From the jack, the signal is routed to a silver plated selector switch on the front panel. The wiring used is all Teflon® coated silver twisted pairs. After the switch, the signal is routed to a dual 100K potentiometer. This is the volume control. Once the audio signal level is set by the volume control, it is directly coupled to one of the grids in the dual section triode 6SN7 tube.

The power supply is very special in the AE-3. The power transformer is wax impregnated in a steel enclosure on the top side of the chassis. The power transformer used is rated at 400% continuous commercial duty cycle for this preamp application. The B+ supply is a center tap full wave DC supply feeding a Pi network supply with filter choke smoothing. The filaments of the two 6SN7 gain tubes are regulated DC for a quiet, hum-free operation. The filter caps used in the AE-3 are film and foil and aluminum electrolytic. All resistors are 1% metal film.

This preamp can also be modified with different caps, wire, volume etc. It is quite attractive as well and would be a fine introduction to tubes for the preamp.

http://www.audioelectronicsupply.com/products/AEHTML/kits/ae_3kit.html

kh

f>s>
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I will say this, the Bottlehead people are VERY nice in the forum and love to help. I have done web work for Doc B and did the MagneQuest site as well. All of the Bottlehead amps use MagneQuest transformers. That being said, the owners of the Foreplay are a TIGHT group... In other words, you dont hear too much negative about ye olde Foreplay with that group! Believe me, it's NOT the perfect preamp by any means but it is a great deal for the money. Just dont let all you read go to your head...heh. I love ole Doc and company but lordy...

kh

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Yea, I hear you. There must of been 4 or 5 guys that traded in their AE-3 for the Foreplay. Smile.gif I take everything with a grain of salt. The thing to keep in mind is this is my 2nd system and it's mainly for Sunday morning and late evening play, at mild volume. I'm not out to set the world on fire with it and feel both of these preamps would be sufficient. I see an AE-3 on Audiogon right now for $300 and there was a modified Foreplay that just sold for $250. I might ask the guy some questions...

Thanks again,

Mike

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Either way, it is good to get a nice tube preamp as it will make a nice change to your presentation. You wont believe the difference it will make between that and your Yamaha. Also, I just heard the little Wright Sound WLA12A preamp which is all tube with tube rectification. We listened to this little fiend go up against Joule Electra's best preamp at over 5k. I could not believe how well it did! I mean, it had the Hovlands in it and some NOS 6SN7, but it was really nice sounding, and all for only 800$ delivered to your doorstep. I was really surprised by how well it did. A great deal in my mind and with something like 60s Sylvania 5692 would really smoke some higher priced competition. Good luck with your search. I have a Cary SLP-70 preamp that does very well but it's been modified all over.

Christ, how would you compare the performance of your Belles 150 Hot Rod against the Cary SLAM 100? Never heard that amp and wondering about its sonics. See it's gotten some good reviews all around. Have not had any solid state on my Cornwalls....

kh

f>s>
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Well, the Belles has a nice warm tone to it, but I've really only had the Hafler DH 220 and then not in this same system. I've had lots of experience with a McCormack DNA 1 and then this same amp with Revision A mods done by S.M. Speakers were Maggie 1.6QR and Innersound EROS. Other gear was SFCD-1, Sony 777, Accuphase DP-65, Kora Eclipse preamp and in different rooms at a friend's place. This was a nice amp that tended to be on the warmer side of neutral and lacked any tizzyness in the upper freqs, but it might be overkill for the Cornwalls. Just right for the demanding planars.

I keep the Belles as a back up and I'd probably say that compared to the SLAMs running in Triode, it has better control of the Contour's bottom end--good for my electronic/reggae collection. However, the midrange is a bit lean and the trebles maybe not quite as smooth as the Cary amps.

Well, getting back to the CWs, I could hear a bit of a buzz in one tweeter, so being the jerk that I am, I decided to pull off the end cap and it looks like the diaphram came with it, yanking off the hair thin wires going to the outer terms. Bummer. I called Klipsch but they had left for the day. Looks like I'll be sending her off for a quick repair job and hopefully, I'll get it back when the tube amp returns next week.

Sometimes I just don't leave well enough alone. I tried to solder it, but I'm not that good.

Chris

------------------

2 Channel #1:

Dynaudio Contour 3.0s

in black ash veneer.

Cary SLAM 100 monoblocs set to 95w Triode.

Blue Circle Galatea tube preamp.

Sony SCD-1 SACD player and ART DI/O DAC.

Kuzma Stabi w/external

PSU, Stogi Reference arm, Lyra Lydian B MC (.4mV) cart, SF Phono 1 SE tube stage.

PP300 and Chang CLS 9600 ac conditioners.

Stealth PGS ICs, Audio Note AN-VZ silver ICs, Vampire Wire ST-III copper spkr. cables and Shunyata Black Mamba & NBS AC III/Serpent II ac cords.

2 Channel #2

Wright Mono 8 300B monoblocs.

Doc Bottlehead's full blown Foreplay tube preamp.

Alesis Masterlink 9600 4.3g HD CD burner w/Dodson 217 mkII 'D v.1' DAC.

1974 Cornwall w/vertically arranged Alnico magnet drivers.

Italian ESB 7/08 3-way floor standers w/1" silk dome tweeters, 2" silk dome Mids and 10" woofers.

Restored Dynaco FM-1 w/stereo board tube tuner

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mobile - Thanks for the info on the preamps. Unfortunately, $800 is more than I can spend on this but it sure sounds like a great preamp. I'm almost certain that I will be going with the Foreplay or the AE-3. The guy selling the AE-3 on AudiogoN won't budge from his price of $300 so if I want it, I will have to act fast.

Chris - Sorry to hear about the Cornwall. Did you remove the magnet portion of the tweeter and the diaphram went with it?

Mike

------------------

My Music Systems

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From one Chris to another ... congrats on the CW's ... I have a pair like yours and love them. Had a pair of 1985's which were great, but I like the imaging of the vertical horns better.

You basically trashed the diaphragm opening it up. Not to fear, it can be easily replaced. Klipsch will sell you a replacement for about $70, or you can buy them directly from Electro-Voice for $23 each. They can ship them to you. Go to www.electrovoice.com for contact information. Ask for a T-35 replacement diaphrams. They are easy to replace. Following is a previous post on the procedure:

1) remove tweeter from cabinet

2) remove 4 screws holding magnet

3) carefully separate magnet from horn lens.

4) check the orientation of EVERYTHING, you can use a magic marker to put a dot on each part.

5) desolder the leads going to the old diaph. I heated a straightened paper clip with my soldering iron and ran it thru the voice coil lead holes in the horn lens, to clean them, so the new leads would go in easily.

6) remove old diaphr. Clean the magnet gap with folded masking tape and a business card. The gap must be very clean or else the new diaphragm might buzz. Also make sure you don't move the magnet in the center of the magnet assembly - if it moves, the tweeter is toast. That gap clearance is absolutely critical to proper tweeter function.

7) paper gasket inside must be reused - don't mess it up.

8) reuse papar gasket + place new diaphagm with the voice coil facing towards the magnet (up). The new leads will fit down thru the cleaned out soldering holes in the horn lens. VERY, VERY IMPORTANT! Make sure the voice coil wire which traverses the wraps on the voice coil itself, forming a little bump on the VC, is lined up with the notch in the magnet which gives it the proper clearance and keeps it from rubbing the magnet. The magnet, lens, diaphagm, and paper gasket all must be oriented properly!!! They are usually marked with a little line. Phasing + notch orientation are paramount to success!!! Do one at a time mark and observe everything.

9) place magnet back onto horn lens being very careful not to bend the new voice coil as it fits down over it.

10) replace and tighten 4 screws, gently and alternately tightening each one firmly, but not super tight.

11) solder new voice coil leads + replace tweeter.

12) test

------------------

If you don't like what is coming out, you wouldn't like what is going in." -PWK-

---------------------

Klipsch 1968 ALK Cornwall "II"s (LF/RF)

ALK Belle Klipsch (Center)

Klipsch Heresy (RR/LR)

Klipsch KSW-12 sub

Sonic Frontiers Anthem AMP1 (driving Cornwalls)

Sonic Frontiers Anthem AMP1 (driving Heresy's)

Denon AVR-4800

Toshiba SD-3109 DVD

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Chris, BTW, forgot to ask what you paid for them? Just curious.

I paid $1K for mine (a DEAL) and he sold a previous pair back in June for about $1050.

Also, I've met Mark "Soundbug1" ... a really nice, knowledgeable guy.

------------------

If you don't like what is coming out, you wouldn't like what is going in." -PWK-

---------------------

Klipsch 1968 ALK Cornwall "II"s (LF/RF)

ALK Belle Klipsch (Center)

Klipsch Heresy (RR/LR)

Klipsch KSW-12 sub

Sonic Frontiers Anthem AMP1 (driving Cornwalls)

Sonic Frontiers Anthem AMP1 (driving Heresy's)

Denon AVR-4800

Toshiba SD-3109 DVD

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Hello Chris,

I did the BUY IT NOW option at EBAY and didn't bid on these. The price was $1150. I then paid $290 to cover PAYPAL and Packing/Shipping through local packers and then via Yellow Feight. The boxes that were fabricated are truly exceptional and the speakers arrived in five days unmolested. So $1440 out the door and needing to add the tweeter repair. Still competitive with other newer speakers. They sounded quite nice for the first seven hours of listening and I had the horns inwards. I was moving them around when I decided to kill the tweeter.

I tried to solder the shortest of the two hair thin wires, but started charing the cardboard gasket tabs at 12:00/6:00 positions. I called and talked to a lovely lady at EV today who told me to send them in (I'm going to send the good one as well, to match them up) and they'd take care of it as long as I had that cardboard 'gasket.' That seems to be the lynch-pin, w/o it, one is screwed.

She also gave me the name of the local EV repair guy here in Miami and I spoke to him today. He has some parts but isn't too organized and he wants me to bring it in so he can have a look. I may pull the other one and head over there in a few minutes just to see. But my head is telling me to just send it to EV and have them fix them--I mean, they did make the damn thing after all.

I'm still kicking myself and even though there was a definite buzz in that tweeter and not the other, it could have been a grounding issue (probably not) and/or the CAPs or Xover components. Either way, it wasn't terribly offensive and I probably should have left well enough alone. Generally, though, it's in my nature to take things apart and a fair amount of times, I have parts leftover, LOL!

Chris

------------------

2 Channel #1:

Dynaudio Contour 3.0s

in black ash veneer.

Cary SLAM 100 monoblocs set to 95w Triode.

Blue Circle Galatea tube preamp.

Sony SCD-1 SACD player and ART DI/O DAC.

Kuzma Stabi w/external

PSU, Stogi Reference arm, Lyra Lydian B MC (.4mV) cart, SF Phono 1 SE tube stage.

PP300 and Chang CLS 9600 ac conditioners.

Stealth PGS ICs, Audio Note AN-VZ silver ICs, Vampire Wire ST-III copper spkr. cables and Shunyata Black Mamba & NBS AC III/Serpent II ac cords.

2 Channel #2

Wright Mono 8 300B monoblocs.

Doc Bottlehead's full blown Foreplay tube preamp.

Alesis Masterlink 9600 4.3g HD CD burner w/Dodson 217 mkII 'D v.1' DAC.

1974 Cornwall w/vertically arranged Alnico magnet drivers.

Italian ESB 7/08 3-way floor standers w/1" silk dome tweeters, 2" silk dome Mids and 10" woofers.

Restored Dynaco FM-1 w/stereo board tube tuner

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